Jeremy Corbyn

[jakesmith]

AstonZagato said:

He wants the disaffected Labour MPs to split from the party and leave the infrastructure of a major political party with a bunch of far-left activists. He is playing a different game (well the people pulling his strings are). He is a puppet. He was well chosen for being thick and thick-skinned. He is perfect for the role they need.

This is the best and most insightful post I've read for ages

[essayer]

I find it disconcerting that over 9 million people voted for MPs who are now judged "Blairite scum" by the party they belong to. If they were deselected and replaced with Comrades, would the people vote in the same way?

[CrutyRammers]

essayer said:

I find it disconcerting that over 9 million people voted for MPs who are now judged "Blairite scum" by the party they belong to. If they were deselected and replaced with Comrades, would the people vote in the same way?

Probably, lots of them. Because labour, innit.

[avinalarf]

essayer said:

Halb said:

I've read it.
Erm.
The MP was 'abused'? In the report it says some bloke accused her of working hand in hand with a paper.
That's the slur is it?

I'm actually not sure what is going on any more !

Re. Corbyn comparing Jewish people to ISIS, he said

Corbyn said:

Our Jewish friends are no more responsible for the actions of Israel or the Netanyahu government than our Muslim friends are for those various self-styled Islamic states or organisations.

I understand that's potentially a bit of a slur on the Israeli government, but I don't interpret that as insult to all Jewish people. (And everyone in the room clapped when he said it!)

Edited by essayer on Thursday 30th June 16:55

The point to me is that it appears to be impossible for the hard left to have a conversation about anti semitism without mentioning Israel.
His language was ,at least ,very clumsy in the context of the particular debate which was to hear and comment on the report by Shami Chakrabati.
Indeed his comments highlighted the very root of the problem i.e. the conflation of the actions of the present Israeli government with all Jews.
There is obviously a legitimate discussion to be had about the present Israeli government and the plight of the Palestinians but this was not the time or place and as I have said before it is an extremely complex problem the solution of which is not helped by clumsy sound bites.
The irony is that ISIS has killed and maimed more Muslims and created more turmoil that any Israeli government.

[Halb]

Johnnytheboy said:

The Labour membership will not stand for Dan Jarvis.
Despite being obviously electable, he is Blairite scum and must be eradicated from the party.
Just in case it ends up, you know, electable.

I didn't think he was/is consider a Blairite?

Sway said:

To be fair to Halb, we cross paths on quite a few threads on here - we share many common interests above cars (although a fight would be like the mountain vs oberon... ) and I took it as such.
I did mean to reply - she conforms to her father's view on feminism too (one of the main reasons his wife left him), so she may be fit, but I'd have to see through the Hagrid levels of follicle coverage to make a judgement. The sister on the other hand...

Ta, Sway.

Andy Zarse said:

Then there's this from Twitter;
"Emily Thornberry phoned Israeli ambassador in London to apologise for any offence caused by Corbyn remarks today."
How inept do you have to be to organise a meeting to present your anti-semitism report and end up causing diplomatic offence!

Words fail m

AstonZagato said:

He wants the disaffected Labour MPs to split from the party and leave the infrastructure of a major political party with a bunch of far-left activists. He is playing a different game (well the people pulling his strings are). He is a puppet. He was well chosen for being thick and thick-skinned. He is perfect for the role they need.

Wow, now that's a Dorne plan.

[johnxjsc1985]

I tried to join the Labour Party but when they asked me to scream "Jeremy-Jeremy-Jeremy" they said I did not have a high enough pitch to my voice and refused my membership.
Sadly the Labour party has gone and has been taken over by Momentum and the likes and Bananaramma.

[technodup]

Halb said:

I didn't think he was/is consider a Blairite?

I think they consider anyone not on the Corbyn bus as a Blairite.

[Derek Smith]

230TE said:

I agree that the history of the SDP doesn't give a lot of hope to any Labour MPs thinking of breaking away. But most of them, as far as I can tell, aren't Leftists. There used to be a lot more hard Left Labour MPs, but most of those are dead now. They're fairly moderate, middle of the road social democrats, and the Momentum mob will try to get shot of them regardless. The only thing they have on their side is time, thanks to the fixed term parliament system (assuming that holds).

As for the newspapers, I've always thought they tend to follow opinion more than lead it. Even my Tory friends think Labour's self-destruction is bad for the country, and I just can't see any way it will change under the current rules. Replace Corbyn with McDonnell? Well, it might pick up a few votes from people who don't like beards.

Thanks for that. I see your point and hope that it is true.

As you say, the fixed term parliament is a factor. In normal circumstances, a split in the labour camp might have made it worthwhile to take one of the options to dissolve, but before exit negotiations I think would be hammered by voters.

I hope that there can be a valid new force of centre left or right. Or even centre/centre come to that.

It's odd, isn't it. The tory party is a shambles, and labour pick this time to copy them.

[Smollet]

Watching This Week last night and some woman who was an ardent Corbynite seemed to have no grasp of reality of what was happening around her. Therein lies the problem with the current Labour leadership.Idealism over realism.

[anonymous-user]

Derek Smith said:

Te tory party is a shambles

On what basis?

