Why do so many people not vote?
Discussion
JB! said:
Misuse of funds? We are at capacity on alot of our main routes, we will need new lines built, as its the most efficient way to increase capacity.
So why a massive investment in one particular line rather than spreading the money to cover upgrades across a much wider set of routes?As before, the economic argument for HS2 versus a wider investment in this type of infrastructure is weak to say the least.
JB! said:
Its not strange, protecting the green belt, its just pointless. We already dont build enough houses to meet demand...
You said their policies were 'strange'...JB! said:
They are untested. That is a risk. Its down to voters if they wish to accept that risk.
Untested yes, but you said 'strange'....JB! said:
The NHS, Policing, Railways, anything massive and on the books basically...
I'm worried it will be sold to the highest bidder, for a nice backhander or contract for someone's chum, and sod all concern as to whats right for UK PLC in the long term, and sometimes, what's right financially isn't right ethically.
Where have the Tories said about privatising the NHS, policing or anything else 'massive and on the books'?? I'm worried it will be sold to the highest bidder, for a nice backhander or contract for someone's chum, and sod all concern as to whats right for UK PLC in the long term, and sometimes, what's right financially isn't right ethically.
You're talking nonsense!
sidicks said:
JB! said:
Misuse of funds? We are at capacity on alot of our main routes, we will need new lines built, as its the most efficient way to increase capacity.
So why a massive investment in one particular line rather than spreading the money to cover upgrades across a much wider set of routes?As before, the economic argument for HS2 versus a wider investment in this type of infrastructure is weak to say the least.
JB! said:
Its not strange, protecting the green belt, its just pointless. We already dont build enough houses to meet demand...
You said their policies were 'strange'...JB! said:
They are untested. That is a risk. Its down to voters if they wish to accept that risk.
Untested yes, but you said 'strange'....YOU said strange. I said backwards, which a lack of massive investment in new rail infrastructure will be, if its not progress, its not forwards, the same applies to the green belt, we need housing, and we need it in the south east.
JB! said:
No,
YOU said strange. I said backwards, which a lack of massive investment in new rail infrastructure will be, if its not progress, its not forwards, the same applies to the green belt, we need housing, and we need it in the south east.
Ah, indeed I did. My mistake, apologies!YOU said strange. I said backwards, which a lack of massive investment in new rail infrastructure will be, if its not progress, its not forwards, the same applies to the green belt, we need housing, and we need it in the south east.
Surely it's more backwards to invest a massive amount on one single line rather than spread the budget more widely and improve outcomes for a much wider range of people?
sidicks said:
JB! said:
No,
YOU said strange. I said backwards, which a lack of massive investment in new rail infrastructure will be, if its not progress, its not forwards, the same applies to the green belt, we need housing, and we need it in the south east.
Ah, indeed I did. My mistake, apologies!YOU said strange. I said backwards, which a lack of massive investment in new rail infrastructure will be, if its not progress, its not forwards, the same applies to the green belt, we need housing, and we need it in the south east.
Surely it's more backwards to invest a massive amount on one single line rather than spread the budget more widely and improve outcomes for a much wider range of people?
JB! said:
YOU said strange. I said backwards, which a lack of massive investment in new rail infrastructure will be, if its not progress, its not forwards, the same applies to the green belt, we need housing, and we need it in the south east.
There are Brownfield sites in the South East?Personally I think the high speed link is a waste of money, when looks at the situation of train links in my area, the North-West, they are s
te. I'd rather have momney spent on them.It seems what most people want is actually Clientelism not Democracy.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clientelism
I.e. If it the policies do not directly benefit me then they are rubbish. This is basically how India is run and it is st for long term prosperity.
Democracies problem in the UK is that the participants (MP's, Parties and voters) do not understand it or what their role in it is. Its the general ideas in the manifestos that you are voting for, do not get too hung up on the specific policy points. The parties themselves should not be producing such detailed policies in their manifestos as this is pushing us down the road to Clientelism.
