The 'No to the EU' campaign
Discussion
Ayahuasca said:
A common 'stay in' bleat heard any number of times - e.g. Question Time this week - is, 'We have to stay in because otherwise we will lose the EU money that paid for this [point to local stadium/theatre/sports centre etc].
Where do these people think the EU got the money to 'pay for this'?
If we were independent we would have MORE money to 'pay for this'!
Why isn't the OUT campaign putting out this message more strongly?
I have recently been asking some friends to give me £20, so I can give them £10 back.Where do these people think the EU got the money to 'pay for this'?
If we were independent we would have MORE money to 'pay for this'!
Why isn't the OUT campaign putting out this message more strongly?
What's the problem I say its a good deal!
Ayahuasca said:
A common 'stay in' bleat heard any number of times - e.g. Question Time this week - is, 'We have to stay in because otherwise we will lose the EU money that paid for this [point to local stadium/theatre/sports centre etc].
Where do these people think the EU got the money to 'pay for this'?
If we were independent we would have MORE money to 'pay for this'!
Why isn't the OUT campaign putting out this message more strongly?
People are stupid, who do they think paid for all those beautiful smooth sweeping near car-less roads all over the poorer Eu countries?Where do these people think the EU got the money to 'pay for this'?
If we were independent we would have MORE money to 'pay for this'!
Why isn't the OUT campaign putting out this message more strongly?
And then look at the state of our roads!
Ayahuasca said:
A common 'stay in' bleat heard any number of times - e.g. Question Time this week - is, 'We have to stay in because otherwise we will lose the EU money that paid for this [point to local stadium/theatre/sports centre etc].
Where do these people think the EU got the money to 'pay for this'?
If we were independent we would have MORE money to 'pay for this'!
Why isn't the OUT campaign putting out this message more strongly?
except we wouldn;t - the right wing fantasists would divert it to their expenses or lining the pockets of their cronies Where do these people think the EU got the money to 'pay for this'?
If we were independent we would have MORE money to 'pay for this'!
Why isn't the OUT campaign putting out this message more strongly?
the left wing loonies would spend it on yogurt knitting facilitators and 're-education' camps for anyone who doesn;t follow the party line of the glorious Komrade Korbyn
KrissKross said:
I have recently been asking some friends to give me £20, so I can give them £10 back.
What's the problem I say its a good deal!
Don't forget to make it a condition of your generous gift that they put up a very large sign showing the community that it was you.What's the problem I say its a good deal!
Also give them an expensive plaque with your name on that they must affix to the front wall of their house.
Immigration is the one topic people are afraid of and there has been some positive benefits to EU migration. What has gone so badly wrong is the aggressive expansion that the EU has over seen.
What this has meant is due to EU rules anyone can come here, whether they have a job prospect, skill set of any description, or intention to work, and get full benefits on day one.
Now due to the EU high priestess Merkel, we have economic migrants posing as refugees flooding the boarders bringing along with them many undesirables, who once processed and given a passport are free to travel here as well.
People I work with, van drivers, store men and women, they hear the it is good for us being in the EU what they see is crime rising in certain areas, regardless of figures. More stories of sex attacks by immigrants. More stories of billions given to the EU whilst we kick old people out of homes.
These are the issues that will focus their minds, right or wrong. If all the UKIP voters turn out as they did at the GE that is a 4 million start. As they are not voting for a party this time what will unite them is not business, not the economy it will be much more basic.
What this has meant is due to EU rules anyone can come here, whether they have a job prospect, skill set of any description, or intention to work, and get full benefits on day one.
Now due to the EU high priestess Merkel, we have economic migrants posing as refugees flooding the boarders bringing along with them many undesirables, who once processed and given a passport are free to travel here as well.
People I work with, van drivers, store men and women, they hear the it is good for us being in the EU what they see is crime rising in certain areas, regardless of figures. More stories of sex attacks by immigrants. More stories of billions given to the EU whilst we kick old people out of homes.
