UKIP - The Future - Volume 4

[steveT350C]

We know about the Ford plant in Southampton. Would they have moved had we been outside the EU?

Did not know about this...

@rog_ukip: In 2007 the Peugeot factory in Ryton, Coventry closed down (2,300 job losses) and moved to Slovakia with the help of £78m EU funding.

[anonymous-user]

MGJohn said:

"Less economically advantageous" ... that can happen irrespective of our EU membership. Those jobs are permanently at risk anyway. There's a good reason why Ford Transits are no longer produced in Hampshire or cars in Essex.

Yes, because each time a new car comes to market they have to compete to produce it-but at the moment, within the EU, they are doing a very very good job of it and beating the other European plants. Leave and their advantage could be put at risk. I don't quite get your argument? Yes they could go at any time but they are choosing to stay-one of the reasons seems to be the fact we're part of the EU.

s2art said:

Dont be so sure. The reason it takes the EU so long is that they have to keep 28 members happy, in particular France. The UK has traditionally been a free trader, we would sign up to an FTA with (say) Japan in days not years. Similarly for the USA, talks with the EU have been going on for years, but if free, the UK would simply join NAFTA tomorrow if offered. No questions asked.

The UK wouldn't have the complications of the EU keeping so many member states happy, but it would also have less leverage than the EU as a whole to procure FTA's on preferential terms.

Also-in 2013 Washington said it would be unlikely to do a seperate deal with the UK if it left the EU. This might apply to other countries as well.
http://www.theguardian.com/business/2013/may/27/eu...

[Halb]

Seems Nissan will stay so long as the below remains true. When it isn't, they'll reconsider regardless of EU stuff.

"Praising the Sunderland plant, Mr Ghosn told the BBC it was one of the most productive in Europe and said Nissan was "blessed" to own it."

[brenflys777]

Halb said:

Seems Nissan will stay so long as the below remains true. When it isn't, they'll reconsider regardless of EU stuff.

"Praising the Sunderland plant, Mr Ghosn told the BBC it was one of the most productive in Europe and said Nissan was "blessed" to own it."

Nissan are an important employer, what they do with their business does matter to me, however as they've proven with their keenness for the UK to join the Euro, they are focussed on relatively short term benefits to their business. Ultimately the productivity and quality of work is the best protection for Nissans future in the UK.

Would Nissan have unduly suffered if we'd joined the Euro - probably not, but few people now voice the opinion we would as a country have been better in the Euro. I place the same value on Nissans voice about EU membership - I wouldn't ignore it but the context is of a company entity that is after short term value and crucially can leave the UK if as part of the EU we become uncompetitive.

[anonymous-user]

FiF said:

Generally agree with this post. If one looks back it was me as the first person iirc to raise the awful prospect of a Lab-SNP cooperation in Westminster. The very next post was from Gregg66 with something along the lines of yikes hadn't thought of that.

Been happy to stay true to my word and stay out of this thread (although I did enjoy last nights massive slagging match. Much was said that needed to be said. It is a shame it has all been deleted), but I'm going to claim 17 November 2014 as the date I raised the SNP/Lab axis of evil as a possible Govt, in response to a post from Essesse ( here). Happy to be be told it had been brought up by FiF before that; I'm feeling especially magnanimous because searching for that has allowed me many amusing moments reading Kippers' wildly wrong and hopelessly unrealistic claims about UKIP's future in the GE. Firmly reinforced my view that this thread is mostly a waste of time.

[FiF]

Greg66 said:

FiF said:

Generally agree with this post. If one looks back it was me as the first person iirc to raise the awful prospect of a Lab-SNP cooperation in Westminster. The very next post was from Gregg66 with something along the lines of yikes hadn't thought of that.

Been happy to stay true to my word and stay out of this thread (although I did enjoy last nights massive slagging match. Much was said that needed to be said. It is a shame it has all been deleted), but I'm going to claim 17 November 2014 as the date I raised the SNP/Lab axis of evil as a possible Govt, in response to a post from Essesse ( here). Happy to be be told it had been brought up by FiF before that; I'm feeling especially magnanimous because searching for that has allowed me many amusing moments reading Kippers' wildly wrong and hopelessly unrealistic claims about UKIP's future in the GE. Firmly reinforced my view that this thread is mostly a waste of time.

Actually, many apologies, you're right, sorry, what I'm remembering is in Dec 17 2014 where the following exchange took place.

