UKIP - The Future - Volume 4

[McWigglebum4th]

BGARK said:

FredClogs said:

a distinct misunderstanding of what it means to be a human

Are you our supreme overlord?

I hope not

As he would have all the welsh executed

As Matt

HATES the welsh

[Scuffers]

smn159 said:

Scuffers said:

People lament the lack of real jobs, shipbuilding, steel works, etc etc, well this is what happens when you combine petty employment laws (that cause the whole zero hour contracts in the first place), combined with overzealous H&S and sky high energy prices.

It's more what you get when you dogmatically implement neoliberalism (mass privatisation / deregulation / wholesale cuts in government spending) and develop a service economy over reliant on consumer growth.

really?

mass privatisation?

so, the railways/shipbuilding/British Steel/Austin-Rover/etc. all were shining examples of efficiency and thriving businesses?


Are you one of our Left-leaning brothers?

[TKF]

Guam said:

Where do you think large numbers of the Eastern Europeans ended up?

In areas with jobs requiring low skilled workers, at a guess.

[TKF]

Guam said:

Greg66 said:

I'll take that as an admission that you have no answer.

Guam earlier said:

Seriously how old are you ? Thirteen?

That is likely the most puerile argument I have ever seen on PH and trust me I have seen a lot over my years on here.
Lets leave it there as you clearly are not capable of a sensible discussion!

[anonymous-user]

Guam said:

I think you should use this one instead



It paints a more realistic picture.

[TKF]

Guam said:

Your point being?
I choose to ignore a poster who has been previously banned on the thread and your point is what exactly?

You didn't ignore him. You quoted his posts and replied multiple times with a puerile jpeg, exactly like a teenager might.

eta Scuffers was previously banned from NP&R for homophobia. I presume you'll reply to him in the same manner?

[Zod]

Mr_B said:

Zod said:

Would don4l have passed the UKIP entry test with enough points based on his skills at the time?

Or your test on restricting movement from places like Romania and other places that don't meet your GDP target. You never did come back and answer why you wanted to restrict movement from such places and by how many.

No time. The answer is simple: If we want to impose restrictions, then better to restrict incomers from countries whose nationals are more likely to need assistance once they arrive here. As for numbers, I don't know. I could pluck numbers out of the air the way Farage did last week, but that would be ridiculous.

[Mr_B]

Zod said:

Mr_B said:

Zod said:

Would don4l have passed the UKIP entry test with enough points based on his skills at the time?

Or your test on restricting movement from places like Romania and other places that don't meet your GDP target. You never did come back and answer why you wanted to restrict movement from such places and by how many.

No time. The answer is simple: If we want to impose restrictions, then better to restrict incomers from countries whose nationals are more likely to need assistance once they arrive here. As for numbers, I don't know. I could pluck numbers out of the air the way Farage did last week, but that would be ridiculous.

Quite agree. I think Ukip have talked consistently on returning immigration levels to when they were around the 50k mark. I think you might safely be able to speculate that something closer this that figure if you wished, rather than the current rising one of 250k. You are only being asked for your opinion because your idea of keeping the poor ones out doesn't translate into any reduction in numbers. You could still be proposing to then increase the numbers of those who you see can bring something without being a burden.

[TKF]

Guam said:

TKF said:

You didn't ignore him. You quoted his posts and replied multiple times with a puerile jpeg, exactly like a teenager might.

Yes that is a novel approach I haven't seen before on these very threads NOT
It comes out when people insist on trying to engage me after I have previously suggested they don't as we clearly will never arrive at sensible level of discourse, rather like you right now.
Happy to engage with a sensible discussion but have a low level of tolerance for obvious trolling or tendencies to be abusive.
Happy to trot them out for you if you refuse to stay on point, or engage with me in silly infantile one liners that you think may make you look amusing?

It's funny to watch you take the mature higher ground on this. Have fun with your jpegs.

[Axionknight]

TKF said:

It's funny to watch you take the mature higher ground on this. Have fun with your jpegs.

Watch out or he'll have on especially for you as well!

[Zod]

Guam said:

Greg66 said:

I'll take that as an admission that you have no answer.

That button is not straight. It is very bad for my OCD.

[BGARK]

TKF said:

Guam said:

Where do you think large numbers of the Eastern Europeans ended up?

In areas with jobs requiring low skilled workers, at a guess.

An example for you, I know a many local fabrication and engineering companies.

