Germanwings A320 crashed in France :(
Discussion
Emergency 'break glass' button, in cockpit and cabin (preferably crew only) areas. Press it and autopilot takes over for set time (30mins? ) taking aircraft to stable cruise speed/altitude + sending alert that this has taken place send out on relevant communications channels. Make misuse of it a serious offence.
Planes carry adequate fuel for possible landing slot delays etc, so even pressing it near end of flight would work. Disable it on takeoff and landing. Would need a through design and implementation to account for as much as possible. It would never be a 100% safety feature as nothing is. But a fundamentally sound idea I feel, certainly an improvement.
Plane hijacked? Pressing button would ensure time for jets to scramble and for it to be shot down safely if that deemed the only solution. In this case, time to regain cockpit access.
Planes carry adequate fuel for possible landing slot delays etc, so even pressing it near end of flight would work. Disable it on takeoff and landing. Would need a through design and implementation to account for as much as possible. It would never be a 100% safety feature as nothing is. But a fundamentally sound idea I feel, certainly an improvement.
Plane hijacked? Pressing button would ensure time for jets to scramble and for it to be shot down safely if that deemed the only solution. In this case, time to regain cockpit access.
TTmonkey said:
. His name should be erased from the history of the planet. As should all people that seek this kind of notoriety. They should know before death that their deeds whilst recorded will not be attributed to them. Their name will not live on. They should be erased.
that wouldn't work, names are there to understand and make sure it doesn't happen again.Motorhead Nutter said:
Emergency 'break glass' button, in cockpit and cabin (preferably crew only) areas. Press it and autopilot takes over for set time (30mins? ) taking aircraft to stable cruise speed/altitude + sending alert that this has taken place send out on relevant communications channels. Make misuse of it a serious offence.
Planes carry adequate fuel for possible landing slot delays etc, so even pressing it near end of flight would work. Disable it on takeoff and landing. Would need a through design and implementation to account for as much as possible. It would never be a 100% safety feature as nothing is. But a fundamentally sound idea I feel, certainly an improvement.
Plane hijacked? Pressing button would ensure time for jets to scramble and for it to be shot down safely if that deemed the only solution. In this case, time to regain cockpit access.
Aside from all the other issues with this, you are aware that the aircraft was flown in to the ground using the autopilot, right ?Planes carry adequate fuel for possible landing slot delays etc, so even pressing it near end of flight would work. Disable it on takeoff and landing. Would need a through design and implementation to account for as much as possible. It would never be a 100% safety feature as nothing is. But a fundamentally sound idea I feel, certainly an improvement.
Plane hijacked? Pressing button would ensure time for jets to scramble and for it to be shot down safely if that deemed the only solution. In this case, time to regain cockpit access.
The problem with AF296 is the pilot didn't know or understand how the aircraft control systems had been designed to work and was relying on an assumption. Combined with making an unusual maneuver the lack of understanding caused the crash.
DamienB said:
croyde said:
Sorry. I didn't look it up as it was a dimly remembered memory. I only remember the aircraft with its nose up ploughing into the trees.
I didn't realise there were passengers aboard. Amazed that so many survived.
Just an example of the computer not doing what the human captain wanted to do.
But it wasn't an example of that. It was - yet another - example of a human crew fI didn't realise there were passengers aboard. Amazed that so many survived.
Just an example of the computer not doing what the human captain wanted to do.
king things up.The computer ignored their pulling back on the stick, as the aircraft was already on the edge of controlled flight and any further nose-up pitch would have stalled the aircraft and crashed it far more dramatically, and likely with far more casualties, than happened a few seconds later. It did respond to their take off/go-around power request, the engines spooled up, they simply couldn't spool up fast enough given how late the crew had recognised that there was a bloody forest in front of them and they had got too low.
100% human failure.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I9gELPxPG8Q
Motorhead Nutter said:
Emergency 'break glass' button, in cockpit and cabin (preferably crew only) areas. Press it and autopilot takes over for set time (30mins? ) taking aircraft to stable cruise speed/altitude + sending alert that this has taken place send out on relevant communications channels. Make misuse of it a serious offence.
Planes carry adequate fuel for possible landing slot delays etc, so even pressing it near end of flight would work. Disable it on takeoff and landing. Would need a through design and implementation to account for as much as possible. It would never be a 100% safety feature as nothing is. But a fundamentally sound idea I feel, certainly an improvement.
Plane hijacked? Pressing button would ensure time for jets to scramble and for it to be shot down safely if that deemed the only solution. In this case, time to regain cockpit access.
I really like this idea but what's to stop nutter hijacker activating it or forcing crew to activate it with threat of death and this giving HIM the time to force open the cockpit door?Planes carry adequate fuel for possible landing slot delays etc, so even pressing it near end of flight would work. Disable it on takeoff and landing. Would need a through design and implementation to account for as much as possible. It would never be a 100% safety feature as nothing is. But a fundamentally sound idea I feel, certainly an improvement.
Plane hijacked? Pressing button would ensure time for jets to scramble and for it to be shot down safely if that deemed the only solution. In this case, time to regain cockpit access.
I prefer my method. Cabin crew area activation causes still or moving images + audio to be transmitted via satellite to a command centre, which then evaluates the cockpit and cabin situation. At which point they can check on the behaviour of the aircraft and opt to unlock the door (or not) and/or command it to a "safe mode" altitude.