These are the issues that will focus their minds, right or wrong. If all the UKIP voters turn out as they did at the GE that is a 4 million start. As they are not voting for a party this time what will unite them is not business, not the economy it will be much more basic.
spaximus said:
Immigration is the one topic people are afraid of and there has been some positive benefits to EU migration. What has gone so badly wrong is the aggressive expansion that the EU has over seen.
What this has meant is due to EU rules anyone can come here, whether they have a job prospect, skill set of any description, or intention to work, and get full benefits on day one.
Now due to the EU high priestess Merkel, we have economic migrants posing as refugees flooding the boarders bringing along with them many undesirables, who once processed and given a passport are free to travel here as well.
People I work with, van drivers, store men and women, they hear the it is good for us being in the EU what they see is crime rising in certain areas, regardless of figures. More stories of sex attacks by immigrants. More stories of billions given to the EU whilst we kick old people out of homes.
These are the issues that will focus their minds, right or wrong. If all the UKIP voters turn out as they did at the GE that is a 4 million start. As they are not voting for a party this time what will unite them is not business, not the economy it will be much more basic.
What this has meant is due to EU rules anyone can come here, whether they have a job prospect, skill set of any description, or intention to work, and get full benefits on day one.
Now due to the EU high priestess Merkel, we have economic migrants posing as refugees flooding the boarders bringing along with them many undesirables, who once processed and given a passport are free to travel here as well.
People I work with, van drivers, store men and women, they hear the it is good for us being in the EU what they see is crime rising in certain areas, regardless of figures. More stories of sex attacks by immigrants. More stories of billions given to the EU whilst we kick old people out of homes.
These are the issues that will focus their minds, right or wrong. If all the UKIP voters turn out as they did at the GE that is a 4 million start. As they are not voting for a party this time what will unite them is not business, not the economy it will be much more basic.
Can't agree that immigration is the one thing we are worried about. For me and many others it's just one of a long list of concerns. A few would be:
Corruption. Quite clearly rife in the EU, to the tune of over £100B annually by the EU's own admission.
Incompetence. No similar sized organisation would be allowed to be so unaccountable for its actions and performance.
Legal meddling. Trying to develop a one size fits all legal system to suit such diverse cultures and countries is the dream of the insane.
Uncontrolled growth and spending. We saw what happened the other year when they needed more money to piss up against the wall. It can only get worse.
The biggest worry? If they aren't stopped, or at least curtailed, the excesses will continue to grow until the whole of Europe is bankrupt. Think about how you will explain that to your grandkids if you vote to stay in.
REALIST123 said:
Uncontrolled growth and spending. We saw what happened the other year when they needed more money to piss up against the wall. It can only get worse.
The biggest worry? If they aren't stopped, or at least curtailed, the excesses will continue to grow until the whole of Europe is bankrupt. Think about how you will explain that to your grandkids if you vote to stay in.
To stay in we would be voting for another government. One we don't vote for. That's worth thinking about. Wars have been fought to stop that happening.The biggest worry? If they aren't stopped, or at least curtailed, the excesses will continue to grow until the whole of Europe is bankrupt. Think about how you will explain that to your grandkids if you vote to stay in.
Cameron's 'efforts' have of course come to nothing, as you can't change the mind of a powerful unelected 'elite'...:
"...Quelle surprise! Brussels waters down PM's deal: Eurocrats claw back powers over migrant brake and City banks..."
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3443338/Qu...
REALIST123 said:
spaximus said:
Immigration is the one topic people are afraid of and there has been some positive benefits to EU migration. What has gone so badly wrong is the aggressive expansion that the EU has over seen.
What this has meant is due to EU rules anyone can come here, whether they have a job prospect, skill set of any description, or intention to work, and get full benefits on day one.
Now due to the EU high priestess Merkel, we have economic migrants posing as refugees flooding the boarders bringing along with them many undesirables, who once processed and given a passport are free to travel here as well.
