Caitlyn Jenner - Decline and Fall of the American Empire

[otolith]

Geopolitical influence, economic dominance?

[Pesty]

The fact a person wants to change gender does not signify the end of an empire to me.

Maybe that because of it she will earn 500 million a year signifies the end of something, I'm not sure what though,

http://www.nydailynews.com/entertainment/gossip/ca...


It's more that stories like this happen in 2015 that worries me. How and why and is it really an empire anyway?


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3109083/Fa...

[Esseesse]

Halb said:

Esseesse said:

I would agree it does. Not tosh, the west is in decline.

In what sense?

[Luke Warm]

[DuncanM]

TheExcession said:

JB! said:

Esseesse said:

hornet said:

ETA - I don't quite see how any of the above can be framed as the decline of an empire any more than the legalistion of gay marriage in Ireland? The celebrity element of it might grate, but having a positive, confident transgender role model will undoubtedly help many ordinary people going through similar issues.

Have you read Fate of Empires by Sir John Bagot Glubb? If not, an interesting read.

http://www.newworldeconomics.com/archives/2014/092...

Wow, awesome read, totally lost in this thread.

Agreed, a VERY good/interesting read. It needs a new thread all to itself, but where to begin? Books and literature? The Lounge? Where to post?

Just to add my thanks for posting that link, fantastically interesting

[Halb]

Esseesse said:

In an economic sense then?

[The Don of Croy]

DuncanM said:

TheExcession said:

JB! said:

Esseesse said:

hornet said:

ETA - I don't quite see how any of the above can be framed as the decline of an empire any more than the legalistion of gay marriage in Ireland? The celebrity element of it might grate, but having a positive, confident transgender role model will undoubtedly help many ordinary people going through similar issues.

Have you read Fate of Empires by Sir John Bagot Glubb? If not, an interesting read.

http://www.newworldeconomics.com/archives/2014/092...

Wow, awesome read, totally lost in this thread.

Agreed, a VERY good/interesting read. It needs a new thread all to itself, but where to begin? Books and literature? The Lounge? Where to post?

Just to add my thanks for posting that link, fantastically interesting

Very interesting. I'm not sure his points on women getting professional jobs and positions of influence is a message that has 'Great Ideas of 2015' written all over it, but in general there are some fascinating parallels.

I think Mark Steyn pushes a very similar theme in his books, but has more on death spiral/birthrates. Worth a read (and he needs the money).

[Esseesse]

The Don of Croy said:

Very interesting. I'm not sure his points on women getting professional jobs and positions of influence is a message that has 'Great Ideas of 2015' written all over it, but in general there are some fascinating parallels.

Indeed, although it's not really an idea as such. In case you're not aware Sir John Bagot Glubb was born in 1897 and died in 1986. Fate of Empires was published in 1978.

I suppose the argument is that what coincides with increasing influence of women is an undermining of the traditional family setup where you have a mum at home ensuring that the kids grow up to be useful people.

[krunchkin]

http://www.buzzfeed.com/skarlan/where-is-my-vanity...

[Luke Warm]

Esseesse said:

Have you read Fate of Empires by Sir John Bagot Glubb? If not, an interesting read.

http://www.newworldeconomics.com/archives/2014/092...

Very interesting. This bit is a bit worrying:

book said:

In this manner, at the height of vice and
frivolity the seeds of religious revival are
quietly sown. After, perhaps, several
generations (or even centuries) of suffering,
the impoverished nation has been purged of
its selfishness and its love of money, religion
regains its sway and a new era sets in. ‘It is
good for me that I have been afflicted,’ said
the psalmist, ‘that I might learn Thy
Statutes.’

[krunchkin]

Why licking the anus of a sexual partner has become a mainstream cultural trope in U.S. Pop culture

http://gawker.com/the-booty-eating-renaissance-163...

[mph1977]

pobs said:

Hey 4v6, Transgender woman here (not nolar before anyone says!). Been reading this thread with interest, feel free to ask me any questions you might want answers to.

he/she/it probably wouldnt dare ask you ...

the biggest transphobes and homophobes are usually those who are most insecure with their sexual and gender identities ...

ditto with those who express the most revulsion over involvement with other 'Kinky' stuff ...

[mph1977]

pobs said:

Type R Tom said:

I have a question, how do you refer to your life before you became a women? For example, with Jenner he won a gold medal as a man in a male event. Does this now become, as per Wikipedia, she won the 1976 gold medal for (mens) Decathlon? If you compare it to the example of someone going from a Mummy and a Daddy to Mummy and Mummy how can he still be the winner of the 1976 male decathlon?

I'm getting my flame proof suit ready, not try to be controversial / offensive, I'm genuinely interested.

Cripes good question. As a lifelong underachiever i'm not sure i'm really the best person to answer that one!
The last thing I won was £2 on the lottery after spending at least £30 on the damn things cos I had a dream about a scratch card... Anyways, personally, whilst talking about my life before I transitioned does make me feel uncomfortable, I don't deny it exists it - it did happen and it's part of who I am. My parents still have pictures of old me on the wall from many years ago (freaks my girlfriend out a treat! hehe). By the same token,I know a fair few men and women who have gone to great lengths to erase their pre-transition past. I know a huge amount of trans' people have miserable lives before they get themselves sorted so it probably pretty natural/necessary to want to get rid of your old footprint. I guess folk just do what they have to do to feel happy.

for a UK example of a person who has undergone transition - look up Stephanie Hirst ... who may be better known to some of you as Simon Hirst the radio DJ ... she has some interestign views on retaining / disposing parts of your past ...

[TKF]

mph1977 said:

for a UK example of a person who has undergone transition - look up Stephanie Hirst ... who may be better known to some of you as Simon Hirst the radio DJ ... she has some interestign views on retaining / disposing parts of your past ...

Preserving it in formaldehyde in a glass jar on the mantelpiece?

[davepoth]

Esseesse said:

You realise that graph only tells you that the total world GDP adds up to 100%, don't you? And why does it stop at 2003?

[pobs]

TKF said:

Preserving it in formaldehyde in a glass jar on the mantelpiece?

They don't let you, I asked. I wanted some unusual earrings. Apparently its
classed as a 'biohazard'...

[Luke Warm]

davepoth said:

You realise that graph only tells you that the total world GDP adds up to 100%, don't you? And why does it stop at 2003?

So Europe's share of world GDP could fall to 1% and it wouldn't matter?

[Impasse]

Nope. Still don't know who this person is or why I should care that they've had a sex change or even why they feel it necessary to tell everyone that they've had a sex change.

[davepoth]

Luke Warm said:

So Europe's share of world GDP could fall to 1% and it wouldn't matter?

Depends really - if world GDP rose by 10,000% I doubt you'd be especially bothered.

[TKF]

pobs said:

TKF said:

Preserving it in formaldehyde in a glass jar on the mantelpiece?

They don't let you, I asked. I wanted some unusual earrings. Apparently its
classed as a 'biohazard'...