Another cyclist dies in London

[DJFish]

ZX10R NIN said:

Do you not feel Cyclists especially those commuting into London should undertake some form of training?

As has been said it's not always the Trucks fault & vice versa.

I had the chance to sit in a cab at the recent bike show, it's a real eye opener how little visibility there is in some cases, even though I've driven a (little) lorry I was surprised at how easy it is for a cyclist to disappear, add another 20 or so at a busy junction plus cars, scooters, signs, lights and other distractions, it’s surprising there aren’t more accidents.

Just five minutes in a cab but it’ll certainly change the way I ride my bike.

[walm]

The Vambo said:

All it illuminates is your desperation to cling to any shoddy piece of work that supports your militant, bigoted views.

Thank goodness you have an open mind though.

The Vambo said:

v12Legs said:

Two thirds of lorries defective or illegal

That logical fallacy was written by an moron and posted by someone desperate to believe a moron.

Why not post some data showing cyclists are more at fault then all of us apologists will have to eat humble pie and the road warriors can carry on killing vulnerable road users with a clear conscience?

[hornetrider]

Antony Moxey said:

hornetrider said:

You, sir, are a buffoon.

Obviously. Your efforts in putting me right are most appreciated.

You clearly don't understand why you are being labelled a buffoon, which is fine. I won't waste my time trying to educate you, as others have failed already.

[Devil2575]

walm said:

The Vambo said:

v12Legs said:

Two thirds of lorries defective or illegal

That logical fallacy was written by an moron and posted by someone desperate to believe a moron.

Why not post some data showing cyclists are more at fault then all of us apologists will have to eat humble pie and the road warriors can carry on killing vulnerable road users with a clear conscience?

The head line is a misrepresentation though. Two thirds of lorries that were stopped are defective or illegal

Those three words are very important and could alter the meaning significantly. I very much doubt that the Police were stopping vehicles at random, and even if that was the intention there would likely be an unconcious bias involved anyway.

[walm]

Devil2575 said:

The head line is a misrepresentation though. Two thirds of lorries that were stopped are defective or illegal

Those three words are very important and could alter the meaning significantly. I very much doubt that the Police were stopping vehicles at random, and even if that was the intention there would likely be an unconcious bias involved anyway.

I agree with all that.
But it's hardly the concrete evidence to show that cyclists are more often to blame is it?

Vambo is the pot calling the kettle black.

[toerag]

[/quote]

front & left side parking sensors hooked up to air cannons on the lorry, powerful enough to clear said area.

[The Vambo]

walm said:

The Vambo said:

All it illuminates is your desperation to cling to any shoddy piece of work that supports your militant, bigoted views.

Thank goodness you have an open mind though.

The Vambo said:

v12Legs said:

Two thirds of lorries defective or illegal

That logical fallacy was written by an moron and posted by someone desperate to believe a moron.

Why not post some data showing cyclists are more at fault then all of us apologists will have to eat humble pie and the road warriors can carry on killing vulnerable road users with a clear conscience?

What the hell does the accuracy of that article have to do with the nonsense you are posting?

[The Vambo]

walm said:

Vambo is the pot calling the kettle black.

Maybe you should have a wee look at my previous posts on this thread and see exactly who I think is at fault and how I think the problem can be solved.

Then you can apologise.

[walm]

The Vambo said:

Maybe you should have a wee look at my previous posts on this thread and see exactly who I think is at fault and how I think the problem can be solved.

Then you can apologise.

You stated your "solution" (compulsory training for both HGVs and cyclists, which I am coming around to agreeing with) giving no evidence or argument and then ranted several times about anyone objecting to your views was a militant bigot.
Which, ironically, is exactly what bigots say.
Pot, kettle, black.

[Antony Moxey]

hornetrider said:

Antony Moxey said:

hornetrider said:

You, sir, are a buffoon.

Obviously. Your efforts in putting me right are most appreciated.

You clearly don't understand why you are being labelled a buffoon, which is fine. I won't waste my time trying to educate you, as others have failed already.

So go on then, how were going to educate me and what was it that was getting wrong. Be specific please.

[The Vambo]

walm said:

giving no evidence or argument and then ranted several times about anyone objecting to your views was a militant bigot.

Pot, kettle, black.

Let me just check that I have this right...

I am a militant bigot who thinks the both sides of the argument are at fault and both will have to compromise to fix the problem?

You either don't understand the meaning of many many words in the English language or you have recently been run over by a truck while on your bike and have brain damage.

[rpguk]

‘Cyclist friendly’ trucks unveiled to cut deaths on capital’s roads

Interesting article in the Standard, with the truck above used to illustrate new lorries which are being brought out to combat this problem - I'm sure it's not unique to London.

The local bin lorries switched to the Mercedes type listed above a few years ago and I've seen the same chassis with a flatbed back before too.

Would I be right in saying that Lorry drivers sit high up because they sit on top of the engine so that more length can be given to the load (while remaining under total width restrictions)

[GC8]

I don't think that I've ever seen one bought privately... They're all well and good, but tippers are dual purpose vehicles with a higher ride height, and what I suspect is a real factor (beyond the way that some of the 'muck shifters' are driven), no side protection bars, due to their clearance requirements - making these wholly unsuitable.

This is probably why more tipper type vehicles are involved in fatal accidents, beyond their high presence on the road due to construction within London. Its a lot easier to fall under a tipper than it is many other type of vehicle and their dual purpose role precludes the fitting of guard bars.

Unfortunately a vehicle like that is only likely to be bought by central or local government and it couldn't be adapted for tipping even if there was any will to buy them privately.

[ZX10R NIN]

That truck is not suitable for tipper truck purposes the cab is to low plus the lack of ground clearance would be a major issue.

[GC8]

That really adds to my post.

Tell me more?

[IroningMan]

Why do tippers need to be dual purpose? DROPS systems have been around for decades and it's hardy rocket science to keep sites level - they don't have to be assault courses.

[ZX10R NIN]

IroningMan said:

Why do tippers need to be dual purpose? DROPS systems have been around for decades and it's hardy rocket science to keep sites level - they don't have to be assault courses.

What about when they have to go to quarries, land fill sites etc

[Yabu]

ZX10R NIN said:

Yabu said:

80 deaths, 23,000 accidents involving cyclists in London over 5 years.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-316122...

The numbers are going down only 12 last year on London's Roads, 22 Motorcyclists died on Londons Roads last year to infact more Motorcyclists have died on Londons Roads than Cyclists so I don't get your point.

I wasn't making a point as such, just linking to the article.

[IroningMan]

ZX10R NIN said:

IroningMan said:

Why do tippers need to be dual purpose? DROPS systems have been around for decades and it's hardy rocket science to keep sites level - they don't have to be assault courses.

What about when they have to go to quarries, land fill sites etc

Either the sites should be graded so on-road wagons can cope, or they should dismount the load bed for collection by an off-road wagon.

[ZX10R NIN]

IroningMan said:

Either the sites should be graded so on-road wagons can cope, or they should dismount the load bed for collection by an off-road wagon.

So they have to buy two wagons to do the job of one? Drop bodies last half the life of a tipper body they get battered & abused.