how much has green tokenism cost us so far???

[powerstroke]

Are there any figures to show how much in subsidys have been paid to the wind ,solar and other reinventing the wheel to appease the green lobby industrys in the last 20years ???
What affect has it had on the economy?

Edited by powerstroke on Saturday 31st January 06:42

[speedy_thrills]

powerstroke said:

Are there any figures to show how much in subsidys have been paid to the wind ,solar and other reinventing the wheel to appease the green lobby crap in the last 20years ???

No idea but as a minor shareholder in companies with dams, windmills and geothermal I support green energy subsidies.

[Martin4x4]

[steveatesh]

powerstroke said:

Are there any figures to show how much in subsidys have been paid to the wind ,solar and other reinventing the wheel to appease the green lobby industrys in the last 20years ???
What affect has it had on the economy?

Edited by powerstroke on Saturday 31st January 06:42

One of the places you will get an idea of the scale of cost of green ideology is Dr Norths EU Referendum site. He occasionally raises the whole climate change agenda and in particular the disastrous Climate Change Act.

The figures are eye watering and more than demsonstrates how group think can be remarkably stupid at times.

[Jasandjules]

steveatesh said:

The figures are eye watering and more than demsonstrates how group think can be remarkably stupid at times.

Well, some of those who propagate the myth of AGW directly benefit from it - by sheer coincidence some of them have large interests in companies which provide "green" s***e - you know, like bird and endangered species bat killing windmills and so on..

[anonymous-user]

powerstroke said:

Are there any figures to show how much in subsidys have been paid to the wind ,solar and other reinventing the wheel to appease the green lobby industrys in the last 20years ???
What affect has it had on the economy?

Edited by anonymous-user on Saturday 31st January 06:42

I doubt anyone knows the exact figure, but it is clear that it is huge, and has all been taken from the education budget. So now we have an entire generation unable to write simple sentences without fking up plural endings, spelling and punctuation.

[Piersman2]

Martin4x4 said:

Shouldn't it be at least 37.5% of them are wrong?

[Mobile Chicane]

powerstroke said:

Are there any figures to show how much in subsidys have been paid to the wind ,solar and other reinventing the wheel to appease the green lobby industrys in the last 20years ???
What affect has it had on the economy?

Edited by powerstroke on Saturday 31st January 06:42

The 'cost' of green initiatives goes far beyond the payment of subsidies.

For example, my company has just quoted on a project for a large NHS trust to replace air con units which use a now-banned CFC refridgerant environmentalists accuse of creating a hole in the Earth's ozone layer.

This is money the trust simply doesn't have without making cuts elsewhere. Obviously I can't state the numbers, but these would pay for a fair few nurses, put it that way.

[98elise]

Mobile Chicane said:

powerstroke said:

Are there any figures to show how much in subsidys have been paid to the wind ,solar and other reinventing the wheel to appease the green lobby industrys in the last 20years ???
What affect has it had on the economy?

Edited by powerstroke on Saturday 31st January 06:42

The 'cost' of green initiatives goes far beyond the payment of subsidies.

For example, my company has just quoted on a project for a large NHS trust to replace air con units which use a now-banned CFC refridgerant environmentalists accuse of creating a hole in the Earth's ozone layer.

This is money the trust simply doesn't have without making cuts elsewhere. Obviously I can't state the numbers, but these would pay for a fair few nurses, put it that way.

There is little doubt the banned refridgerants were damaging the ozone, unless you have some empirical evidence otherwise?

I'm sure there were plently of people moaning about banning lead in petrol, however again the is no doubt it was poisoning the atmosphere.

Edited by 98elise on Saturday 31st January 11:02

[Wilmslowboy]

Leading the green bandwagon helped Al Gore raise his personal wealth from about 1.5 million dollars to circa 200 million dollars - Kind of an inconvenient truth

• * For completeness he did make circa 30 million of it from apple shares

[JagLover]

98elise said:

There is little doubt the banned refridgerants were damaging the ozone, unless you have some empirical evidence otherwise?

I'm sure there were plently of people moaning about banning lead in petrol, however again the is no doubt it was poisoning the atmosphere.

Back when the greens were a genuine environmental movement allot of good was achieved.

Now all they are concerned about is destroying the western economy.

[aw51 121565]

98elise said:

I'm sure there were plently of people moaning about banning lead in petrol, however again the is no doubt it was poisoning the atmosphere.

Edited by 98elise on Saturday 31st January 11:02

Off the top of my head (I read Environmental Science in 1988-91), the concentration of Lead in leaded petrol sold in the UK was reduced from 40mg/l to 0.15mg/l in 1984 - a reduction of 62.5%.

