Ireland vs Scotland
Discussion
Eric Mc said:
Ali G said:
Eric Mc said:
I wasn't good enough for any of them. That's why I left.
But you have most definately kissed something Irish...Somewhere near Cork.
TheExcession said:
Eric Mc said:
TheExcession said:
Eric don't forget the milk....
Most of your suggestions aren't really bringing anything into Ireland at the moment. (Guinness accepted).
Regarding the tax issues, I'd be interested to hear your opinion on why DEC (Digital Equipment Corporation) and DELL jumped ship.
Why did DELL move its manufacturing to China? Same reason as everyone else I expect.
I've got a lot of Irish, or rather ex-Irish in the main, friends and I used to work with a lot as well. Those that weren't Irish were often Scottish.
Despite the imagined celtic roots of both, they were very different.
The Irish were always going on about how great it was in the old country (a habit certain sections of my family ensured would irritate me all my life) and the Scots would say how glad they were to leave. Otherwise, they were just like people.
I have a friend who regularly returns to Eire, something that was difficult during the civil war as he was something in SB or similar. He's never told me the details. He reckons that there's not one Ireland any more than there's one UK, or even England. He says that there's more difference between Dublin and the rest of the country than between parts of London and Dublin.
He reckons that the revolution, one that hasn't gone unheralded but has been overshadowed by the financial woes, is the loss of grip of the church. He says he can now admit he's a non-believer and no one looks away or even mumbles. This has, he feels, given the country a new energy. All of a sudden there is no respect for institutions, including the government, and he reckons the future's bright.
The financial problems has got through to most that there are no free rides. A good thing.
In some of the rural areas things are quite different he says, with attitudes going back 100 years.
He also reckons that he finds it hard to find any Irish who have any real resentment of the UK, or England as they call it. There's lots of verbals, but to them it is like France and Germany is to us.
So two revolutionary events happening, or have just happened, which have change the outlook: people happy to work for rewards and stuff the church. I've got a couple of ex Scottish friends but they wouldn't even speak about the referendum. Further, I have two acquaintances who reckon they are Scottish, wearing kilts for wedding and such, who have never been there, nor show any desire to.
Although I'm at least half Irish, I've never felt the draw to go there other than as a holiday destination. My friend's description of Dublin is certainly attractive. I went to rural Ireland when I was a kid, no more than six or seven, but that was it. I stayed with an 'uncle' - no one really knew the connection - whose idea of rewiring the house was to check for live by touching it against an earth whilst standing in a waterlogged trench in his wellies. He waved goodbye to us as we went for a walk into 'town' with the hand that was holding a live connection. My dad's 'Wave goodbye to your uncle, kids. You may never see him again.' gained a bit of a rebuke from my mother, but it was half-hearted.
Scottish politics, or the majority of the electorate, will do for the country I think. My money, if I was to bet, would be on Ireland. Their politicians are just a bit bent and incompetent. The Scots have the added problem of some of them being nasty with it.
Despite the imagined celtic roots of both, they were very different.
The Irish were always going on about how great it was in the old country (a habit certain sections of my family ensured would irritate me all my life) and the Scots would say how glad they were to leave. Otherwise, they were just like people.
I have a friend who regularly returns to Eire, something that was difficult during the civil war as he was something in SB or similar. He's never told me the details. He reckons that there's not one Ireland any more than there's one UK, or even England. He says that there's more difference between Dublin and the rest of the country than between parts of London and Dublin.
He reckons that the revolution, one that hasn't gone unheralded but has been overshadowed by the financial woes, is the loss of grip of the church. He says he can now admit he's a non-believer and no one looks away or even mumbles. This has, he feels, given the country a new energy. All of a sudden there is no respect for institutions, including the government, and he reckons the future's bright.
The financial problems has got through to most that there are no free rides. A good thing.
In some of the rural areas things are quite different he says, with attitudes going back 100 years.
He also reckons that he finds it hard to find any Irish who have any real resentment of the UK, or England as they call it. There's lots of verbals, but to them it is like France and Germany is to us.
So two revolutionary events happening, or have just happened, which have change the outlook: people happy to work for rewards and stuff the church. I've got a couple of ex Scottish friends but they wouldn't even speak about the referendum. Further, I have two acquaintances who reckon they are Scottish, wearing kilts for wedding and such, who have never been there, nor show any desire to.
Although I'm at least half Irish, I've never felt the draw to go there other than as a holiday destination. My friend's description of Dublin is certainly attractive. I went to rural Ireland when I was a kid, no more than six or seven, but that was it. I stayed with an 'uncle' - no one really knew the connection - whose idea of rewiring the house was to check for live by touching it against an earth whilst standing in a waterlogged trench in his wellies. He waved goodbye to us as we went for a walk into 'town' with the hand that was holding a live connection. My dad's 'Wave goodbye to your uncle, kids. You may never see him again.' gained a bit of a rebuke from my mother, but it was half-hearted.
Scottish politics, or the majority of the electorate, will do for the country I think. My money, if I was to bet, would be on Ireland. Their politicians are just a bit bent and incompetent. The Scots have the added problem of some of them being nasty with it.
I do have to say that Derek's reminiscences about his Irish roots and relatives, whilst interesting in a rambly "Oirish" kind of way, don't really reflect the modern Irish or the modern Ireland.
As I mentioned earlier, the Irish "Troubles" of the 1920s have as much relevance to the modern, young Irish person as the English Civil war does to most young English people.
As I mentioned earlier, the Irish "Troubles" of the 1920s have as much relevance to the modern, young Irish person as the English Civil war does to most young English people.