People I work with, van drivers, store men and women, they hear the it is good for us being in the EU what they see is crime rising in certain areas, regardless of figures. More stories of sex attacks by immigrants. More stories of billions given to the EU whilst we kick old people out of homes.
These are the issues that will focus their minds, right or wrong. If all the UKIP voters turn out as they did at the GE that is a 4 million start. As they are not voting for a party this time what will unite them is not business, not the economy it will be much more basic.
What this has meant is due to EU rules anyone can come here, whether they have a job prospect, skill set of any description, or intention to work, and get full benefits on day one.
Now due to the EU high priestess Merkel, we have economic migrants posing as refugees flooding the boarders bringing along with them many undesirables, who once processed and given a passport are free to travel here as well.
People I work with, van drivers, store men and women, they hear the it is good for us being in the EU what they see is crime rising in certain areas, regardless of figures. More stories of sex attacks by immigrants. More stories of billions given to the EU whilst we kick old people out of homes.
These are the issues that will focus their minds, right or wrong. If all the UKIP voters turn out as they did at the GE that is a 4 million start. As they are not voting for a party this time what will unite them is not business, not the economy it will be much more basic.
Can't agree that immigration is the one thing we are worried about. For me and many others it's just one of a long list of concerns. A few would be:
Corruption. Quite clearly rife in the EU, to the tune of over £100B annually by the EU's own admission.
Incompetence. No similar sized organisation would be allowed to be so unaccountable for its actions and performance.
Legal meddling. Trying to develop a one size fits all legal system to suit such diverse cultures and countries is the dream of the insane.
Uncontrolled growth and spending. We saw what happened the other year when they needed more money to piss up against the wall. It can only get worse.
The biggest worry? If they aren't stopped, or at least curtailed, the excesses will continue to grow until the whole of Europe is bankrupt. Think about how you will explain that to your grandkids if you vote to stay in.
Areas, where they cannot get council homes, yet other breeze in and get them. True or not that is what they belive. Many I have spoken with didn't even vote at the GE but they want to now. They feel what ever British Government we have not much changes, but this is something that any government cannot ignore if the vote is against our membership.
And yet again the EU`s accounts have been rejected by auditors for the 21st year in a row, with up to 4.5 billion pounds unaccounted for / miss spent, and yet with the exception of 3 countries of which the UK was one, all the other members have nodded the corrupt accounts through.
How could anyone with more than a few brain cells consider staying in an organization as corrupt as the EU (unless of course like most of the countries who nodded the false accounts through, they are on the take, or stand to gain financially through having unaudited accounts for yet another year) The sooner we are out of the EU the better.
How could anyone with more than a few brain cells consider staying in an organization as corrupt as the EU (unless of course like most of the countries who nodded the false accounts through, they are on the take, or stand to gain financially through having unaudited accounts for yet another year) The sooner we are out of the EU the better.
Problem is though, that if immigration is THE issue that gets those people to vote Leave then they're going to be disappointed.
In the event of Brexit then immigration is probably only going to drop to the level where it was when UKIP et al started griping about it, and/or the reality of any deal will mean that for quite some time freedom of movement will still be in place.
In the event of Brexit then immigration is probably only going to drop to the level where it was when UKIP et al started griping about it, and/or the reality of any deal will mean that for quite some time freedom of movement will still be in place.
Mr GrimNasty said:
Ayahuasca said:
A common 'stay in' bleat heard any number of times - e.g. Question Time this week - is, 'We have to stay in because otherwise we will lose the EU money that paid for this [point to local stadium/theatre/sports centre etc].
Where do these people think the EU got the money to 'pay for this'?
If we were independent we would have MORE money to 'pay for this'!
Why isn't the OUT campaign putting out this message more strongly?
People are stupid, who do they think paid for all those beautiful smooth sweeping near car-less roads all over the poorer Eu countries?Where do these people think the EU got the money to 'pay for this'?
