Shocking footage - US Cops take down man...
Discussion
djc206 said:
She knew damned well he posed no threat to her
Why did she call the police saying that he was threatening violence then?It's arguable that they should have used a less lethal weapon, but the ideas that they should have backed away behind his mother and that because they were wearing stab vests nobody present was at risk are not correct.
djc206 said:
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Did you watch the video? The mother was behind the officers, she had just pottered out of the house apparently unfazed by her son following her, hardly someone fearing for her life. She knew damned well he posed no threat to her,
If she was so sure of that, why had she called 911 to tell them he had stopped taking his meds?Did you watch the video? The mother was behind the officers, she had just pottered out of the house apparently unfazed by her son following her, hardly someone fearing for her life. She knew damned well he posed no threat to her,
Quite disturbing, perhaps warranted - I'm of the opinion if you are told to drop something by a police officer holding a gun you drop it and do as your told, he would have been alive that way. You run the risk of being shot and killed if you decide at that point to react and lunge at said officer.
Pothole said:
djc206 said:
[
Did you watch the video? The mother was behind the officers, she had just pottered out of the house apparently unfazed by her son following her, hardly someone fearing for her life. She knew damned well he posed no threat to her,
If she was so sure of that, why had she called 911 to tell them he had stopped taking his meds?Did you watch the video? The mother was behind the officers, she had just pottered out of the house apparently unfazed by her son following her, hardly someone fearing for her life. She knew damned well he posed no threat to her,
Pothole said:
f she was so sure of that, why had she called 911 to tell them he had stopped taking his meds?
Because he had the potential as a bipolar schizophrenic to be violent when off his medication. If he wasn't listening to her the sensible thing to do as a little old lady is to seek the help of someone with authority. The reality as shown in the video is that he hadn't been and wasn't threatening her. The man had a history and she wanted someone to help her get her son to take his medication to help keep him calm. They shot him instead. That is all very clear from the articles in combination with the video.djc206 said:
Because he had the potential as a bipolar schizophrenic to be violent when off his medication. If he wasn't listening to her the sensible thing to do as a little old lady is to seek the help of someone with authority. The reality as shown in the video is that he hadn't been and wasn't threatening her. The man had a history and she wanted someone to help her get her son to take his medication to help keep him calm. They shot him instead. That is all very clear from the articles in combination with the video.
What's also clear is this wasn't the first time the mother had called the police, rather than the ambulance service.He was a dangerous man and the police didn't differentiate between him and any other person acting aggressively with a deadly weapon.
The grand jury will acquit, and quite rightly.
I have no idea why the mother sought help from the police rather than doctors, perhaps that's something you might like to look into?
djc206 said:
The situation escalated when they drew their weapons and started shouting. Up until that point the mans body language was relaxed, he was twirling the screw driver in his hands not gripping it in a fist as one would if intending to use it to inflict damage, a minor threat that warranted stepping back and talking him down, they knew he was schizophrenic that's why they were there, they didn't adjust their methods to suit the situation. Failure to plan, failure to adapt, dead man, traumatised mother.
This seems typical for the American police. Perhaps they should try using a 'please' first next time.One of the cops who arrived shortly after the incident said they'd been to the house a couple of weeks before and they knew it was just a matter of time before something like this happened. He'd been threatening his mother & brother with a knife & was taken to a local psychiatric hospital at the time.
Mojocvh said:
Pothole said:
She got one of her wishes. He won't be a problem to anyone through not taking his medication anymore.
Interesting, do you support rolling out this scheme across the whole community?popeyewhite said:
What's also clear is this wasn't the first time the mother had called the police, rather than the ambulance service.
He was a dangerous man and the police didn't differentiate between him and any other person acting aggressively with a deadly weapon.
The grand jury will acquit, and quite rightly.
I have no idea why the mother sought help from the police rather than doctors, perhaps that's something you might like to look into?
He wasn't dangerous, he was potentially dangerous. He'd threatened not actually been violent, there's a big difference.He was a dangerous man and the police didn't differentiate between him and any other person acting aggressively with a deadly weapon.
The grand jury will acquit, and quite rightly.
I have no idea why the mother sought help from the police rather than doctors, perhaps that's something you might like to look into?
