The Next Conservative Budget

[edh]

IHT is a bit of a sideshow, but nonetheless shows the direction of travel of a Tory government... Prioritise the rich and property owners.

I still don't understand how I or anyone else can say that the massive rise in our house prices is a result of our hard work. This unearned and tax free increase in asset value is at the heart of the IHT debate.

Benefit cuts will do some serious damage. Tax credits are flawed, and have had serious unintended consequences, but the spurious notion that reductions in tax credits will be offset by an increase in IT thresholds is nonsense. Millions of tax credit recipients don't pay IT already. I don't see that wages will magically rise to fill the gap. How about raising Eers NI threshold on all jobs that pay the living wage?

Still, I understand that the Tories have now abolished poverty, so that's fine..

Further reductions to local government will cripple them - depends where you live of course as to how big the cuts are/ will be. Look at the damage to sports participation as a tiny example of how LA services are withering away.

[Welshbeef]

Buying a house scrimping hard - adding value new kitchens bathrooms windows doors ongoing upkeep carpets etc rewire

Spend spend spend all the tax from builders and companies selling stuff for your house v renting when there is drastically less/your landlord pays it instead.

[Gargamel]

edh said:

IHT is a bit of a sideshow, but nonetheless shows the direction of travel of a Tory government... Prioritise the rich and property owners.

I still don't understand how I or anyone else can say that the massive rise in our house prices is a result of our hard work. This unearned and tax free increase in asset value is at the heart of the IHT debate.

Benefit cuts will do some serious damage. Tax credits are flawed, and have had serious unintended consequences, but the spurious notion that reductions in tax credits will be offset by an increase in IT thresholds is nonsense. Millions of tax credit recipients don't pay IT already. I don't see that wages will magically rise to fill the gap. How about raising Eers NI threshold on all jobs that pay the living wage?

Still, I understand that the Tories have now abolished poverty, so that's fine..

Further reductions to local government will cripple them - depends where you live of course as to how big the cuts are/ will be. Look at the damage to sports participation as a tiny example of how LA services are withering away.

Should the Government fund Sports or the Arts ?

This is the fundamental reason why we have a bloated government, and too high taxation. Tax us less and we can pay for our own Sports and theatre tickets thanks.

I think the idea is that Tax Credits will start to apply at a lower level - say no one on £26,000 or more gets a TC. This won't affect those who earn below the Income tax threshold.

[edh]

Welshbeef said:

Buying a house scrimping hard - adding value new kitchens bathrooms windows doors ongoing upkeep carpets etc rewire

Spend spend spend all the tax from builders and companies selling stuff for your house v renting when there is drastically less/your landlord pays it instead.

and none of that matters much compared to stuff like the luck of being near a crossrail station. Much of the benefits of that massive state spending accrue to (untaxed) land values in the local area.

[edh]

Gargamel said:

Should the Government fund Sports or the Arts ?

This is the fundamental reason why we have a bloated government, and too high taxation. Tax us less and we can pay for our own Sports and theatre tickets thanks.

I think the idea is that Tax Credits will start to apply at a lower level - say no one on £26,000 or more gets a TC. This won't affect those who earn below the Income tax threshold.

Yes

Participation rates in sports are falling fastest among the poor. Closing swimming pools and football pitches isn't going to help.

Let's see who the TC cuts affect - and see if they fall mainly on "hard working families who do the right thing" (I hate those sorts of phrases)

[Dixy]

I hope the change in benefits will change the balance where it is better to have one job for 16 hours a week and benefits than a job for 40 hours and no benefits. Add to that the fact as an employer (particularly the supermarkets) it is cheaper to employ 2 people for 16 hours each than one for 32 hours.

[Boydie88]

Some talk on the radio this morning motorists are going to be hit hard with fuel and VED rises :/

[OzzyR1]

Boydie88 said:

Some talk on the radio this morning motorists are going to be hit hard with fuel and VED rises :/

Wouldn't surprise me in the slightest.

Despite the "greener is good" mantra, a lot more cars now fall in the £0-£30/year VED bracket and these cars are generally very easy on fuel too.

Must have created a hole in the projected tax take, just wonder what the excuse will be for raising it or whether they'll just hit older/thirstier cars even harder.

Whatever happens, I don't expect to come out of it well. Might stop using my old S-type R as a daily though...

[Negative Creep]

OzzyR1 said:

Boydie88 said:

Some talk on the radio this morning motorists are going to be hit hard with fuel and VED rises :/

Wouldn't surprise me in the slightest.

Despite the "greener is good" mantra, a lot more cars now fall in the £0-£30/year VED bracket and these cars are generally very easy on fuel too.

Must have created a hole in the projected tax take, just wonder what the excuse will be for raising it or whether they'll just hit older/thirstier cars even harder.

Whatever happens, I don't expect to come out of it well. Might stop using my old S-type R as a daily though...

Whoever would have thought that encouraging people to drive more econom9cal cars would have led to a drop in revenue......

[oyster]

The bias this government has towards the blue rinse brigade is what shocks me the most.