Tory's: "Government should not provider services that can easily be provided by the market"
Labour: "Government should invest in services so that they are freely/cheaply available to all"
Libs, Greens, UKIP: "Who knows?"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clientelism
I.e. If it the policies do not directly benefit me then they are rubbish. This is basically how India is run and it is s
t for long term prosperity.Democracies problem in the UK is that the participants (MP's, Parties and voters) do not understand it or what their role in it is. Its the general ideas in the manifestos that you are voting for, do not get too hung up on the specific policy points. The parties themselves should not be producing such detailed policies in their manifestos as this is pushing us down the road to Clientelism.
Tory's: "Government should not provider services that can easily be provided by the market"
Labour: "Government should invest in services so that they are freely/cheaply available to all"
Libs, Greens, UKIP: "Who knows?"
PlankWithANailIn said:
It seems what most people want is actually Clientelism not Democracy.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clientelism
I.e. If it the policies do not directly benefit me then they are rubbish. This is basically how India is run and it is st for long term prosperity.
Democracies problem in the UK is that the participants (MP's, Parties and voters) do not understand it or what their role in it is. Its the general ideas in the manifestos that you are voting for, do not get too hung up on the specific policy points. The parties themselves should not be producing such detailed policies in their manifestos as this is pushing us down the road to Clientelism.
Tory's: "Government should not provider services that can easily be provided by the market"
Labour: "Government should invest in services so that they are freely/cheaply available to all"
Libs, Greens, UKIP: "Who knows?"
Not at all, what I want is a plan that say in 20 years we would like the UK to look like this, or as close to it as world events allow.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clientelism
I.e. If it the policies do not directly benefit me then they are rubbish. This is basically how India is run and it is s
t for long term prosperity.Democracies problem in the UK is that the participants (MP's, Parties and voters) do not understand it or what their role in it is. Its the general ideas in the manifestos that you are voting for, do not get too hung up on the specific policy points. The parties themselves should not be producing such detailed policies in their manifestos as this is pushing us down the road to Clientelism.
Tory's: "Government should not provider services that can easily be provided by the market"
Labour: "Government should invest in services so that they are freely/cheaply available to all"
Libs, Greens, UKIP: "Who knows?"
People don't vote because they are basically sheep.
"It doesn't matter who you vote for, the government always gets in!"
The idea that we just coast along with two basically the same parties is about to change. The whole economic well-being of this country is based on one thing and that's low interest rates. They have basically shielded us from the worst of the financial crisis and if they start to rise the consequences don't bear thinking about.
Everyone I know is just making ends met and their financial future is based on the value of their property going up long term. If the market crashes and mortgage costs start going through the roof, a lot of them are going to be in deep pooh. Plus if costs on mortgages go up, that other great pillar of the UK economy, retail sales will drop away too.
People need to wake up in the next couple of weeks to the problems a crippled parliament or a government tied to a coalition based on 70s ideas of a left wing Utopia and the politics of envy, will create.
Get out and vote and tell everyone you know to as well.
If you don't vote, you have no right to complain when the bailiffs come to take the keys to your house or when your loved one is killed in the next terrorist extremist outrage because the government in power is being influenced by idiots who think that property is theft & that if we are nice to people who hate us, everything will be butterflies and lavender.
"It doesn't matter who you vote for, the government always gets in!"
The idea that we just coast along with two basically the same parties is about to change. The whole economic well-being of this country is based on one thing and that's low interest rates. They have basically shielded us from the worst of the financial crisis and if they start to rise the consequences don't bear thinking about.
Everyone I know is just making ends met and their financial future is based on the value of their property going up long term. If the market crashes and mortgage costs start going through the roof, a lot of them are going to be in deep pooh. Plus if costs on mortgages go up, that other great pillar of the UK economy, retail sales will drop away too.
