USA people have crap holidays from work

[Foppo]

Not sure, in Europe is it the German worker who has the most holidays in a year?

[skyrover]

mph1977 said:

unrepentant said:

<snip> Because of the labor laws here it's also much easier to hire people and much easier to be entrepreneurial. European labour laws stifle business.

hiring isn't the problem is it ? really ? it;s firing that's the 'problem' unless you are SrAlan

as for stifling business - is it such as 'stifling' regime that you actually have to have evidence that someone should be dismissed ? ( and remember it's very easy in the first year / two years as it stands).

Why would an employer want to get rid of someone unless they were crap?

You have to try an fill that role, possibly retrain someone else, sort the paperwork. It's a headache.

[BGARK]

Hoofy said:

I understand US employees don't get the same protection UK employees do. If they don't like you, they just let you go.

Exactly how it should be here!

[djc206]

BGARK said:

Exactly how it should be here!

Not quite. The ability to get rid of someone who is crap at their job is great. The ability for a boss to get rid of someone because they're a bully or because of some personal vendetta is not. The ability to mask redundancy is also not good. Our labour laws are far from perfect but they protect us as workers from unscrupulous employers, if that means that every office has an idiot to tolerate so be it.

[BGARK]

djc206 said:

Not quite. The ability to get rid of someone who is crap at their job is great. The ability for a boss to get rid of someone because they're a bully or because of some personal vendetta is not. The ability to mask redundancy is also not good. Our labour laws are far from perfect but they protect us as workers from unscrupulous employers, if that means that every office has an idiot to tolerate so be it.

Do you run a business?

[MrBrightSi]

BGARK said:

djc206 said:

Not quite. The ability to get rid of someone who is crap at their job is great. The ability for a boss to get rid of someone because they're a bully or because of some personal vendetta is not. The ability to mask redundancy is also not good. Our labour laws are far from perfect but they protect us as workers from unscrupulous employers, if that means that every office has an idiot to tolerate so be it.

Do you run a business?

Where is that meant to lead?

All i can see in the post is about protecting workers from personal vendettas and any bullst reason that isn't related to performance/lack of.

Trying to argue that running a business means you are now head of state in some dictatorship is a bit silly. All gaffers should lead by example, holding petty grudges and being general nobs inspires no one.

[mph1977]

djc206 said:

BGARK said:

Exactly how it should be here!

Not quite. The ability to get rid of someone who is crap at their job is great. The ability for a boss to get rid of someone because they're a bully or because of some personal vendetta is not. The ability to mask redundancy is also not good. Our labour laws are far from perfect but they protect us as workers from unscrupulous employers, if that means that every office has an idiot to tolerate so be it.

If you are crap at your job and have been 'retrained' properly etc at least once , it's not beyond any decent manager to have them down the road in a couple of weeks , if they haven't been retrained you might have to make that figure a couple of months to at least go through the motions of of proper capability process,

if you are dangerous, wilfully crap or malicious you can be out the door the moment it's spotted and down the road within a week or two.

If you are criminal you can be out the door the moment it's spotted and depending what it is down the road the moment you are charged - in care settings you could be dismissed when the Safeguarding team (LA/Police) apply for a temporary barring order)

[krallicious]

Foppo said:

Not sure, in Europe is it the German worker who has the most holidays in a year?

The minimum holiday allowance is 20 days if working a 5 day week plus Bank holidays of which vary from state to state. Anywhere between 9 and around 15 I think.

Having said that, any employer offering just 20 days is quite a rarity in my experience with the norm being around 26. When adding in overtime (if allowed) then your holiday allowance can grow very quickly.

[paranoid airbag]

skyrover said:

Why would an employer want to get rid of someone unless they were crap?

You have to try an fill that role, possibly retrain someone else, sort the paperwork. It's a headache.

Um, really?

The paperwork (and indeed training) is usually done by someone else. I've indirectly known plenty of middle managers fire employees for very petty and corrupt reasons, including refusal to do out-of-work favours, showing the manager up, plain old racism/sexism/etc. They often have very little to lose from making terrible personnel decisions.

I would have thought a reasonably (but not insanely) generous holiday allowance is a fair way to allow workers to manage their work-life balance though. There's little point in decent jobs having someone there who would rather be on holiday, they'll be distracted and useless, but those who want to put in the extra mile can.

Edited by paranoid airbag on Saturday 29th November 18:52

[anonymous-user]

31 + can buy up to 10 more

[Otispunkmeyer]

My place is closed for 4 days over Christmas... However I must take those days off as holiday. I don't really get that. I think we have 25 days plus bank holiday. But when the business is shut and you basically have no choice about whether you come into work or not, you have to use up 4 days. Doesn't really seem legit to me, but guess it's allowable, just seems a bit of a con. I only just found this out last week as well. I did wonder why in the interview I was told 20 days holidaying then later told 25.... It's 20 you can chose yourself,

[heebeegeetee]

BGARK said:

Hoofy said:

I understand US employees don't get the same protection UK employees do. If they don't like you, they just let you go.

