Discussion
eccles said:
HRL said:
eccles said:
HRL said:
I wouldn't love it but I'd do what most of us would do if unhappy at work, find another job.
Most of us? Care to qualify that staement, or have you just made that up?If you don't like your job, find another one. It's really not a difficult concept to grasp, well, for everyone else at least.
Hackney said:
johnfm said:
Hackney said:
johnfm said:
It isn't the 'workers voices' though in most cases. It is the 'union voices' on a mandate of a small percentage of the workforce.
In this case, indefensible strike action.
This again?In this case, indefensible strike action.
Why should the majority of a workforce suffer for the actions of a minority? If a workforce is going to walk off a job, there should be curbs on a militant minority causing the other workers grief - not to mention other effects of indefensible strike action.
How difficult is it to appreciate the difference between the mandate of a binary choice (yes or no) and the mandate of a choice made from many choices?
The fact is that IF a union only acts for 40% of the workforce, I can't see how the other 60% are being represented by strike action of a minority.
roachcoach said:
eccles said:
blindswelledrat said:
As an aside, if TFL wanted to tackle this once and for all - what are the laws about getting rid of the current workforce?
COuld they legally say that as of next January a tube worker's salary is £30k and that all employees are welcome to keep their job or accept redundancy?
Yay!, back to Victorian times! Bet you'd love it if they decided to do that with your job!COuld they legally say that as of next January a tube worker's salary is £30k and that all employees are welcome to keep their job or accept redundancy?
You think contractors are never told near renewal "your day rate is cut, like it or lump it"?
turbobloke said:
eccles said:
HRL said:
eccles said:
HRL said:
I wouldn't love it but I'd do what most of us would do if unhappy at work, find another job.
Most of us? Care to qualify that staement, or have you just made that up?If you don't like your job, find another one. It's really not a difficult concept to grasp, well, for everyone else at least.
eccles said:
turbobloke said:
eccles said:
HRL said:
eccles said:
HRL said:
I wouldn't love it but I'd do what most of us would do if unhappy at work, find another job.
Most of us? Care to qualify that staement, or have you just made that up?If you don't like your job, find another one. It's really not a difficult concept to grasp, well, for everyone else at least.
My daughter is going to be caught up in this - along with many other Londoners, obviously. It's her third day of her new job after moving to the capital at the weekend (and is on nowhere near the wage of a tube driver!). So she's concerned about the logistics and potential extra expense of getting to and from work less than 48 hours after purchasing an annual travel pass.
Welcome to London, Kiddo.
Welcome to London, Kiddo.
eccles said:
roachcoach said:
eccles said:
blindswelledrat said:
As an aside, if TFL wanted to tackle this once and for all - what are the laws about getting rid of the current workforce?
COuld they legally say that as of next January a tube worker's salary is £30k and that all employees are welcome to keep their job or accept redundancy?
Yay!, back to Victorian times! Bet you'd love it if they decided to do that with your job!COuld they legally say that as of next January a tube worker's salary is £30k and that all employees are welcome to keep their job or accept redundancy?
You think contractors are never told near renewal "your day rate is cut, like it or lump it"?
You think no-one since victorian times has had the "look, the business is really toiling, we're needing you to do x, y or z which you didn't do before and we can't afford to give you more cash. I'm sorry, but it's that or we go under" conversation?
Or the more common approach to the larger private sector areas:
"We've let X team go, you're now responsible for this, too."
"...but we're already under resourced"
"You let me worry about that, just crack on as best you can"
Because I can assure you, it happens everywhere on a pretty common basis.
roachcoach said:
eccles said:
roachcoach said:
eccles said:
blindswelledrat said:
As an aside, if TFL wanted to tackle this once and for all - what are the laws about getting rid of the current workforce?
COuld they legally say that as of next January a tube worker's salary is £30k and that all employees are welcome to keep their job or accept redundancy?
Yay!, back to Victorian times! Bet you'd love it if they decided to do that with your job!COuld they legally say that as of next January a tube worker's salary is £30k and that all employees are welcome to keep their job or accept redundancy?