People need to wake up in the next couple of weeks to the problems a crippled parliament or a government tied to a coalition based on 70s ideas of a left wing Utopia and the politics of envy, will create.
Get out and vote and tell everyone you know to as well.
If you don't vote, you have no right to complain when the bailiffs come to take the keys to your house or when your loved one is killed in the next terrorist extremist outrage because the government in power is being influenced by idiots who think that property is theft & that if we are nice to people who hate us, everything will be butterflies and lavender.
Foppo said:
Did see some figures regarding voting in the next election. A figure came up of about 7 million people are not registered to vote.
Politics might be boring and it won't affect us but it will.People died to have a right to vote and so many don't bother.
I fancy a decent proportion of those not registered to vote are trying to avoid income tax, rates, outstanding warrants, etc - they are simply trying to remain below the radar. Politics might be boring and it won't affect us but it will.People died to have a right to vote and so many don't bother.
They perceive no benefit to be gained so why should they pop their head above the parapet?
I've voted in every general election since 1983, I was a few months too young to vote 1979.
The Hypno-Toad said:
People don't vote because they are basically sheep.
"It doesn't matter who you vote for, the government always gets in!"
The idea that we just coast along with two basically the same parties is about to change. The whole economic well-being of this country is based on one thing and that's low interest rates. They have basically shielded us from the worst of the financial crisis and if they start to rise the consequences don't bear thinking about.
Everyone I know is just making ends met and their financial future is based on the value of their property going up long term. If the market crashes and mortgage costs start going through the roof, a lot of them are going to be in deep pooh. Plus if costs on mortgages go up, that other great pillar of the UK economy, retail sales will drop away too.
People need to wake up in the next couple of weeks to the problems a crippled parliament or a government tied to a coalition based on 70s ideas of a left wing Utopia and the politics of envy, will create.
Get out and vote and tell everyone you know to as well.
If you don't vote, you have no right to complain when the bailiffs come to take the keys to your house or when your loved one is killed in the next terrorist extremist outrage because the government in power is being influenced by idiots who think that property is theft & that if we are nice to people who hate us, everything will be butterflies and lavender.
so what you're actually saying is "you should vote, but only if you vote the same way as me""It doesn't matter who you vote for, the government always gets in!"
The idea that we just coast along with two basically the same parties is about to change. The whole economic well-being of this country is based on one thing and that's low interest rates. They have basically shielded us from the worst of the financial crisis and if they start to rise the consequences don't bear thinking about.
Everyone I know is just making ends met and their financial future is based on the value of their property going up long term. If the market crashes and mortgage costs start going through the roof, a lot of them are going to be in deep pooh. Plus if costs on mortgages go up, that other great pillar of the UK economy, retail sales will drop away too.
People need to wake up in the next couple of weeks to the problems a crippled parliament or a government tied to a coalition based on 70s ideas of a left wing Utopia and the politics of envy, will create.
Get out and vote and tell everyone you know to as well.
If you don't vote, you have no right to complain when the bailiffs come to take the keys to your house or when your loved one is killed in the next terrorist extremist outrage because the government in power is being influenced by idiots who think that property is theft & that if we are nice to people who hate us, everything will be butterflies and lavender.
Foppo said:
Did see some figures regarding voting in the next election. A figure came up of about 7 million people are not registered to vote.
Politics might be boring and it won't affect us but it will.People died to have a right to vote and so many don't bother.
Well there are about 5 million British expats, it's a royal pain the the a55 to register and vote from abroad and you can only ever vote in the last constituency you lived in prior to emigrating, in my case Bethnal Green and Bow an ultra safe Labour/Respect seat. Additionally IMO it's not right to vote if you don't contribute, so I don't. Politics might be boring and it won't affect us but it will.People died to have a right to vote and so many don't bother.
If you estimate 4 million are eligible to vote and the majority are wealthy pensioners and the professional classes its actually a massive issue for the Torys.
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