Eric Mc said:
I do have to say that Derek's reminiscences about his Irish roots and relatives, whilst interesting in a rambly "Oirish" kind of way, don't really reflect the modern Irish or the modern Ireland.
As I mentioned earlier, the Irish "Troubles" of the 1920s have as much relevance to the modern, young Irish person as the English Civil war does to most young English people.
Not sure bout that. My Irish relatives split into 3 segments. Those who stayed and are uber patriotic. Collins and Dev are not ancient figures. Scratch the surface and there is a pretty strong anti Brit sentiment. Those who emigrated to the U.S. and are even more sceptical of Britain, but are also pretty scathing of what they regard as a backward country (though there was much cheer around the recent Gay marriage vote). And then there are itinerant 'earning a living' types who are pretty pragmatic and particularly pro European. They may resemble your view but are not a majority. Imo.As I mentioned earlier, the Irish "Troubles" of the 1920s have as much relevance to the modern, young Irish person as the English Civil war does to most young English people.
Edit and clarification; there is a huge difference between Dublin and the wider country. Dublin is way more liberal and metropolitan than anywhere else. That may account for much of my perception.
Edited by Ridgemont on Wednesday 5th August 23:28
confucuis said:
Well given that Irish insurers will no longer insure cars 15 years or over, Scotland looks a lot more attractive to me now!
Really what is the reason for that? And does that mean UK insurers can make a killing in offering insurance for that market sector and the classic cars. Ridgemont said:
Edit and clarification; there is a huge difference between Dublin and the wider country. Dublin is way more liberal and metropolitan than anywhere else. That may account for much of my perception.
Traditionally, that was always the case. The difference is nothing like as great as it used to be. The recent referendum on Gay Marriage gave a very clear indication of the relative conservatism of Irish society as it is today. Only ONE region voted against it.Edited by Ridgemont on Wednesday 5th August 23:28
Carlow-Kilkenny Yes 56.2% No 43.8%
Cavan-Monaghan Yes 50.65% No 49.35%
Clare Yes 58.3% No 41.7%
Cork East 61.72% No 38.28%
Cork North Central Yes 63.8% No 36.2%
Cork North West 57.87 % No 42.13%
Cork South Central Yes 65.8% No 34.2%
Cork South West 55.97% No 44.03%
Donegal North East Yes 52.5% No 47.5%
Donegal South West Yes 50.1% No 49.9%
Dublin Central Yes 72.4% No 24.6%
Dublin Mid-West Yes 70.6% No 29.4%
Dublin North Yes 72.6% No 27.4%
Dublin North Central Yes 69% No 31%
Dublin North East Yes 66.7% No 33.3%
Dublin North West: Yes 70.4% No 29.6%
Dublin South Yes 69.9% No 30.1%
Dublin South Central Yes 72.3% No 27.7%
Dublin South East Yes 74.0% No 25.1%
Dublin South West Yes 71.3% 28.7%
Dublin West Yes 70.6% 29.4%
Dun Laoghaire Yes 71.6% No 28.4%
Galway East Yes 53.3% No 46.7%
Galway West Yes 61.5% No 38.5%
Kerry North-West Limerick Yes 55.5% No 44.5%
Kerry South 55.3% 44.7%
Kildare North Yes 69.7% No 30.3%
Kildare South Yes 66.2% No 33.8%6
Laois-Offaly Yes 56.8% No 43.2%
Limerick Yes 54.8% No 45.2%
Limerick City Yes 64.1% No 35.9%
Longford-Westmeath Yes 53.6% No 46.4%
Louth Yes 63.5% No 36.5%
Mayo Yes 52% No 48%
Meath East Yes 63.6% No 36.4%
Meath West Yes 60.1% No 39.9%
Roscommon-South Letrim Yes 48.6% No 51.4%
Sligo-North Leitrim Yes 53.57% No 46.43%
Tipperary North Yes 56.12% No 45.3%
Tipperary South Yes 56.1% No 43.9%
Waterford Yes 60.33% No 39.67%
Wexford Yes 63.6% No 36.4%
Wicklow Yes 68.4% No 31.6%
The general trend is that the further west you go, the more conservative it gets.
Eric Mc said:
I do have to say that Derek's reminiscences about his Irish roots and relatives, whilst interesting in a rambly "Oirish" kind of way, don't really reflect the modern Irish or the modern Ireland.
As I mentioned earlier, the Irish "Troubles" of the 1920s have as much relevance to the modern, young Irish person as the English Civil war does to most young English people.
Thanks for the comment about it being entertaining. I do my best.As I mentioned earlier, the Irish "Troubles" of the 1920s have as much relevance to the modern, young Irish person as the English Civil war does to most young English people.
I'm glad you agree with my friend that only in some limited rural areas are the old stereotypes still going with the attitudes. He spends about a third, maybe more, of his time in Ireland, so probably a bit less than you, but his opinions and yours seem to gel.
The danger is a resurgence of the church's influence. I doubt that the comfort of magic a mysticism has entirely disappeared. Given the infrastructure and history, I can't see such a political institution giving up on its jewel.
It's a losing battle. Every indicator in Irish society over the past 30 years shows the Catholic Church's influence waning. That fall from power has accelerated, not slowed down, over the past 15 or so years.
I'm sure it WILL eventually slow down and maybe even stop eventually. But it will never return to where it was before the mid 1980s.
I'm sure it WILL eventually slow down and maybe even stop eventually. But it will never return to where it was before the mid 1980s.
Twilkes said:
so what has Ireland got going for it
At the moment: They're aligned with the US and UK economies, both of which have been reasonably strong lately combined with using a recently relatively weakened European currency.http://www.davidmcwilliams.ie/2015/07/27/british-p...
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