Scottish Referendum / Independence - Vol 7

[r11co]

s2art said:

Wrong again.

I thought we'd pretty much established already that fluff isn't nearly as clever as he thinks he is.

[DocJock]

Alpacaman said:

As an English person ,who moved to Scotland because I fell in love with the place, can I say I am sick to death of you coming on here trying to claim the SNP and their supporters don't hate the English. Take it from me they are full of hatred, to the point where I no longer want to live here, just because you are blind to it doesn't mean it's not happening every day.

Very true.

My (English) wife has experienced this first hand as well.

For every incident that could possibly be described as 'banter' there is another which is nasty, hateful, embarrassing, bigotry. It's not just the uneducated either, she's been on the receiving end of this ste from people who are (on paper) well-educated.

Very few of them have the courage to back up their nonsense when you pull them up on it though.

[Sylvaforever]

http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2016/08/now-snp-power...

"No, this isn’t intrusion or repression on a grand scale and it would be silly to make too much of it. At the same time, it’s hardly a healthy development when you have SNP MPs apparently pressuring broadcasters to silence critical journalists. It seems worth nothing that neither Wishart nor Nicolson have denied they raised their ‘concerns’ about Daisley with STV."


http://www.spectator.co.uk/2016/08/the-snps-land-r...

"On land reform, ministers now enjoy the power to force a sale ‘where the scale or decisions of landowners are acting as a barrier to the sustainable development of communities’. How that is to be defined remains a mystery."

Communism by the back door; pity that the majority their supporters probably couldn't spell it let alone understand just what it means...

[confused_buyer]

fluffnik said:

Since the kingdoms "united" to form the UK are the Scottish and English( incorporating Welsh) kingdoms, if either of those entities "leave" there ceases to be an UK.

In the (now probably unlikely) Scotland becoming independent, the remaining UK can - to be frank - call it's self Marjorie if it wants - it has sweet FA to do with anyone else.

[simoid]

This st about ancient kingdoms is a convenient distraction for a Fluff from the fact that Scotland's population, and even the nationalist politicians, don't even want a referendum let alone independence

[r11co]

simoid said:

Even the nationalist politicians, don't even want a referendum let alone independence

Indeed. Alex Neil warning that independence will lead to at least 5 years of cuts to public spending, Tommy Sheppard (deputy SNP leader candidate) talking down links between Brexit and another independence referendum. They know they would lose a snap poll and, having seen what happened to Cameron, don't want to be forced off the gravy-train early.

Fear of defeat was why new referendum was not called

They also know that they still have no answers to the key questions that lost them the last poll, and with Brexit negotiations going on, much of the resolution of the doubts is entirely out of the hands of the SNP and only makes Sturgeon's posturing look even more ridiculous.

[Sylvaforever]

http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/702058/Sturgeon-t...



Oh dear oh dear caught RED HANDED lying to the electorate.

[mikal83]

Look forward to a journo asking wee jimmy about the letter and why they have spent so much public money on this matter. And of course her excuses.

[Edinburger]

technodup said:

fluffnik said:

Since EU citizens, along with 16 and 17 year olds, were quite properly enfranchised for the Scottish referendum, a constitutional matter, but denied a vote in the next constitutional referendum, what would you call it if not disenfranchised?

They were only enfranchised because it was a diddy wee Scottish vote and the SNP thought it would suit them.

Oops.

But you must be enjoying the Olympics, what with Team GB doing so well and the Union Flag draped across every athlete and waved from every crowd. Makes you proud to be British, doesn't it?

Because like it or not, that's what you are.

Slight digression but whys it not Team UK?

[s2art]

Edinburger said:

Slight digression but whys it not Team UK?

Lots of other bits outside the UK, such as the Falklands, are included in our team. As it is GB and NI, crown colonies and BoTs they just took the first bit.

[Edinburger]

DocJock said:

Alpacaman said:

As an English person ,who moved to Scotland because I fell in love with the place, can I say I am sick to death of you coming on here trying to claim the SNP and their supporters don't hate the English. Take it from me they are full of hatred, to the point where I no longer want to live here, just because you are blind to it doesn't mean it's not happening every day.

Very true.

My (English) wife has experienced this first hand as well.

For every incident that could possibly be described as 'banter' there is another which is nasty, hateful, embarrassing, bigotry. It's not just the uneducated either, she's been on the receiving end of this ste from people who are (on paper) well-educated.

Very few of them have the courage to back up their nonsense when you pull them up on it though.

This point has been discussed many times on this thread.

I've voted SNP in the past. My wife and kids are English so what does that make me?

Why don't you ask someone like Mike Russell, the SNP MP who is English, if he hates the English.

Seriously. Get over the "they hate the English" rubbish.

[Edinburger]

s2art said:

Edinburger said:

Slight digression but whys it not Team UK?

Lots of other bits outside the UK, such as the Falklands, are included in our team. As it is GB and NI, crown colonies and BoTs they just took the first bit.

Fair enough but the name Team GB disenfranchises many people in Northern Ireland.

Why's it not Team UK?

[///ajd]

Edinburger said:

Fair enough but the name Team GB disenfranchises many people in Northern Ireland.

Why's it not Team UK?

Are you offended on their behalf?

Looks like you are desperately looking to create division where there is none - still SNP through and through!