[mikebradford]

Slightly of topic

But just received this letter from my kids school. Giving 4 days notice to industrial action by the NUT. I cant help think their timing is terrible.
Do they feel this is the best moment to push their issue?
When the country has bigger issues, and presumably the labour party that i imagine they are most closely associated with have need to get their act in order.

Am i missing the point completely?

I wonder if we are likely to see more unions organising strikes etc , maybe to divert attention away from the Labour Party in house issues?

[Halb]

Derek Smith said:

It's odd, isn't it. The tory party is a shambles, and labour pick this time to copy them.

For the ilk of Benn, Umna and the rest, it's probably the best time, Corbyn is too strong, try to bully and badger him out now with every dirty trick in the book, and rebuild why the Torys are weak.

https://www.buzzfeed.com/jimwaterson/the-mystery-o...

[Derek Smith]

Halb said:

For the ilk of Benn, Umna and the rest, it's probably the best time, Corbyn is too strong, try to bully and badger him out now with every dirty trick in the book, and rebuild why the Torys are weak.

https://www.buzzfeed.com/jimwaterson/the-mystery-o...

Can't believe that. I would require planning.

[Derek Smith]

janesmith1950 said:

Derek Smith said:

Te tory party is a shambles

On what basis?

I'm not sure what the question means, but I guess you don't think it is.

We have a generally pro EU remain party now destined to take us out. We have a squabble about leadership, which will continue for some time.

All the candidates have sections of the party against their candidacy and will not put themselves forward. There will be words said that will come back to haunt them.

The most well-know tory leader has put up a big black.

Cameron did not want May to be leader but his actions have almost guaranteed it.

Over the weeks to come the country will be focused on the fight for the tory leadership. The one for the labour leadership will be a side show. Who cares? They are not going to get voted in.

The whole referendum was ill-thought-out. A disaster for all concerned. There will be blame and it won't be headed towards labour.

[turbobloke]

Derek Smith said:

There will be blame and it won't be headed towards labour.

Thank you for contacting the Labour Party.

We are currently experiencing an existential crisis and there is nobody here to reply.

Please wait on hold for a long time as we don't expect to be in (the) office any time soon.

[Sway]

Derek Smith said:

Halb said:

For the ilk of Benn, Umna and the rest, it's probably the best time, Corbyn is too strong, try to bully and badger him out now with every dirty trick in the book, and rebuild why the Torys are weak.

https://www.buzzfeed.com/jimwaterson/the-mystery-o...

Can't believe that. I would require planning.

Or Prince Tone is pulling strings to get him out before Chilcot...

We do know the two Princes of Darkness are more than capable of long term planning!

[berty37]

Smollet said:

Watching This Week last night and some woman who was an ardent Corbynite seemed to have no grasp of reality of what was happening around her. Therein lies the problem with the current Labour leadership.Idealism over realism.

A very good point Smollet. Ties in with what a few are saying about Corbyn and the hard left - being in govt actually isnt really in their aim. My Dad has been a loyal Labour party supporter all his life right through from Michael foot to Kinnock and Blair and Brown and yes voted for Miliband too (even though he thought David was clearly the smarter choice) but when the recent councillors paid a visit and he said to them 'I will never ever vote for Labour while that utterly disloyal W*nker is in charge' it really told me at what is happening in the Labour party now not just because of my Dad. There are a lot of people who clearly want to distance themselves from Blair which I understand but the obvious point is still not glaring many of the apparent 'party faithful' in the face. He was the only person that got Labour in govt and won three general elections and at least gave the party's goals and aspirations a chance to be put into practice. It is often said in politics oppositions do not win elections, Governments lose them but in the case of 1997 I think really for the first time the opposite was true. The hard left are just as arrogant as the right as they think people want their idealism but the truth is on election day they resoundingly reject it.They did then in the late 70's and 80's and they do now.
Can someone tell me what was the real reason Chuka Unuma pulled out of the leadership race? I know he put it down to intrusion into his and his family's private life but a man of his intellect must of known when you put yourself up for that sort of public service that goes with the territory.

[rich1231]

It appears Corbyn was alaready matey with the guy at the press conference yesterday.

http://order-order.com/2016/07/01/corbyn-laughs-jo...

I cannot see any option but to split the party. Momentum's unfiltration is all powerful now.

[mikebradford]

Corbyn is walking a tight rope, and the media gaffs of late are more likely to be his downfall than actual policy.
My gut feeling is that hes going to dig in and revert to Labour of old, causing as much anarchy as possible, to appeal to his hard left core.

Regardless of the Conservative vote, and if they manage to stabilise opinion and lead the country to as smooth an exit from the EU as possible.
This current Labour government is going to try and destabilise the country as a whole. Ultimately at the expense of everyone in it.

[Garvin]

Derek Smith said:

<snip> Cameron did not want May to be leader but his actions have almost guaranteed it.<snip>

I think Gove's actions in torpedoing BoJo are probably more to blame! I can't believe Gove thinks he has a realistic chance so his actions can only be to prevent BoJo becoming leader and PM! But did Gove do this off his own bat because he truly believes Boris is not up to the job, or is it part of a collective senior Tory MPs 'stop Boris' plan. Or is Gove still matey with Cameron (despite his cabinet demotion) that he has done in Boris on Cameron's behalf. If the latter, then perhaps you are correct!