If we were independent we would have MORE money to 'pay for this'!
Why isn't the OUT campaign putting out this message more strongly?
And then look at the state of our roads!
This comes down to the way the EU is run for the benefit of some countries at the expense of others. Shortly after the common market was formed France used money from the communal coffers to upgrade all its roads (to be fair after the war some were in an appalling condition, even as near as Calais) and of course to fund the CAP which being a significant farming country benefitted their farmers perhaps more than any other member state.
I often felt the UK should have said to the EU, we will not be paying this years membership fees, as we will be using that cash to upgrade our roads system.....Exactly like you did years ago. Only we never did.
the classic example has to be the Greek fiasco of last year. The EU paid billions of Euros to Greece, to keep that inefficient, backward, basket case country in the `club' but then rejected the requests of its second largest net contributor of funds into EU coffers for much needed reforms in the way it is run.
If that alone does not tell people that the UK needs to be out of that corrupt organization asap. I don't know what will?
Strange how the UK (and even Greece FFS!) got a surprise 1.7 billion pound bill (on top of its already excessive 55 million pound a day membership bill) last year from the EU, and yet surprise, surprise, France and Germany actually got cash paid to them, under the same`scheme' currently being operated by the EU. Funny that?
Yep agreed, frankly, it stinks. Obviously our hookers and drug dealers are more efficient than those in France and Germany. Surprising as the ones in Hamburg used to run around in Porsches.
Than before we get to the issue that the EU back counted the taxes over more years than even HMRC are permitted.
Than before we get to the issue that the EU back counted the taxes over more years than even HMRC are permitted.
Pan Pan Pan said:
And yet again the EU`s accounts have been rejected by auditors for the 21st year in a row, with up to 4.5 billion pounds unaccounted for / miss spent, and yet with the exception of 3 countries of which the UK was one, all the other members have nodded the corrupt accounts through.
How could anyone with more than a few brain cells consider staying in an organization as corrupt as the EU (unless of course like most of the countries who nodded the false accounts through, they are on the take, or stand to gain financially through having unaudited accounts for yet another year) The sooner we are out of the EU the better.
When the European Commission carried out a review into corruption in the EU, they were happy to publish sections detailing corruption in member states but refused to release the corresponding information on corruption in the EU itself.How could anyone with more than a few brain cells consider staying in an organization as corrupt as the EU (unless of course like most of the countries who nodded the false accounts through, they are on the take, or stand to gain financially through having unaudited accounts for yet another year) The sooner we are out of the EU the better.
For me gaining `some' control of our borders is just one of the reasons to be getting out of the EU, but reflecting on the ill informed, unfair,onerous duplicitous (and possibly corrupt) conditions under which the UK was `allowed' to join the Common Market in the first place, has always been one of the main reasons for voting to get out of what has now become the EU (something that not a single UK citizen has been given the opportunity to vote for or against..... Hopefully that is, until now)
If anyone took the time to examine the way it has been run for the benefit of some members much more than others, they would realize that it is not an organization for the fair minded.
If they looked at the so called `deals' done under its direction, they would realize it is corrupt. Who will believe that Camorons renegotiation deal (even if he had achieved the minor reforms he was asking for) will be adhered to by the EU, any more than Bliars giving away billions of the UK`s hard fought for EU rebate for amendments to the CAP, which were completely forgotten and ignored once the EU had secured the extra billions of UK taxpayers cash for eternity (or until we get out of there)
To me everything I know about the way the EU has been and is being run, screams get out of there now whilst we still can. The only people who want to remain could be the troughers, the relatively small number of individuals, compared to the many, making money out of its corrupt ways, at the UK taxpayers expense.
If anyone took the time to examine the way it has been run for the benefit of some members much more than others, they would realize that it is not an organization for the fair minded.