Greg66 said:

FiF said:

Re SNP I can see some pain in the event of a coalition / C&S deal which lowers voting age to 16. Very likely I'd suggest. Greens probably going to back that too

.
Eek! Hadn't thought of that, but yes, that seems very likely indeed.

RE last night's slagging match, disagree, it didn't need to be said, it was a bloody disgrace. Some are lucky they still have posting rights imo.

[don4l]

FiF said:

RE last night's slagging match, disagree, it didn't need to be said, it was a bloody disgrace. Some are lucky they still have posting rights imo.

May I ask what happened?


I seem to have missed it.

[steveT350C]

I'm quite happy to concede that despite all my positive bravado re UKIP, I am quite content that the Tories are serving voters in a majority Gov.. We WILL get our EU referendum, thanks solely to UKIP pressure.

I did not realise the possibility of SNP/Lab coalition until very late, way after you guys above. ^^^

I am in a very safe Tory seat, Dom Grieve's, so me voting UKIP was only ever going to add to the National numbers and no more.

[Benbay001]

steveT350C said:

We WILL get our EU referendum, thanks solely to UKIP pressure.

But it wont be fair.
Not when most of the media and 641 of 650 MPs are from pro Europe partys.

[steveT350C]

Benbay001 said:

steveT350C said:

We WILL get our EU referendum, thanks solely to UKIP pressure.

But it wont be fair.
Not when most of the media and 641 of 650 MPs are from pro Europe partys.

There are significant numbers of MPs who want out of the EU; mostly Tories. The key is to have open discussions about what the positives and negatives are to Britain's membership of the EU.

MSM is just a reposting service, and will only post what they choose.

Here is a little nugget from elsewhere....

"Addressing a major EU conference in London, Nile Gardiner from the hugely influential US-based Heritage Foundation will say the “European project is doomed to failure” and urge Britain to withdraw from the EU to become “a truly sovereign nation, free to shape its own destiny on the world stage.”

[Mojocvh]

DJRC said:

Mojocvh said:

MGJohn said:

Scuffers said:

MGJohn said:

Only a matter of time. For some time now no Ford vehicles are made here despite my heighbour castigating the good folks of Dagenham for the reliability of her Fiesta. If Ford and the rest could totally upsticks and leave they would do so immediately always provided they could still vend their stuff here at UK prices and margins.

Yup

Remind us again where ford moved transit production?

Now's the time to Talk Turkey.

Oooh yeahhh... "EU allocations for IPA 2014-2020: €4,453.9 million (not including the allocation for Cross-border Cooperation)"

Ref. http://ec.europa.eu/enlargement/instruments/fundin...

Where's Zod/DJRC to call us all morons and imbeciles ?

You are a moron and an imbecile.

Why am I calling you a moron and an imbecile this time?

Sorry I missed that, could you repeat it please..

[AW111]

steveT350C said:

There are significant numbers of MPs who want out of the EU; mostly Tories. The key is to have open discussions about what the positives and negatives are to Britain's membership of the EU.

MSM is just a reposting service, and will only post what they choose.

Here is a little nugget from elsewhere....

"Addressing a major EU conference in London, Nile Gardiner from the hugely influential US-based Heritage Foundation will say the “European project is doomed to failure” and urge Britain to withdraw from the EU to become “a truly sovereign nation, free to shape its own destiny on the world stage.”

The "hugely influential Heritage Foundation" is a conservative "think tank" pushing right-wing policies and American exeptionalism.

They may be correct on Europe, but they are as ideologically driven as anyone, and hardly an unbiased source.

[MGJohn]

steveT350C said:

"Addressing a major EU conference in London, Nile Gardiner from the hugely influential US-based Heritage Foundation will say the “European project is doomed to failure” and urge Britain to withdraw from the EU to become “a truly sovereign nation, free to shape its own destiny on the world stage.”

The erosion and corrosive signs of that have been there for more than a few years. Bit like statin' the bleedin' .....

If we as a "Sovereign" Nation cannot thrive and survive outside of the parasitical EU then our fate is deserved.

We as a Nation can expect more EU approaches and demands for ever increasing massive financial handouts and other benefits for being seen as "successful" within the EU.

Meantime, stand by for a shed load of Bovine Excrement in the run up to the 2017 Referendum. Expect more wool pulled over the nation's eyes after being blinded by "facts" from all sides.