Exactly how it should be here!

And perhaps we should get rid of consumer protection laws as well. After all, why buy crap, and if you do buy crap you can always buy something else.

[Kinky]

Otispunkmeyer said:

My place is closed for 4 days over Christmas... However I must take those days off as holiday. I don't really get that. I think we have 25 days plus bank holiday. But when the business is shut and you basically have no choice about whether you come into work or not, you have to use up 4 days. Doesn't really seem legit to me, but guess it's allowable, just seems a bit of a con. I only just found this out last week as well. I did wonder why in the interview I was told 20 days holidaying then later told 25.... It's 20 you can chose yourself,

Same in my place. Usually it's 3 days, but because of when Christmas/new year fall this year, it's 4 days.

[anonymous-user]

wolves_wanderer said:

Crossflow Kid said:

Why can't you just squeeze your seasonal gift purchases around a normal working life like the rest of the known universe?

Why do you care?

Why do you care why I care?

[anonymous-user]

CB2152 said:

Crossflow Kid said:

Bree said:

Crossflow Kid said:

Bree said:

1 personal day (traditionally for Xmas shopping).

Wot?

It's a paid days leave in addition to our holiday entitlement. We used to have to take it in December as it was designed to give us time to go Xmas shopping (I work in retail, so no hols in December), but we can take it at any time through the year now.

Why can't you just squeeze your seasonal gift purchases around a normal working life like the rest of the known universe?

Doesn't necessarily have to be gifts. Some things have to be bought closer to Christmas, and with no holiday, and likely more hours being worked in December (so that the rest of the known universe can do their seasonal gift purchases) it can be a royal pain in the jacksie going Christmas shopping when you work in retail.

You're suggesting retail works 18 hour days, every day, from Dec 1st to the 24th?

[djc206]

mph1977 said:

If you are crap at your job and have been 'retrained' properly etc at least once , it's not beyond any decent manager to have them down the road in a couple of weeks , if they haven't been retrained you might have to make that figure a couple of months to at least go through the motions of of proper capability process,

if you are dangerous, wilfully crap or malicious you can be out the door the moment it's spotted and down the road within a week or two.

If you are criminal you can be out the door the moment it's spotted and depending what it is down the road the moment you are charged - in care settings you could be dismissed when the Safeguarding team (LA/Police) apply for a temporary barring order)

Precisely so our laws work well then when things are done properly they protect the employee without burdening the employer too much. That said we've all worked with a lazy or incompetent person who somehow kept their job

[djc206]

BGARK said:

djc206 said:

Not quite. The ability to get rid of someone who is crap at their job is great. The ability for a boss to get rid of someone because they're a bully or because of some personal vendetta is not. The ability to mask redundancy is also not good. Our labour laws are far from perfect but they protect us as workers from unscrupulous employers, if that means that every office has an idiot to tolerate so be it.

Do you run a business?

No but I see where this is going so I'll save you the bother of replying by repeating this from my original post "our labour laws are far from perfect"

[anonymous-user]

Thankyou4calling said:

NinjaPower said:

I believe so.

All they have to say to you is "Sorry, it isn't working out" and you are out that very day.

Where do you get that info from please?

From watching American television

[ADM06]

Does she have less money stolen from her in tax though?

I'd prefer more money, less holiday. I often find myself with loads left at the end of the year and voluntarily work overtime most weekends.

[CB2152]

Crossflow Kid said:

CB2152 said:

Crossflow Kid said:

Bree said:

Crossflow Kid said:

Bree said:

1 personal day (traditionally for Xmas shopping).

Wot?

It's a paid days leave in addition to our holiday entitlement. We used to have to take it in December as it was designed to give us time to go Xmas shopping (I work in retail, so no hols in December), but we can take it at any time through the year now.

Why can't you just squeeze your seasonal gift purchases around a normal working life like the rest of the known universe?

Doesn't necessarily have to be gifts. Some things have to be bought closer to Christmas, and with no holiday, and likely more hours being worked in December (so that the rest of the known universe can do their seasonal gift purchases) it can be a royal pain in the jacksie going Christmas shopping when you work in retail.

You're suggesting retail works 18 hour days, every day, from Dec 1st to the 24th?

I'm not saying it's impossible to go shopping, and certainly 12 hour days aren't unheard of, which if you do 08:00 to 20:00 means a lot of places will be shutting by the time you get there. I do know of a few people who have worked every day in December until the 24th, my dad included, when he worked in retail.

My "personal day" can be taken in the month of either December or January, and while I never had it explained to me, I always got the impression it was an extra day off around Christmas to see family, or just rest, considering how non-stop it gets. Fortunately I have a day off coming up, and I fear I will have to brave the shops