You think contractors are never told near renewal "your day rate is cut, like it or lump it"?
You think no-one since victorian times has had the "look, the business is really toiling, we're needing you to do x, y or z which you didn't do before and we can't afford to give you more cash. I'm sorry, but it's that or we go under" conversation?
Or the more common approach to the larger private sector areas:
"We've let X team go, you're now responsible for this, too."
"...but we're already under resourced"
"You let me worry about that, just crack on as best you can"
Because I can assure you, it happens everywhere on a pretty common basis.
Yes, most companies at some point have made your points to permanent staff at some point in their time, and I'm sure most staff have willingly gone the extra mile tp preserve their job.
The point I'm making is to those people who just say sack them and re-emply them/others on less, be careful what you wish for, it could happen to you.
eccles said:
roachcoach said:
eccles said:
roachcoach said:
eccles said:
blindswelledrat said:
As an aside, if TFL wanted to tackle this once and for all - what are the laws about getting rid of the current workforce?
COuld they legally say that as of next January a tube worker's salary is £30k and that all employees are welcome to keep their job or accept redundancy?
Yay!, back to Victorian times! Bet you'd love it if they decided to do that with your job!COuld they legally say that as of next January a tube worker's salary is £30k and that all employees are welcome to keep their job or accept redundancy?
You think contractors are never told near renewal "your day rate is cut, like it or lump it"?
You think no-one since victorian times has had the "look, the business is really toiling, we're needing you to do x, y or z which you didn't do before and we can't afford to give you more cash. I'm sorry, but it's that or we go under" conversation?
Or the more common approach to the larger private sector areas:
"We've let X team go, you're now responsible for this, too."
"...but we're already under resourced"
"You let me worry about that, just crack on as best you can"
Because I can assure you, it happens everywhere on a pretty common basis.
Yes, most companies at some point have made your points to permanent staff at some point in their time, and I'm sure most staff have willingly gone the extra mile tp preserve their job.
The point I'm making is to those people who just say sack them and re-emply them/others on less, be careful what you wish for, it could happen to you.
So then I left them out as it irked you and they are "different"...
Anyway the point I responded to is about "here's your new wage, take it or leave" which is applicable to the contractors I first mentioned alongside the corollary of permies being told you have new responsibilities for the same money - it is entirely analogous to "here is less money for the same job, don't like it? Quit".
Point being this happens day in, day out all over the world and not as was suggested, confined to the victorian era.
Edited by roachcoach on Wednesday 5th August 14:09
roachcoach said:
eccles said:
roachcoach said:
eccles said:
roachcoach said:
eccles said:
blindswelledrat said:
As an aside, if TFL wanted to tackle this once and for all - what are the laws about getting rid of the current workforce?
COuld they legally say that as of next January a tube worker's salary is £30k and that all employees are welcome to keep their job or accept redundancy?
Yay!, back to Victorian times! Bet you'd love it if they decided to do that with your job!COuld they legally say that as of next January a tube worker's salary is £30k and that all employees are welcome to keep their job or accept redundancy?
You think contractors are never told near renewal "your day rate is cut, like it or lump it"?
You think no-one since victorian times has had the "look, the business is really toiling, we're needing you to do x, y or z which you didn't do before and we can't afford to give you more cash. I'm sorry, but it's that or we go under" conversation?
Or the more common approach to the larger private sector areas:
"We've let X team go, you're now responsible for this, too."
"...but we're already under resourced"
"You let me worry about that, just crack on as best you can"
Because I can assure you, it happens everywhere on a pretty common basis.
Yes, most companies at some point have made your points to permanent staff at some point in their time, and I'm sure most staff have willingly gone the extra mile tp preserve their job.
The point I'm making is to those people who just say sack them and re-emply them/others on less, be careful what you wish for, it could happen to you.