Some years later, Lead blood levels in the general population in the UK had dropped by only around 20% on average; back then we got more of our Lead from other sources (generally drinking water - especially in Scotland where the water is more acidic/softer and the pipes and water tanks are often made of Lead - and sometimes also from food if it was grown near a road) than from the atmosphere itself (Lead in leaded petrol was generally deposited post-combustion as Lead Bromide within 200m of the tail pipe it was emitted from).

Leaded petrol poisoning our children... There was much more to it than this sexy headline, as above - but exhaust emissions control technology eventually demanded unleaded petrol anyway.


It's the same with Green Tokenism, as a rule - the actual facts don't generally support the headline and propoganda about how bad things are and are going to be .

[Diderot]

You can add £18bn per year for the next 35 years or so to any of the above figures. The baseline cost of Minigland's Climate Change Act.

[smegmore]

Greg66 said:

powerstroke said:

Are there any figures to show how much in subsidys have been paid to the wind ,solar and other reinventing the wheel to appease the green lobby industrys in the last 20years ???
What affect has it had on the economy?

Edited by powerstroke on Saturday 31st January 06:42

I doubt anyone knows the exact figure, but it is clear that it is huge, and has all been taken from the education budget. So now we have an entire generation unable to write simple sentences without fking up plural endings, spelling and punctuation.

[PorkInsider]

smegmore said:

Greg66 said:

powerstroke said:

Are there any figures to show how much in subsidys have been paid to the wind ,solar and other reinventing the wheel to appease the green lobby industrys in the last 20years ???
What affect has it had on the economy?

Edited by powerstroke on Saturday 31st January 06:42

I doubt anyone knows the exact figure, but it is clear that it is huge, and has all been taken from the education budget. So now we have an entire generation unable to write simple sentences without fking up plural endings, spelling and punctuation.

Have another one...

[Bodo]

Piersman2 said:

Martin4x4 said:

Shouldn't it be at least 37.5% of them are wrong?

Yes. Good spot!

[dandarez]

98elise said:

Mobile Chicane said:

powerstroke said:

Are there any figures to show how much in subsidys have been paid to the wind ,solar and other reinventing the wheel to appease the green lobby industrys in the last 20years ???
What affect has it had on the economy?

Edited by powerstroke on Saturday 31st January 06:42

The 'cost' of green initiatives goes far beyond the payment of subsidies.

For example, my company has just quoted on a project for a large NHS trust to replace air con units which use a now-banned CFC refridgerant environmentalists accuse of creating a hole in the Earth's ozone layer.

This is money the trust simply doesn't have without making cuts elsewhere. Obviously I can't state the numbers, but these would pay for a fair few nurses, put it that way.

There is little doubt the banned refridgerants were damaging the ozone, unless you have some empirical evidence otherwise?

I'm sure there were plently of people moaning about banning lead in petrol, however again the is no doubt it was poisoning the atmosphere.

Can I say something?

From a few years back...

Get a CLEANER, GREENER, DIESEL.

That turned out well, didn't it?

[paranoid airbag]

powerstroke said:

Are there any figures to show how much in subsidys have been paid to the wind ,solar and other reinventing the wheel to appease the green lobby industrys in the last 20years ???
What affect has it had on the economy?

Edited by powerstroke on Saturday 31st January 06:42

Yes, there are.

Am I going to waste my time digging them out for you when you're clearly not going to debate like an adult? No :-).

[Dr Jekyll]

Piersman2 said:

Shouldn't it be at least 37.5% of them are wrong?

It's not necessarily a bell shaped distribution though. If out of every 100 people 1 has had a severe bump on the head causing brain damage, and 2 have scrambled their brains with recreational pharmaceuticals. Then quite possibly 3% are below average and 97% above average.

[speedy_thrills]

Wilmslowboy said:

Leading the green bandwagon helped Al Gore raise his personal wealth from about 1.5 million dollars to circa 200 million dollars - Kind of an inconvenient truth

• * For completeness he did make circa 30 million of it from apple shares

Also there is a flood of money flowing to renewable energy at the moment and the costs of the green economy seem to be diminishing at a rapid rate. Solar and wind seem to be heading for parity with coal and gas in many parts of the world even without tax credits. Electric car sales are doing well despite the reduced cost of oil.

Great news for those of us that still have petrol or LPG cars as well I suppose as there will be less demand which should help keep pump prices down as, even at current prices, it's too expensive to turn oil into electricity in most of the world.