[Edinburger]

///ajd said:

Edinburger said:

Fair enough but the name Team GB disenfranchises many people in Northern Ireland.

Why's it not Team UK?

Are you offended on their behalf?

Looks like you are desperately looking to create division where there is none - still SNP through and through!

Perhaps I am. I work in Northern Ireland a lot.

Sometimes you have to look past your own nose in life.

[simoid]

Edinburger said:

This point has been discussed many times on this thread.

I've voted SNP in the past. My wife and kids are English so what does that make me?

Why don't you ask someone like Mike Russell, the SNP MP who is English, if he hates the English.

Seriously. Get over the "they hate the English" rubbish.

Are you saying 0% of the SNP hate the English?

[technodup]

Edinburger said:

Why don't you ask someone like Mike Russell, the SNP MP who is English, if he hates the English.

Ooh, an example.

There is a large and fairly obvious dislike/contempt/hatred of the English within the Yes community. The fact one SNP MP is English doesn't balance that up.

Edinburger said:

Fair enough but the name Team GB disenfranchises many people in Northern Ireland.

And many many others are more than happy to be called British. So much so they had quite a long fight about it.

Doesn't matter what you call them, there will be some SNP nugget along to be offended on behalf of someone or other.

Any view on the letter?

[Edinburger]

simoid said:

Edinburger said:

This point has been discussed many times on this thread.

I've voted SNP in the past. My wife and kids are English so what does that make me?

Why don't you ask someone like Mike Russell, the SNP MP who is English, if he hates the English.

Seriously. Get over the "they hate the English" rubbish.

Are you saying 0% of the SNP hate the English?

No.

Are you saying 100% of the SNP hate the English?

[DocJock]

Edinburger said:

DocJock said:

Alpacaman said:

As an English person ,who moved to Scotland because I fell in love with the place, can I say I am sick to death of you coming on here trying to claim the SNP and their supporters don't hate the English. Take it from me they are full of hatred, to the point where I no longer want to live here, just because you are blind to it doesn't mean it's not happening every day.

Very true.

My (English) wife has experienced this first hand as well.

For every incident that could possibly be described as 'banter' there is another which is nasty, hateful, embarrassing, bigotry. It's not just the uneducated either, she's been on the receiving end of this ste from people who are (on paper) well-educated.

Very few of them have the courage to back up their nonsense when you pull them up on it though.

This point has been discussed many times on this thread.

I've voted SNP in the past. My wife and kids are English so what does that make me?

Why don't you ask someone like Mike Russell, the SNP MP who is English, if he hates the English.

Seriously. Get over the "they hate the English" rubbish.

fk your 'get over it' condescension. I've never claimed that all SNP supporters do, but there's a significant proportion of their support which DOES hate England/the English and you know it even if you haven't experienced it directly. It has also got a lot worse in my experience since the referendum was first announced.

Why should I let slide ignorant, bigoted, behaviour which is stoked up by dishonest, manipulative, tin-pot politicians? Answer, I shouldn't and won't.

[Alpacaman]

Edinburger said:

simoid said:

Edinburger said:

This point has been discussed many times on this thread.

I've voted SNP in the past. My wife and kids are English so what does that make me?

Why don't you ask someone like Mike Russell, the SNP MP who is English, if he hates the English.

Seriously. Get over the "they hate the English" rubbish.

Are you saying 0% of the SNP hate the English?

No.

Are you saying 100% of the SNP hate the English?

Nobody said that, however it is a fact that many of them do, as I have personally found out. So please stop coming on here with your fake outrage that anyone could even suggest they are a bunch of English hating knuckle draggers. Some of us have had to deal with the st dealt out by your buddies, in particular in the run up to the referendum, so please excuse me if I couldn't care less where your wife is from. I am afraid most of them are too cowardly to say anything to your face, but are happy to insult you when they think you can't hear or come online with their pathetic opinions.

Just because you're happy to ignore it doesn't make it any less true.

[Edinburger]

DocJock said:

Edinburger said:

DocJock said:

Alpacaman said:

As an English person ,who moved to Scotland because I fell in love with the place, can I say I am sick to death of you coming on here trying to claim the SNP and their supporters don't hate the English. Take it from me they are full of hatred, to the point where I no longer want to live here, just because you are blind to it doesn't mean it's not happening every day.

Very true.

My (English) wife has experienced this first hand as well.

For every incident that could possibly be described as 'banter' there is another which is nasty, hateful, embarrassing, bigotry. It's not just the uneducated either, she's been on the receiving end of this ste from people who are (on paper) well-educated.

Very few of them have the courage to back up their nonsense when you pull them up on it though.

This point has been discussed many times on this thread.

I've voted SNP in the past. My wife and kids are English so what does that make me?

Why don't you ask someone like Mike Russell, the SNP MP who is English, if he hates the English.

Seriously. Get over the "they hate the English" rubbish.

fk your 'get over it' condescension. I've never claimed that all SNP supporters do, but there's a significant proportion of their support which DOES hate England/the English and you know it even if you haven't experienced it directly. It has also got a lot worse in my experience since the referendum was first announced.

Why should I let slide ignorant, bigoted, behaviour which is stoked up by dishonest, manipulative, tin-pot politicians? Answer, I shouldn't and won't.

Perhaps a small minority of members/supporters are anti-English to an extent. We'll never know for sure.

But then what do you say to this: Surge in English SNP members 'the core message is very attractive'?