Discussion
davepoth said:
Burwood said:
And what services does my warehouse use? I'll tell you. Zero. I pay a service charge for everything to the owner. The council do nit even take my rubbish away.
Whose roads do the trucks that deliver and collect from your warehouse drive on?AJL308 said:
Joey Ramone said:
johnxjsc1985 said:
So when a person on "disability" has a car for himself and one for his wife, a Motorbike,Trailer tent, and two boats plus a couple of holidays a year you think this is far too much. The key is they have four children and we cant let the children suffer can we. Add to that free health care housing and Education its not a bad life. I have long since stopped getting myself into a tizz about this because clearly nobody gives a f
k.
I'm glad you have, because if you add all this financial abuse of the system up, it still amounts to pretty much fk.k all in the wider scheme of things. It's estimated that benefit fraud costs about £2bn a year. Which is about 6 days running costs for the NHS.There are bigger fish to fry. Foreign Aid at £13bn a year for example. H2S, which has cost £2bn and hasn't even been f
king started yet. And much as I loathe the feckless w
kers who sponge off the hard work of other people, I bet that most of us have succeeded in some form or another in cheating the Govt of money which we should have paid.Everyone's at it in one way or another, just to different extents.
Even the business owner who has a bit of a fiddle going still contributes to the overall economy. Idiots who refuse to work and who sponge off everyone else contribute nothing and expect their lives to be paid for by everyone else.
I wonder if Trump would just shoot him ?Joey Ramone said:
AJL308 said:
Joey Ramone said:
johnxjsc1985 said:
So when a person on "disability" has a car for himself and one for his wife, a Motorbike,Trailer tent, and two boats plus a couple of holidays a year you think this is far too much. The key is they have four children and we cant let the children suffer can we. Add to that free health care housing and Education its not a bad life. I have long since stopped getting myself into a tizz about this because clearly nobody gives a fk.
I'm glad you have, because if you add all this financial abuse of the system up, it still amounts to pretty much fk.k all in the wider scheme of things. It's estimated that benefit fraud costs about £2bn a year. Which is about 6 days running costs for the NHS.There are bigger fish to fry. Foreign Aid at £13bn a year for example. H2S, which has cost £2bn and hasn't even been f
king started yet. And much as I loathe the feckless w
kers who sponge off the hard work of other people, I bet that most of us have succeeded in some form or another in cheating the Govt of money which we should have paid.Everyone's at it in one way or another, just to different extents.
Even the business owner who has a bit of a fiddle going still contributes to the overall economy. Idiots who refuse to work and who sponge off everyone else contribute nothing and expect their lives to be paid for by everyone else.
Joey Ramone said:
No, you're missing the point. The fact that there is a workshy underclass is not in doubt. The point I have a made a number of times now is that the cost of fundamentally altering their behaviour, or seeking to 'catch them out' and then sanction them, would be greater than the cost of supporting them in their present lifestyles. If you want to get involved in a multigenerational attempt at social engineering then good luck to you, but it will cost a bomb and there's absolutely no guarantee that it will work.
Short-term pain for long-term gain.NOT addressing the issue is likely to be much more expensive.
sidicks said:
Short-term pain for long-term gain.
NOT addressing the issue is likely to be much more expensive.
Explain to me how you pursue this multigenerational (what's that - 30, 40 years?) attempt at fundamentally altering the human behaviour of a significant chunk of the population when a) the target audience will resist, as in their eyes they will have to adopt values that they simply don't see as valuable, b) any such initiative will have to navigate multiple changes in Government, each of which may be a (radically) different political hue from that which preceded it, and c) will require multiple departments of Government, and their ministers, to act in a fully coordinated manner for the entire duration of the experiment.NOT addressing the issue is likely to be much more expensive.
Pie in the sky. Just cut foreign aid and get on with it.
Joey Ramone said:
Explain to me how you pursue this multigenerational (what's that - 30, 40 years?) attempt at fundamentally altering the human behaviour of a significant chunk of the population when a) the target audience will resist, as in their eyes they will have to adopt values that they simply don't see as valuable, b) any such initiative will have to navigate multiple changes in Government, each of which may be a (radically) different political hue from that which preceded it, and c) will require multiple departments of Government, and their ministers, to act in a fully coordinated manner for the entire duration of the experiment.