[MGJohn]

Currently watching Tory Grandee Ken Clarke on Sunday Politics. He's in favour of sooner rather than later for the Referendum. I wonder what his latent motives are for that.

[Axionknight]

Maybe he wants to see it before he finally dies.

[NoNeed]

Did Cameron ever have the report published on how much the EU effects our lives? In 2010 he commissioned it, I was wondering if it it finished and hidden or still unfinished.

[anonymous-user]

FiF said:

Actually, many apologies, you're right, sorry, what I'm remembering is in Dec 17 2014 where the following exchange took place.

Greg66 said:

FiF said:

Re SNP I can see some pain in the event of a coalition / C&S deal which lowers voting age to 16. Very likely I'd suggest. Greens probably going to back that too

.
Eek! Hadn't thought of that, but yes, that seems very likely indeed.

Ah yes - you were right and first to point that one out. Those buggers together would undoubtedly have tried to buy themselves a few more hundreds of thousands of votes with that little stunt.

Sometimes I have to pinch myself to remind myself just how many bullets were dodged in May.

[RYH64E]

Benbay001 said:

steveT350C said:

We WILL get our EU referendum, thanks solely to UKIP pressure.

But it wont be fair.
Not when most of the media and 641 of 650 MPs are from pro Europe partys.

Fair? We've just had a free and fair general election and UKIP managed to get the grand total of one MP elected, and that I suspect was more because of the candidate, had Carswell stood as a Conservative UKIP would have no MPs.

If your view is under represented in the media and parliament it's because it's a minority view, as I strongly expect the referendum will show.

[anonymous-user]

MGJohn said:

OpulentBob said:

All this back and forth name-calling ste is basically the opposite of democracy. People can vote how they like without fear of (any firm of) persecution.

Kippers: You lost. Yes, you got a lot of the vote and the SNP got a similar amount yet they are far more over represented than you. The majority don't want what UKIP stand for. Get over it.

Non-kippers: you won, if you want to put it like that. You don't agree with UKIP, the country generally agrees, but that's no excuse to fill these pages with idiotic ravings and rage. Have some decency.

None of you should be allowed to vote if this is how you carry on, if you can't respect the Democratic process and democratic freedom - because that's what this arguing is: one side trying to stifle the voice of the other. Bloody children, the lot of you, trying to come across as learned and intelligent yet most of the time sounding like that crazy angry old man that we all know from just down the road.

You and numerous others fail miserably to appreciate the service Nigel Farage has done by widely alerting the Nation to the various negative "benefits" involved by our membership of the so called European Union. Even if he dropped completely away from the Political scene, Farage has more than served his purpose.

Even Tory Dave has been fully alerted so much so that right now tasked with negotiating, or at least laying the plans to renegotiate some of the more negative aspects of our membership of the Union. I wish him well in his efforts and sincerely trust he will succeed but, on all known past EU "form", I suspect he will be urinating into the wind. Thus a satisfactory result in UK's favour is unlikely.

Interesting times ahead for this Nation and the EU.

I don't miserably fail to understand anything. I haven't said how I voted

(although I think we would not be better off leaving Europe, but that's based on selfish work related reasons)l

But it's the pathetic nature of the bhing and whining that makes me think this thread is more populated with 13 year old girls who have swallowed a dictionary rather than supposedly mature (mainly) men who get all stroppy at the first sign of someone disagreeing with them.

I watched the Young Ones the other night. Rick made me think immediately of NP&E.

[Zod]

Greg66 said:

FiF said:

Generally agree with this post. If one looks back it was me as the first person iirc to raise the awful prospect of a Lab-SNP cooperation in Westminster. The very next post was from Gregg66 with something along the lines of yikes hadn't thought of that.

Been happy to stay true to my word and stay out of this thread (although I did enjoy last nights massive slagging match. Much was said that needed to be said. It is a shame it has all been deleted), but I'm going to claim 17 November 2014 as the date I raised the SNP/Lab axis of evil as a possible Govt, in response to a post from Essesse ( here). Happy to be be told it had been brought up by FiF before that; I'm feeling especially magnanimous because searching for that has allowed me many amusing moments reading Kippers' wildly wrong and hopelessly unrealistic claims about UKIP's future in the GE. Firmly reinforced my view that this thread is mostly a waste of time.

Sounds as if I missed something.