Zad said:
I prefer my method. Cabin crew area activation causes still or moving images + audio to be transmitted via satellite to a command centre, which then evaluates the cockpit and cabin situation. At which point they can check on the behaviour of the aircraft and opt to unlock the door (or not) and/or command it to a "safe mode" altitude.
Does the bandwidth even exist for that via satellite on all plane routes?Vaud said:
Zad said:
I prefer my method. Cabin crew area activation causes still or moving images + audio to be transmitted via satellite to a command centre, which then evaluates the cockpit and cabin situation. At which point they can check on the behaviour of the aircraft and opt to unlock the door (or not) and/or command it to a "safe mode" altitude.
Does the bandwidth even exist for that via satellite on all plane routes?TTmonkey said:
To me there is another point that is being missed here. It's the instant global media via the Internet that gives this guy the gratification of knowing that he's made himself famous for ever. He's ensured that his deed has it his name in human history for ever. The very thing we talk about is keeping his name and his deed alive.
They used to call it "15 minutes of fame" but now the Internet makes it live forever. He will always be referred to. His name will live on forever. It shouldn't. His Wikipedia page no doubt was created within minutes of his crime.
He should be a assigned a 16 digit random letter/number combination. His name should be erased from the history of the planet. As should all people that seek this kind of notoriety. They should know before death that their deeds whilst recorded will not be attributed to them. Their name will not live on. They should be erased.
"Ignorance is strength", eh? Alas (for you), the Ministry of Truth doesn't yet exist.They used to call it "15 minutes of fame" but now the Internet makes it live forever. He will always be referred to. His name will live on forever. It shouldn't. His Wikipedia page no doubt was created within minutes of his crime.
He should be a assigned a 16 digit random letter/number combination. His name should be erased from the history of the planet. As should all people that seek this kind of notoriety. They should know before death that their deeds whilst recorded will not be attributed to them. Their name will not live on. They should be erased.
EskimoArapaho said:
TTmonkey said:
To me there is another point that is being missed here. It's the instant global media via the Internet that gives this guy the gratification of knowing that he's made himself famous for ever. He's ensured that his deed has it his name in human history for ever. The very thing we talk about is keeping his name and his deed alive.
They used to call it "15 minutes of fame" but now the Internet makes it live forever. He will always be referred to. His name will live on forever. It shouldn't. His Wikipedia page no doubt was created within minutes of his crime.
He should be a assigned a 16 digit random letter/number combination. His name should be erased from the history of the planet. As should all people that seek this kind of notoriety. They should know before death that their deeds whilst recorded will not be attributed to them. Their name will not live on. They should be erased.
"Ignorance is strength", eh? Alas (for you), the Ministry of Truth doesn't yet exist.They used to call it "15 minutes of fame" but now the Internet makes it live forever. He will always be referred to. His name will live on forever. It shouldn't. His Wikipedia page no doubt was created within minutes of his crime.
He should be a assigned a 16 digit random letter/number combination. His name should be erased from the history of the planet. As should all people that seek this kind of notoriety. They should know before death that their deeds whilst recorded will not be attributed to them. Their name will not live on. They should be erased.
However I do think that EA is making a most valuable point in this?
The justice system currently affords huge publicity permanently to the deranged evil b
ds who carry out such crimes. To some extent I do think this may increase the motivation behind many of these crimes. I do think the Justice system needs to change to recognise the dangers in allowing such unfettered publicity to proved succour for the perpetrators of the crime and nothing for the victims or their families.For those reasons I think this is an excellent idea and well worth considering. I do suspect that if the murderous b
ds knew from the start that their conviction and subsequent sentence would never be allowed to be used as publicity for them personally but that they would become an unknown number in the prison system for the rest of their sad, lonely lives, demostrating that the desire to be famous could never be achieved in ths way it would certainly be widely understood and might just save a few lives. The current system has a real flaw in it (one if many!) in that manic desire for permanent fame clearly does attract the wrong sort. Remove of the opportunity for fame from such curcumstances, with a unknown prison number replacing the identity in consequence of conviction, permanently, you might well reduce the revolting desires of such warped individuals. Time society stopped such inappropriate publicity and reduced the risk of this effect.
Steffan said:
The current system has a real flaw in it (one if many!) in that manic desire for permanent fame clearly does attract the wrong sort. Remove of the opportunity for fame from such curcumstances, with a unknown prison number replacing the identity in consequence of conviction, permanently, you might well reduce the revolting desires of such warped individuals. Time society stopped such inappropriate publicity and reduced the risk of this effect.
First: can't be done.Second: shouldn't be attempted.
Giving a government the power to permanently censor knowledge is as backward a step as I can imagine. Leaving aside the terrorists, if you've never heard of mission-creep, look it up. Just as an example, browse the Net for endless stories of ordinary punters getting various RIPA/anti-terror laws used on them.
Moreover, the task of trying to make such censorship total and water-tight is Sisyphean.
Apart from that, it's a great idea.
croyde said:
Sort of agree with that but it would also help with terrorism as it would be no purpose to commit an atrocity if the world knows nothing about it.
I know it would be a very dodgy step in the wrong direction for civil liberties.
Nearly all counter-terrorism activities have an adverse effect on civil liberties. People need to decide where to draw the line. I would be happy to draw the line in such a way as to allow the hiding of the identities of terrorists and whichever of their nasty causes they were hurting and killing people on behalf of.I know it would be a very dodgy step in the wrong direction for civil liberties.
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