Climate change - the POLITICAL debate. Vol 3

[turbobloke]

TheExcession said:

turbobloke said:

Blind faith.

"Now you made your Babylon, what next?
should only take you 7 days to fix the mess
you don't care.."

Maybe young Obama will have that playing through his earphones when he teams up with his new chum Bear Grylls to tape an episode of Running Wild "to observe the effects of climate change on the area (Alaska)".

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-34109681

[TheExcession]

turbobloke said:

Maybe young Obama will have that playing through his earphones when he teams up with his new chum Bear Grylls

Beat you by about 4 hrs



There's another note here too

[Blib]

TheExcession said:

Beat you by about 4 hrs



There's another note here too

Fascinating insight from a mod. And, the suggestion to Ahimoth made me smile.

[Mr GrimNasty]

I've never watched that survival bloke, except the other day I caught a bit where he spent half a day pointlessly making a bamboo ladder to cross a trickle of water but smashed it to smithereens trying to drop it into position, then decided it was late and time to bed down for the night! I had the feeling he couldn't survive a trip to a coffee shop.

Here's hoping they get a Biblical snowstorm and he has to use his so called skills to save the president.

[turbobloke]

TheExcession said:

turbobloke said:

Maybe young Obama will have that playing through his earphones when he teams up with his new chum Bear Grylls

Beat you by about 4 hrs

Oops.

Chalk that up as a pint I owe you

[LongQ]

TheExcession said:

indeed.

As regards 'Cui Bono' for a moment there I thought 'you too' were announcing an aged 1980s band to sing on stage but happily NO.

I think the answer is 'Ego'


As regards our friend 'Ahimoth', the biblical references are a bit too much to bear, I seriously doubt we'll ever see him again in this thread. (I'm still waiting to know how old he/she is).

There is a rumour abroad that Methuselah's mobile network and Broadband Service has an outage in progress.

However one of the more interesting aspects the Climate Change era seems to be that all the major religions and faith based philosophies are keen to proclaim a belief in CC.

Perhaps, even if only for a short period, we might see faith based organizations joined as one in some sort of agreement with each other.

Obviously there are likely to be a few exceptions - there always are. But it would be interesting to see how a "One God" agreement might be agreed, if it could be agreed, based on a renamed Gaia concept.

[deeps]

PRTVR said:

Its interesting dealing with strong believers of MMGW, as we see on here from time to time,
I have a good friend who holds such views, he is intelligent along with being practical and logical, but every time we get into a discussion about climate change the logic part disappears, I am sure he understands what I am saying but its as he doesn't want to believe that what I am saying could be true, its almost as if it is some kind of crusade, we can save the world, who would not want to save the world? why do you not want to save the world? appears to be his thoughts, this appears to override his normal logic.

Do we need a psychological climate change thread ?

I had a similar friend, but he's starting to see the light, he's a keen gardener and apparently this years crops were very poor due to it being so cold at night, 1c was recorded in southern England in July, plus generally bloody cold every month.

It's understandable why gullible types will believe though, when you look at the nonsense presented as fact by the BBC on a daily basis, a bombardment of ordinary weather events presented as extraordinary, unprecedented climate change, hottest day on record, greatest flood on record etc.

I remember back in July when the Heathrow weather station reportedly pipped a new high, the BBC weather presenter the following day frothing at the mouth "well who could deny global warming now?"

I suppose I find it fascinating to watch in a masochistic sense, the way MMGWT (now mislabled simply CC) can be powerfully presented as a fact that everyone believes, yet away from the media and back in the real world the actual opposite is true, most people do not believe. The indoctrination process is powerful, painful and persistent, but still fails. I wonder how far they think they can continue pushing water up hill!

Edited by deeps on Wednesday 2nd September 04:12

[turbobloke]

deeps said:

I remember back in July when the Heathrow weather station reportedly pipped a new high, the BBC weather presenter the following day frothing at the mouth "well who could deny global warming now?"

A single short spike in T on one day at one site and belief is affirmed! It's a miracle!

The person(s) who put the new sensor array where it could be jetwashed did a good job in one sense even though it was plane stupid.

Faith was once seen as strong enough to move mountains, nowadays it's strong enough to make people forget about causality - if they were ever aware of it.

[The Don of Croy]

deeps said:

...I suppose I find it fascinating to watch in a masochistic sense, the way MMGWT (now mislabled simply CC) can be powerfully presented as a fact that everyone believes, yet away from the media and back in the real world the actual opposite is true, most people do not believe. The indoctrination process is powerful, painful and persistent, but still fails. I wonder how far they think they can continue pushing water up hill! ...

I see a parallel with the recent General Election in the UK - large parts of the omnipresent media seemed to present a Miliband/Sturgeon outcome as the most likely, only to be sadly mislead by a lying populace who inexplicably voted in the Bullingdon toffs.