Point being this happens day in, day out all over the world and not as was suggested, confined to the victorian era.
eccles said:
blindswelledrat said:
As an aside, if TFL wanted to tackle this once and for all - what are the laws about getting rid of the current workforce?
COuld they legally say that as of next January a tube worker's salary is £30k and that all employees are welcome to keep their job or accept redundancy?
Yay!, back to Victorian times! Bet you'd love it if they decided to do that with your job!COuld they legally say that as of next January a tube worker's salary is £30k and that all employees are welcome to keep their job or accept redundancy?
The fact that there isn't a 'better company' for the tube workers to work for is exactly why it is self evident that the unions of the workers have spent the past 20 years completely perverting all logical laws of market forces. To get a similar job they would have to go elsewhere and work for approximately half the salary/benefits.
I don't actually mind them fighting for better conditions. It's human nature. But they have taken it too far for too long and enough is enough. To earn more than double your peers and still f
king whinge about it is the behaviour of someone who needs a slap, not a pay rise.blindswelledrat said:
eccles said:
blindswelledrat said:
As an aside, if TFL wanted to tackle this once and for all - what are the laws about getting rid of the current workforce?
COuld they legally say that as of next January a tube worker's salary is £30k and that all employees are welcome to keep their job or accept redundancy?
Yay!, back to Victorian times! Bet you'd love it if they decided to do that with your job!COuld they legally say that as of next January a tube worker's salary is £30k and that all employees are welcome to keep their job or accept redundancy?
The fact that there isn't a 'better company' for the tube workers to work for is exactly why it is self evident that the unions of the workers have spent the past 20 years completely perverting all logical laws of market forces. To get a similar job they would have to go elsewhere and work for approximately half the salary/benefits.
I don't actually mind them fighting for better conditions. It's human nature. But they have taken it too far for too long and enough is enough. To earn more than double your peers and still f
king whinge about it is the behaviour of someone who needs a slap, not a pay rise.eccles said:
blindswelledrat said:
eccles said:
blindswelledrat said:
As an aside, if TFL wanted to tackle this once and for all - what are the laws about getting rid of the current workforce?
COuld they legally say that as of next January a tube worker's salary is £30k and that all employees are welcome to keep their job or accept redundancy?
Yay!, back to Victorian times! Bet you'd love it if they decided to do that with your job!COuld they legally say that as of next January a tube worker's salary is £30k and that all employees are welcome to keep their job or accept redundancy?
The fact that there isn't a 'better company' for the tube workers to work for is exactly why it is self evident that the unions of the workers have spent the past 20 years completely perverting all logical laws of market forces. To get a similar job they would have to go elsewhere and work for approximately half the salary/benefits.
I don't actually mind them fighting for better conditions. It's human nature. But they have taken it too far for too long and enough is enough. To earn more than double your peers and still f
king whinge about it is the behaviour of someone who needs a slap, not a pay rise.Average length of stay in a company by a person in London working in the private sector is circa 24 months, before they move on and negotiate a better deal with another company, thats how they get better deals with wages.
Some people don't want to move on and stay but don't usually progress up the ranks as quick.
eccles said:
blindswelledrat said:
eccles said:
blindswelledrat said:
As an aside, if TFL wanted to tackle this once and for all - what are the laws about getting rid of the current workforce?
COuld they legally say that as of next January a tube worker's salary is £30k and that all employees are welcome to keep their job or accept redundancy?
Yay!, back to Victorian times! Bet you'd love it if they decided to do that with your job!COuld they legally say that as of next January a tube worker's salary is £30k and that all employees are welcome to keep their job or accept redundancy?
The fact that there isn't a 'better company' for the tube workers to work for is exactly why it is self evident that the unions of the workers have spent the past 20 years completely perverting all logical laws of market forces. To get a similar job they would have to go elsewhere and work for approximately half the salary/benefits.
I don't actually mind them fighting for better conditions. It's human nature. But they have taken it too far for too long and enough is enough. To earn more than double your peers and still f
king whinge about it is the behaviour of someone who needs a slap, not a pay rise.Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff