Jeremy Corbyn

[don4l]

I never thought that write this post, but here goes.

I actually feel sorry for Corbyn.

I don't usually like lefties, but he has behaved with dignity and honour.

He didn't engage in point scoring in the Commons.


He did not deserve the comments that Cameron made.

[bitchstewie]

don4l said:

I never thought that write this post, but here goes.

I actually feel sorry for Corbyn.

I don't usually like lefties, but he has behaved with dignity and honour.

He didn't engage in point scoring in the Commons.


He did not deserve the comments that Cameron made.

Quite.

I don't like his politics but from what I do know of him at least the guy appears to have some principles.

[technodup]

VolvoT5 said:

Clearly Jeremy isn't a great leader but given the choice between him and a plastic Blairite clone it is not hard to see why Labour members have voted for him. He is honest, principled and for people who care to look past the style the substance of what he is saying is often spot on.

This is bks that needs called out. He has been anti EU for decades. He is clearly still anti EU. And yet now he is leader he campaigns (albeit half heartedly) for remain.

That is not honest. It's definitely not principled. He's a turncoat scumbag with some dangerous views masquerading as a bumbling old geography teacher.

And long may he reign over Labour.

[Stickyfinger]

That is like saying telling a skunk he has a really nice fluffy tail as it walks into your house

[Derek Smith]

s2art said:

Derek Smith said:

Corbyn is traditional labour. Everything else in politics is neo-liberal. His appeal is to those who see an alternative to the current capitalist set-up.

Isnt it more complex than that? Old Labour were a mixture of socialist models. The hard left looked to Marx, the soft left looked to, for the want of a better term, the Methodist tradition. Friendly/building societies, the Co-op etc.

Corbyn is revolutionary Marxist at his core. Protests and direct action are more his thing. And that bunch of looneys are exactly what the idiot Miliband let in with his £3 membership.

I know what you mean and agree with it. My experience was with the non-religious Methodists. In those days the expectations were that they had gone round a corner and the future looked bright. A reward for the sacrifices though the war. There was a degree of resentment, often vocalised, of those who believed what Churchill said to win his only election victory, and against a very sick Atlee.

I also met some 'revolutionaries', those who believed there could be no change without the toppling of those in power. Most labour people derided them, pointing out that the poor had never been closer to the rich, and, the biggest thing at the time, education was free. The quiet revolution was on line. Atlee was as great a revolution as Thatcher, and many suggest the greater.

Free education, available on merit, was seen as the great leveller. To a great extent it was. I wonder what the non-religious Methodists would say now.

I thought Corbyn rather ineffectual but he's in position and he's staying, so perhaps I underestimated him.

Edited by Derek Smith on Wednesday 29th June 18:48

[don4l]

Good news!

Angela Eagle looks set to stand for the Labour leadership.

She will be as good as Corbyn, or Foot, but without the decency.

Labour membership is surging tonight. Are you allowed to join Labour if you are also a member of UKIP?

Apparently, the answer is YES!

£3.00. It's a bargain.

Zod, do your duty. I know that you want to see a Conservative government after the next election.

[hidetheelephants]

Derek Smith said:

I know what you mean and agree with it. My experience was with the non-religious Methodists. In those days the expectations were that they had gone round a corner and the future looked bright. A reward for the sacrifices though the war. There was a degree of resentment, often vocalised, of those who believed what Churchill said to win his only election victory, and against a very sick Atlee.

I also met some 'revolutionaries', those who believed there could be no change without the toppling of those in power. Most labour people derided them, pointing out that the poor had never been closer to the rich, and, the biggest thing at the time, education was free. The quiet revolution was on line. Atlee was as great a revolution as Thatcher, and many suggest the greater.

Free education, available on merit, was seen as the great leveller. To a great extent it was. I wonder what the non-religious Methodists would say now.

I thought Corbyn rather ineffectual but he's in position and he's staying, so perhaps I underestimated him.

Edited by Derek Smith on Wednesday 29th June 18:48

Postwar butskellism, it lead a long period of political stability and economic growth, discontent only really emerging when the wheels fell off in the 1970s.

[VolvoT5]

I can't help but feel Labour are screwed whatever they do. They have lost Scotland to the SNP and outside of Scotland much of their traditional base has split to UKIP, Plaid, etc.

They have basically become a 2 wing party, one wing of traditional hard lefties and another of Blarites / metropolitan soft left. Neither wing can appeal to the previously mentioned voters that they need to win back.

In England the Tories have a majority and Cameron has moved the party over (at least in perception) towards the centre ground. There is not really a whole lot of difference between the policies Cameron and Osbourne pursue and what the likes of Liz Kendall or Chuka Umunna would argue for.
The difference is the Tories have the right leaning press and huge business donors on their side.