He also wasn't acting aggressively with a deadly weapon (you have to be bloody accurate and bloody lucky to turn a 4 inch screwdriver into a deadly weapon) in the video. His body language was very passive. He only lunged after he was threatened with an actual deadly weapon, a fight or flight instinct.
He was a bloody great big guy with bipolar and schizophrenia I should imagine the police would be a sensible first port of call rather than a paramedic just in case he did get violent.
I'm not disputing the guys capability to inflict injury I'm disputing the assumption that he was intending to inflict injury, I don't believe he was and as such I see his death as the consequence of an overreaction and I hope that should similar ever happen here that the officer be removed from duty and be handed over to a jury of his peers for judgment. They might judge him as you have, I feel safe believing that in the UK where reason usually prevails that they would judge as I have.
Sometimes im amazed at what I read others posting when we all just watched the same thing.
The big bloke comes to the door rubbing a screw driver. The police are instantly scared/taken aback as we all would be. They tell him to drop it, drop it.
We can't see what is going on.
Then we see the chap being shot but the chap is certainly moving toward the officer which is why he falls outside not inside the house.
Yes, it's a small screwdriver but he did, from what we can see, appear to lunge at the police or move towards them. What should they do? Jackie chan the screwdriver out of his hand?!
The big bloke comes to the door rubbing a screw driver. The police are instantly scared/taken aback as we all would be. They tell him to drop it, drop it.
We can't see what is going on.
Then we see the chap being shot but the chap is certainly moving toward the officer which is why he falls outside not inside the house.
Yes, it's a small screwdriver but he did, from what we can see, appear to lunge at the police or move towards them. What should they do? Jackie chan the screwdriver out of his hand?!
jonah35 said:
Yes, it's a small screwdriver but he did, from what we can see, appear to lunge at the police or move towards them. What should they do? Jackie chan the screwdriver out of his hand?!
It appears some folks on here believe the police should do just that.To hell with the officers safety when the offender could potentially have been engaged in honourable hand to hand combat
Loving the people forseeing the actions of the mentally unwell chap.
I could give a list of incidents that despite the best efforts of those involved couldn't be foreseen, this includes clinicians that know the person rather than random officers.
Obviously some of the PH warriors would have disarmed and de escalated the situation using only their extensive watch knowledge and directors credentials from Duedil....
Google Earl Butler enquiry (also by Francis of Stafford enquiry fame) or the death of DC Swindells in 2004. Things go wrong very quickly.
I could give a list of incidents that despite the best efforts of those involved couldn't be foreseen, this includes clinicians that know the person rather than random officers.
Obviously some of the PH warriors would have disarmed and de escalated the situation using only their extensive watch knowledge and directors credentials from Duedil....
Google Earl Butler enquiry (also by Francis of Stafford enquiry fame) or the death of DC Swindells in 2004. Things go wrong very quickly.
jonah35 said:
Sometimes im amazed at what I read others posting when we all just watched the same thing.
The big bloke comes to the door rubbing a screw driver. The police are instantly scared/taken aback as we all would be. They tell him to drop it, drop it.
We can't see what is going on.
Then we see the chap being shot but the chap is certainly moving toward the officer which is why he falls outside not inside the house.
Yes, it's a small screwdriver but he did, from what we can see, appear to lunge at the police or move towards them. What should they do? Jackie chan the screwdriver out of his hand?!
You've missed the point entirely. They don't ask him to drop it first they draw their weapons, aim them at him and starting screaming at him (a mentally ill man) to drop something which isn't being held in a aggressive manner. What the fThe big bloke comes to the door rubbing a screw driver. The police are instantly scared/taken aback as we all would be. They tell him to drop it, drop it.
We can't see what is going on.
Then we see the chap being shot but the chap is certainly moving toward the officer which is why he falls outside not inside the house.
Yes, it's a small screwdriver but he did, from what we can see, appear to lunge at the police or move towards them. What should they do? Jackie chan the screwdriver out of his hand?!
k did they expect would happen next? If he was a normal sane human being he wouldn't have heard police and gone to the door with a screwdriver but they knew he wasn't, they knew his history and yet they drew down and yelled in his face as a starter.The escalation was entirely the consequence of their actions, to a man in a paranoid and imbalanced state someone pointing a gun in his face and screaming at him would be extremely threatening, he acted accordingly.
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