A week or so back there was a BBC nature prog from the Pacific, educating us to the 'unprecedented' warm area lying off America's west coast - the warmest it's been since records began (and when did records begin?). Just another drip-feed to keep us all on message.

The great unwashed, however, have a nasty habit of seeing through BS (but it's by no means guaranteed).

[turbobloke]

Piers is definitely having a punt just as Jeremy is having a joust. Possibly a pearoast but here it is (again):

Piers Corbyn said:

WeatherAction is involved in the Global Warming/Climate Change debate where we point out that the world is now cooling not warming and there is no observational evidence in the thousands and millions of years of data that changes in CO2 have any observable effect on weather or climate in the real world.

http://www.weatheraction.com/

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/jer...

[LongQ]

Going slightly off topic for a post.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-3219075/...

Medical Science to the fore in the politics of health. This battle ground seems to have become entirely open about being "political" (not the small "p" in order to influence "health" decisions.

So we have scientist who has built a reputation based on being anti-salt and is involved with an organisation that is anti-salt making a claim that salt has an effect on obesity (along with everything else of course).

He may or may not be correct but from the description it seems there was a little lab based science involved (measurement of salt output in urine samples) and a lot of speculation about salt input (self reporting by those tested).

Another academic involved in the same general area of Medical Science describes the conclusion as "no way to be confident in this assertion" and observes ".... the combination of a weak study design and lack of any strong mechanistic basis for the association."

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-3219075/...

The Food and Drink Industry spokesperson does what a PR person does and waffles non-antagonistically about the huge steps the industry has taken to make people healthy - akin to the "better safe than sorry " argument so popular these days.

It's all such familiar ground and far more politically orientated than scientifically sound.

[Mr GrimNasty]

turbobloke said:

A single short spike in T on one day at one site and belief is affirmed! It's a miracle!

The person(s) who put the new sensor array where it could be jetwashed did a good job in one sense even though it was plane stupid.

Faith was once seen as strong enough to move mountains, nowadays it's strong enough to make people forget about causality - if they were ever aware of it.

Funny how one blatantly rogue reading turns the 176th warmest summer on record into '2015 a year of record heat' isn't it!

Do you see my God now, do you?

https://stevengoddard.wordpress.com/2015/09/02/hot...

[LongQ]

President Obama reportedly calls for more Ice Breakers to be built urgently for use in the Arctic.

Fast Tracking required, no less.

Are they going to be needed to deliver the palm trees required as the ice melts and the shore lines of Alaska and Northern Canada turn into beach resorts?

It's Obama so it's definitely Political content in this post.

http://ottawacitizen.com/news/national/defence-wat...

[turbobloke]

Obama can't possibly understand irony.

On top of not understanding causality.

[Blib]

What, what, WHAT?????

Shirley, the Arctic is soon to be ice-free?

[hidetheelephants]

LongQ said:

President Obama reportedly calls for more Ice Breakers to be built urgently for use in the Arctic.

Fast Tracking required, no less.

Are they going to be needed to deliver the palm trees required as the ice melts and the shore lines of Alaska and Northern Canada turn into beach resorts?

It's Obama so it's definitely Political content in this post.

http://ottawacitizen.com/news/national/defence-wat...

He can call all he likes, it won't do a damn bit of good unless congress increases the USCG budget; they can barely afford to keep the ships they've got at sea never mind build lots of new ones.

[rovermorris999]

Blib said:

What, what, WHAT?????

Shirley, the Arctic is soon to be ice-free?

Ah but it's because of climate change that there'll be more ice. Or less. Article says:
'U.S President Barack Obama has said the U.S. will fast-track construction of new icebreakers. Obama has been highlighting the effects of climate change during his trip to Alaska.'

[turbobloke]

rovermorris999 said:

Blib said:

What, what, WHAT?????

Shirley, the Arctic is soon to be ice-free?

Ah but it's because of climate change that there'll be more ice. Or less. Article says:
'U.S President Barack Obama has said the U.S. will fast-track construction of new icebreakers. Obama has been highlighting the effects of climate change during his trip to Alaska.'

For a taster on how these things work, see below.

hotter = climate change
colder = climate change
stasis = climate change (it's just hidden, you see, or rather you don't)
wetter = climate change
drier = climate change
windy = climate change
calm = climate change
snow = climate change
less ice = climate change
more ice = climate change
polar bears = climate change (anything relating to the man-eaters will do)
earthquakes = climate change
conflict = climate change
migrants = climate change
children upset = climate change
more crime = climate change
less crime = climate change
famine = climate change
eutrophication = climate change

The mystical mythical junkscience religion cannot be falsified, by order of the faithful.

ETA missing links.

Edited by turbobloke on Wednesday 2nd September 21:40

[rovermorris999]

Those hungry bears are causing trouble, all down to global warming of course.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3219727/Be...

[turbobloke]

Number 11 in the list