- Pensioner bonds
- Protect universal benefits
- Triple-lock state pension
- IHT threshold rise

The demographic of our society with the most wealth and lowest productivity is doing the least to help clear the deficit and debt.

[alock]

edh said:

Participation rates in sports are falling fastest among the poor. Closing swimming pools and football pitches isn't going to help.

It might sound harsh, but spending money to help the poor live longer does not make good economic sense

Short term NHS costs for an unhealthy population are dwarfed by long term care and pension costs of a healthy but ageing population.

[edh]

alock said:

edh said:

Participation rates in sports are falling fastest among the poor. Closing swimming pools and football pitches isn't going to help.

It might sound harsh, but spending money to help the poor live longer does not make good economic sense

Short term NHS costs for an unhealthy population are dwarfed by long term care and pension costs of a healthy but ageing population.

Not sure the "Logan's Run" approach will go down well with the core Tory vote..

[sugerbear]

alock said:

edh said:

Participation rates in sports are falling fastest among the poor. Closing swimming pools and football pitches isn't going to help.

It might sound harsh, but spending money to help the poor live longer does not make good economic sense

Short term NHS costs for an unhealthy population are dwarfed by long term care and pension costs of a healthy but ageing population.

It doesn't make economic sense to keep people alive after they retire. Are you advocating no NHS for the over 60's as well?

[Gargamel]

oyster said:

The bias this government has towards the blue rinse brigade is what shocks me the most.

- Pensioner bonds
- Protect universal benefits
- Triple-lock state pension
- IHT threshold rise

The demographic of our society with the most wealth and lowest productivity is doing the least to help clear the deficit and debt.

That is the core Tory vote....so it isn't a massive surprise. However the state pension is clearly something that we need to protect. arguing about in work benefits or swimming pools is one thing. Pensioners unable to afford to heat their housing or eat enough is a whole other thing.

Funny how when the left talk about the nasty tories attacking the most "vulnerable" in society, they fail to mention this aspect of Conservative policy.

[RAFsmoggy]

alock said:

It might sound harsh, but spending money to help the poor live longer does not make good economic sense

Short term NHS costs for an unhealthy population are dwarfed by long term care and pension costs of a healthy but ageing population.

Are you talking eugenics ?

[Axionknight]

RAFsmoggy said:

alock said:

It might sound harsh, but spending money to help the poor live longer does not make good economic sense

Short term NHS costs for an unhealthy population are dwarfed by long term care and pension costs of a healthy but ageing population.

Are you talking eugenics ?

As a curious tid bit, Winston Churchill was all for it in his early days, he called for the sterilisation of "tramps and ne'er do wells" I believe.

Forced labour camps too.

[Timmy40]

Gargamel said:

oyster said:

The bias this government has towards the blue rinse brigade is what shocks me the most.

- Pensioner bonds
- Protect universal benefits
- Triple-lock state pension
- IHT threshold rise

The demographic of our society with the most wealth and lowest productivity is doing the least to help clear the deficit and debt.

That is the core Tory vote....so it isn't a massive surprise. However the state pension is clearly something that we need to protect. arguing about in work benefits or swimming pools is one thing. Pensioners unable to afford to heat their housing or eat enough is a whole other thing.

Funny how when the left talk about the nasty tories attacking the most "vulnerable" in society, they fail to mention this aspect of Conservative policy.

It's the core vote of all major parties I'm afraid. the fact is that the over 50's have huge voting power. And they tend to actually turn out and vote.

[alock]

RAFsmoggy said:

Are you talking eugenics ?

and

sugerbear said:

Are you advocating no NHS for the over 60's as well?

I hope the smiley in my original post was taken in the correct way.

Seriously though, I don't think it's the governments job to try and force or even encourage people to maximise their life span. It's the governments job to provide a sensible framework for a functional society. If people choose to live a care-free life and die young then it's their choice. Likewise if people choose to maximise their life span then that's is their choice as well.

A government telling people there is a correct way to live is wrong. This is especially true when this 'approved' way will put a huge financial burden on future generations.

[Timmy40]

Boydie88 said:

Some talk on the radio this morning motorists are going to be hit hard with fuel and VED rises :/

There's been a lot of spin around diesel cars being the new evil, I imagine that was to soften us up for higher taxes/duty on diesel, offset with a 'generous incentive' to buy an electric car ( which will be fiscally a tiny give away ), and the BBC Graduan Green Blob will lap it up too.

[TurboHatchback]

Inheritance is one area I disagree with the Conservative ideology, I would be all for 100% inheritance tax and hugely reduced income tax to compensate. Inheritance coupled with property prices is one of the main drivers of inequality, rich families stay rich and get richer while those born poor will never attain true wealth or own their own homes so will never pass anything on so the cycle continues.

Obviously my viewpoint is biased as I won't inherit a penny but from an academic standpoint it would be much fairer for society in general to have penal rates of inheritance tax and use the resulting revenue to cut taxes on work, hugely raise the income tax threshold etc to reward achievement rather than just being born rich. I couldn't care less what happens to my wealth when I die but having most of my income taken as tax while I'm alive is displeasing.

Pretty much everything else (rumoured) in the budget sounds good to me. Bring on the benefit cuts .