The PLP are perfectly within their rights to reject Corbyn but they have gone about it in all the wrong way. They should have picked a unity candidate (apparently they may have finally settled on Angela Eagle) and challenged him to a contest. It is then up to both sides to put their argument to the members. Instead they have tried to bully him into quitting which is just plain wrong and extremely damaging.

Politics in the UK at the moment is in deep st IMO. Zombie government, no opposition, nutty Scot Nats and UKIP running wild. Just not good.

[VolvoT5]

technodup said:

his is bks that needs called out. He has been anti EU for decades. He is clearly still anti EU. And yet now he is leader he campaigns (albeit half heartedly) for remain.

And why do you think he campaigned for IN? Because the PLP put such huge pressure on him to do so... ironically he was trying to keep the party united and avoid this kind of revolt. One could argue his half-hearted campaign was at least honest - he didn't really like the EU but felt it was best for the country overall.

[johnxjsc1985]

hidetheelephants said:

ostwar butskellism, it lead a long period of political stability and economic growth, discontent only really emerging when the wheels fell off in the 1970s.

the emergence of "militant" again from the 80's the conviction Politics that sends out 33,000 redundancy notices to Council workers. They have the principals its the people that have to suffer the consequences.
That type of politics and the likes of Corbyn should have been consigned to the history books

[Axionknight]

Corbyn will decimate anybody they can find to stand against him, which won't be anybody good because all those with future ambitions will be keeping their head down.

[K12beano]

You know "they" always say:


A week's a long time in politics


Well tomorrow's that week (and my last day of work for a while with a summer sabbatical) so it would round of the week nicely when this chapter finishes blowing up and we can get back to the proper problems of the nation.... 'cos we can't hear those for all the chatter.....

[johnxjsc1985]

If he remains he will win because he has the Momentum crew they have his back. I suspect then the vast majority of MP's will refuse to work with him and the fun will start.

[technodup]

VolvoT5 said:

technodup said:

his is bks that needs called out. He has been anti EU for decades. He is clearly still anti EU. And yet now he is leader he campaigns (albeit half heartedly) for remain.

And why do you think he campaigned for IN? Because the PLP put such huge pressure on him to do so...

And he sold out his principles at the first time of asking. On the most important issue of a generation.

Being leader is going to involve pressure, from various angles. PM even more so. If he sells out so easily... ah fk it, I'm away to pay £3 to keep him in.

[GoodOlBoy]

VolvoT5 said:

technodup said:

his is bks that needs called out. He has been anti EU for decades. He is clearly still anti EU. And yet now he is leader he campaigns (albeit half heartedly) for remain.

And why do you think he campaigned for IN? Because the PLP put such huge pressure on him to do so... ironically he was trying to keep the party united and avoid this kind of revolt. One could argue his half-hearted campaign was at least honest - he didn't really like the EU but felt it was best for the country overall.

How can campaigning for something you don't believe in be construed as honest, particularly on the most important subject for decades?

I had Jeremy marked down as a sort of cut-price Tony Benn. Someone who's integrity you could respect even if you didn't agree with his politics.

Jeremy has been openly anti-EU for a long time. He would have served the country, and as it turns out himself, better if he'd stayed true to his own principles.

If he does put himself back up for re-election he should make his stance on the EU absolutely clear.

[glazbagun]

technodup said:

And he sold out his principles at the first time of asking. On the most important issue of a generation.

Being leader is going to involve pressure, from various angles. PM even more so. If he sells out so easily...

He'll be like Boris?

[davepoth]

JC is currently on BBC News doing a speech to Momentum. Quite a few hecklers, but he's utterly unrepentant. You have to hand it to him, he's sticking to his guns. It's going to result in a one-party state, but he's sticking to his guns.

[johnxjsc1985]

davepoth said:

JC is currently on BBC News doing a speech to Momentum. Quite a few hecklers, but he's utterly unrepentant. You have to hand it to him, he's sticking to his guns. It's going to result in a one-party state, but he's sticking to his guns.

Never been a Labour voter but I have admired many of their MP's .What is happening now is revenge for the Blair years when the left were consigned to meeting in phone boxes.
I find it very sad.

[glazbagun]

davepoth said:

JC is currently on BBC News doing a speech to Momentum. Quite a few hecklers, but he's utterly unrepentant. You have to hand it to him, he's sticking to his guns. It's going to result in a one-party state, but he's sticking to his guns.

As someone who tends to take rejection and criticism to heart, his ability to not give a st seems superhuman to me, but that's politicians I guess. I cannot imagine lucking myself into a position I couldn't be sacked from and then refusing to go when everyone is screaming for my head.

[johnxjsc1985]

glazbagun said:

As someone who tends to take rejection and criticism to heart, his ability to not give a st seems superhuman to me, but that's politicians I guess. I cannot imagine lucking myself into a position I couldn't be sacked from and then refusing to go when everyone is screaming for my head.

Sounds like a job advert for the England Football Manager