If they looked at the so called `deals' done under its direction, they would realize it is corrupt. Who will believe that Camorons renegotiation deal (even if he had achieved the minor reforms he was asking for) will be adhered to by the EU, any more than Bliars giving away billions of the UK`s hard fought for EU rebate for amendments to the CAP, which were completely forgotten and ignored once the EU had secured the extra billions of UK taxpayers cash for eternity (or until we get out of there)
To me everything I know about the way the EU has been and is being run, screams get out of there now whilst we still can. The only people who want to remain could be the troughers, the relatively small number of individuals, compared to the many, making money out of its corrupt ways, at the UK taxpayers expense.
FiF said:
Problem is though, that if immigration is THE issue that gets those people to vote Leave then they're going to be disappointed.
In the event of Brexit then immigration is probably only going to drop to the level where it was when UKIP et al started griping about it, and/or the reality of any deal will mean that for quite some time freedom of movement will still be in place.
care to quantify that?In the event of Brexit then immigration is probably only going to drop to the level where it was when UKIP et al started griping about it, and/or the reality of any deal will mean that for quite some time freedom of movement will still be in place.
UKIP's stated aim was to return net migration to the ~30,000 PA level of the pre-blair era.
that would be a dramatic change from the current levels.
Pan Pan Pan said:
And yet again the EU`s accounts have been rejected by auditors for the 21st year in a row, with up to 4.5 billion pounds unaccounted for / miss spent, and yet with the exception of 3 countries of which the UK was one, all the other members have nodded the corrupt accounts through.
How could anyone with more than a few brain cells consider staying in an organization as corrupt as the EU (unless of course like most of the countries who nodded the false accounts through, they are on the take, or stand to gain financially through having unaudited accounts for yet another year) The sooner we are out of the EU the better.
At this rate FIFA, the IAAF, the IOC and the UCI, will be cleaner than the EU, and they're all based in Switzerland!How could anyone with more than a few brain cells consider staying in an organization as corrupt as the EU (unless of course like most of the countries who nodded the false accounts through, they are on the take, or stand to gain financially through having unaudited accounts for yet another year) The sooner we are out of the EU the better.
How long long before the EU relocates to Geneva?
Northern Munkee said:
Pan Pan Pan said:
And yet again the EU`s accounts have been rejected by auditors for the 21st year in a row, with up to 4.5 billion pounds unaccounted for / miss spent, and yet with the exception of 3 countries of which the UK was one, all the other members have nodded the corrupt accounts through.
How could anyone with more than a few brain cells consider staying in an organization as corrupt as the EU (unless of course like most of the countries who nodded the false accounts through, they are on the take, or stand to gain financially through having unaudited accounts for yet another year) The sooner we are out of the EU the better.
At this rate FIFA, the IAAF, the IOC and the UCI, will be cleaner than the EU, and they're all based in Switzerland!How could anyone with more than a few brain cells consider staying in an organization as corrupt as the EU (unless of course like most of the countries who nodded the false accounts through, they are on the take, or stand to gain financially through having unaudited accounts for yet another year) The sooner we are out of the EU the better.
How long long before the EU relocates to Geneva?
They'd relocate but retain existing grandiose locations for some purpose or other.
I am not against immigration, far from I but with the EU we have to take both the cream, in small quantities and the crap in seemingly huge quantities. Now if we had control of our own boarder and destiny we could choose the cream from which ever country in the world we choose.
For me though is that time after time we have seen how corrupt the EU is and yet they investigate themselves, demand money when they feel like it and change things we will slavishly adhere to.
My brother lives in France and they say that sometimes the French agree to something knowing the English will implement it whilst they will ignore it.
It needs to change or we need to be out.
For me though is that time after time we have seen how corrupt the EU is and yet they investigate themselves, demand money when they feel like it and change things we will slavishly adhere to.
My brother lives in France and they say that sometimes the French agree to something knowing the English will implement it whilst they will ignore it.
It needs to change or we need to be out.
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