A good welder a few years ago commanded a salary of around £25k per annum.

You can now get someone with the same skills for around £19k per annum.

This is happening right across lots of industries, not just "low skilled" ones.

Average this out and do the maths on the tax revenue lost, even though more people are in employment we are all slowly getting poorer.

[Zod]

Guam said:

TKF said:

In areas with jobs requiring low skilled workers, at a guess.

According to the last lincs data the official numbers in Lincs are a major underestimate as there is insufficient data to predict the levels the closest they get is with GP registrations however the last report I could find in the public domain with data from 2007 showed that only 53% registered with GP's on arrival in the area so the numbers are likely close to double the published figures.
Which brings us back to the core infrastructure problem that many raise (including the Labour party now).

Interesting piece in the Guardian

http://www.theguardian.com/news/2015/mar/24/how-im...

My brother is Head of practice at a surgery in rural Lincs. I'll ask him at the weekend about this.

[TKF]

BGARK said:

TKF said:

Guam said:

Where do you think large numbers of the Eastern Europeans ended up?

In areas with jobs requiring low skilled workers, at a guess.

An example for you, I know a many local fabrication and engineering companies.

A good welder a few years ago commanded a salary of around £25k per annum.

You can now get someone with the same skills for around £19k per annum.

This is happening right across lots of industries, not just "low skilled" ones.

Average this out and do the maths on the tax revenue lost, even though more people are in employment we are all slowly getting poorer.

As a result of the reduction in labour costs have the local fabrication and engineering companies become more competitive and/or made more profit?

[WinstonWolf]

TKF said:

BGARK said:

TKF said:

Guam said:

Where do you think large numbers of the Eastern Europeans ended up?

In areas with jobs requiring low skilled workers, at a guess.

An example for you, I know a many local fabrication and engineering companies.

A good welder a few years ago commanded a salary of around £25k per annum.

You can now get someone with the same skills for around £19k per annum.

This is happening right across lots of industries, not just "low skilled" ones.

Average this out and do the maths on the tax revenue lost, even though more people are in employment we are all slowly getting poorer.

As a result of the reduction in labour costs have the local fabrication and engineering companies become more competitive and/or made more profit?

The main one here has just gone out of business, so no.

[Axionknight]

Zod said:

That button is not straight. It is very bad for my OCD.

Tilt your head sideways

[TKF]

WinstonWolf said:

TKF said:

BGARK said:

TKF said:

Guam said:

Where do you think large numbers of the Eastern Europeans ended up?

In areas with jobs requiring low skilled workers, at a guess.

An example for you, I know a many local fabrication and engineering companies.

A good welder a few years ago commanded a salary of around £25k per annum.

You can now get someone with the same skills for around £19k per annum.

This is happening right across lots of industries, not just "low skilled" ones.

Average this out and do the maths on the tax revenue lost, even though more people are in employment we are all slowly getting poorer.

As a result of the reduction in labour costs have the local fabrication and engineering companies become more competitive and/or made more profit?

The main one here has just gone out of business, so no.

Sad for them, however if they're going bust with a 25% reduction in wage bills then they were going to go bust regardless of the immigration situation.

[smn159]

Scuffers said:

really?

mass privatisation?

so, the railways/shipbuilding/British Steel/Austin-Rover/etc. all were shining examples of efficiency and thriving businesses?


Are you one of our Left-leaning brothers?

Well I'd prefer to see utilities, and I'd include the railways in that, run in the national interest rather than primarily as profit making organisations under (often) foreign ownership

https://www.politicalcompass.org/test

Political compass test put me in the left libertarian quadrant - you?

Incidentally, below illustrates why I believe UKIP to be 'more of the same' with added scapegoating of immigrants and the EU rather than the breath of fresh air that they're claimed to be

Edited by smn159 on Wednesday 1st April 16:01

[Scuffers]

smn159 said:

Well I'd prefer to see utilities, and I'd include the railways in that, run in the national interest rather than primarily as profit making organisations under (often) foreign ownership

don't disagree with you in principal, problem is when they were publically run, they were even more hopeless.

that said the way the railways were privatised is a joke, once again, the banks get all the money (leasing co's).

[Scuffers]

TKF said:

Sad for them, however if they're going bust with a 25% reduction in wage bills then they were going to go bust regardless of the immigration situation.

labour costs is only one strand.

energy costs for industry are more problematic as are raw material costs.