Pie in the sky. Just cut foreign aid and get on with it.
A (bigger) 'significant chunk of the population' want it addressed.Pie in the sky. Just cut foreign aid and get on with it.
Sidicks. If I'm correct, you are usually to be found lamenting the public sector workforce. I would suspect, furthermore, that you have no great regard for the public sector, particularly local Government, in terms of the quality of that workforce.
Seeing as it will be a) Government, and therefore b) the public sector and c) in large part local Government that will be responsible for this ambitious social engineering project of yours, how successful do you think it will be if left in their hands, and how economically efficient?
Seeing as it will be a) Government, and therefore b) the public sector and c) in large part local Government that will be responsible for this ambitious social engineering project of yours, how successful do you think it will be if left in their hands, and how economically efficient?
Joey Ramone said:
Sidicks. If I'm correct, you are usually to be found lamenting the public sector workforce. I would suspect, furthermore, that you have no great regard for the public sector, particularly local Government, in terms of the quality of that workforce.
Absolute nonsense - please provide evidence to support that accusation.Joey Ramone said:
Seeing as it will be a) Government, and therefore b) the public sector and c) in large part local Government that will be responsible for this ambitious social engineering project of yours, how successful do you think it will be if left in their hands, and how economically efficient?
See above.Benefit cap? At 26k? Hardly reflective of the will of the majority, who according to you would like to see them get practically f
k all. And if you think people aren't raking in more than 26k you're deluded.This is the problem you've got. When it comes down to it, the Govt looks at the balance sheet and realises that some problems are best left unresolved.
Edited by Joey Ramone on Sunday 25th September 23:37
sidicks said:
Joey Ramone said:
Sidicks. If I'm correct, you are usually to be found lamenting the public sector workforce. I would suspect, furthermore, that you have no great regard for the public sector, particularly local Government, in terms of the quality of that workforce.
Absolute nonsense - please provide evidence to support that accusation.Joey Ramone said:
Seeing as it will be a) Government, and therefore b) the public sector and c) in large part local Government that will be responsible for this ambitious social engineering project of yours, how successful do you think it will be if left in their hands, and how economically efficient?
See above.Answer: Government is useless at this sort of thing. Absolutely ineffectual. And very, very expensive.
Joey Ramone said:
Answer my previous question re the ability of the Government to achieve this nirvana of yours.
Benefit cap? At 26k? Hardly reflective of the will of the majority, who according to you would like to see them get practically fk all.
Please stop making ignorant straw man arguments which conflict with what has actually been said,Benefit cap? At 26k? Hardly reflective of the will of the majority, who according to you would like to see them get practically f
k all.Joey Ramone said:
And if you think people aren't raking in more than 26k you're deluded.
I've said no such thing - you're argument must be extremely weak if all you can do is misrepresent those with different opinions to your own.Joey Ramone said:
This is the problem you've got. When it comes down to it, the Govt looks at the balance sheet and realises that some problems are best left unresolved.
The evidence is that the government has started to address the issue - I'm sorry that you can't or don't understand that.You keep evading the question that I've asked
How effective and how economically efficient will the public sector be in carrying out this project of yours? Particularly in light of the requirement for decades of fully coordinated work between multiple government departments across multiple different political administrations?
How effective and how economically efficient will the public sector be in carrying out this project of yours? Particularly in light of the requirement for decades of fully coordinated work between multiple government departments across multiple different political administrations?
Joey Ramone said:
You keep evading the question that I've asked
I don't see many questions from you, just false accusations,You keep making up nonsense and ascribing opinions to me which are totally untrue. Perhaps you like to justify or withdraw all the ignorant nonsense you've claimed?
Joey Ramone said:
How effective and how economically efficient will the public sector be in carrying out this project of yours? Particularly in light of the decades of fully coordinated work between multiple government departments across multiple different political administrations?
How long has the benefit cap been in place?What proportion of the population supported the cap? Over 70% according to this analysis...
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploa...
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