Police appeal after female cyclist pushed to ground by ped

[otolith]

Yeah, happens all the time, only the other day a little old lady remonstrated with me for barging her out of the way, so I pushed her under a bus, what did the silly old bugger expect to come of it?

[anonymous-user]

otolith said:

Yeah, happens all the time, only the other day a little old lady remonstrated with me for barging her out of the way, so I pushed her under a bus, what did the silly old bugger expect to come of it?

What is your point? The behavior of the thug is not disputed or excused by a single post that I have read. Do you think if you go round flicking the finger at random people in Tower Hamlets you increase or decrease the chance of you getting a kicking? Would you do it?

[anonymous-user]

S10GTA said:

wolves_wanderer said:

OpulentBob said:

It was an over-reaction for sure. But he definitely wouldn't have done it for no reason.

St John Smythe said:

Yet another cyclist provoking someone then posting the footage on YouTube!

I'm never quite sure if I'm being trolled on threads like this. Assuming I'm not, I often wonder what a cyclist would have to do to be an innocent victim in some people's minds. Or conversely, what the reaction would be if a pedestrian got angry and did something really bad like scratch a car.

Same old names each time too. Lord Trumpton will be here in 3...2...1

Yeah yeah. Quote me in full if you're going to be judgemental.

My first post said "When s collide", which has been alluded to by many - pick them up on it too? My second added "There's more to this than meets the eye" - which is true. We can't see the hand gestures of the cyclist.

As I've said before (and been offered a rather fetching cape for) I've probably done more for cyclists and their safety than you've had hot dinners, so chill out a bit. My point was that the guy didn't choose to do it out of the blue. There was clearly something to escalate it. Because she's a woman (in this world of equality), she doesn't deserve being picked up on it? (Please note that I'm NOT saying it's OK to push her in to the road, before you get all Adrian Durham on me - I've already called the guy a ).

[Countdown]

fblm said:

otolith said:

Yeah, happens all the time, only the other day a little old lady remonstrated with me for barging her out of the way, so I pushed her under a bus, what did the silly old bugger expect to come of it?

What is your point? The behavior of the thug is not disputed or excused by a single post that I have read. Do you think if you go round flicking the finger at random people in Tower Hamlets you increase or decrease the chance of you getting a kicking? Would you do it?

None of this would have happened if the Ped hadn't forced the biker to take evasive action. His attitude of "I'll do what I like and f*** anybody else" is a common occurrence nowadays and 99% of the time people will get irritated but move on. Sometimes, human nature being what it is, you respond in kind (which is what the lady did).

Ped acted like a twunt in my opinion. Lady reacted (unwisely) but understandably in my opinion. Ped didn't like people calling him out for being a twunt and that's why he reacted the way he did.

It's easy to say that we should look down/ignore/accept twuntish behaviour and not react to it. But it's easier said than done.

[TheSnitch]

Moulder said:

Surely this is the same as any conflict, large or small? A does something to B, B retaliates/escalates, A doesn't like it much so retaliates/escalates or walks away, and repeat...

The lady cyclist who is the weaker party is relying on polite society for it not to get out of hand, but in this case it doesn't turn out like that. The consequences in this case are quite extreme but once she instigates or retaliates/escalates then she shouldn't expect that to be the end of it. I would think her being more mobile and likely having done similar with no consequences before may also be a factor.

This is not apportioning blame based on gender, type of transport, etc.

Is that not the standard domestic violence excuse?

"S/he nagged me/did A/didn't do B so I beat the crap out of him/her"

Doesn't matter what she said to him, nothing excuses or mitigates his behaviour.

[saaby93]

I put this down to a typical dashcam incident. It doesn't seem to matter whether its a bike with one or a car with one, the sequence is the same. Provoke the type of person you wouldn't normally be bothered about, act surprised when the inevitable happens, post it up on the internet and claim that escalated quickly

As always what happens at the end isn't defensible but step back and ask who is really surprised?

Here's where it starts with the guy waiting to cross the road in a stream of slow moving traffic



Surely he could have chosen to cross there in front of the bike. As a pedestrian he does have priority but chose not to exercise it. Wouldnt most people on a bike, in a car or truck have nodded or waved him across out the way - it doesnt take a few seconds and barely any effect on the traffic there.

Instead he waits for the bike, and instead of thanks mate, gets warned for doing something he wasn't going to do and the escalation begins
What do people have for breakfast?

Edited by saaby93 on Wednesday 26th August 09:49

[FredClogs]

I think I'd be annoyed by the prejudice and presumption that I was planning or attempting to push a cyclist over when simply trying to cross a busy road. The addition of a aggressive and insulting hand gesture would have angered me. I would have got over it, unlike this chap, but the cyclist started it, if she's really that fearful and insecure perhaps she'd be better in a car?

[anonymous-user]

otolith said:

Yeah, happens all the time, only the other day a little old lady remonstrated with me for barging her out of the way, so I pushed her under a bus, what did the silly old bugger expect to come of it?

Yup, defo more to this than meets the eye, Lycra clad helmet cam bds! She was asking for it!

[Moulder]

TheSnitch said:

Moulder said:

Surely this is the same as any conflict, large or small? A does something to B, B retaliates/escalates, A doesn't like it much so retaliates/escalates or walks away, and repeat...

The lady cyclist who is the weaker party is relying on polite society for it not to get out of hand, but in this case it doesn't turn out like that. The consequences in this case are quite extreme but once she instigates or retaliates/escalates then she shouldn't expect that to be the end of it. I would think her being more mobile and likely having done similar with no consequences before may also be a factor.

This is not apportioning blame based on gender, type of transport, etc.

Is that not the standard domestic violence excuse?

"S/he nagged me/did A/didn't do B so I beat the crap out of him/her"

Doesn't matter what she said to him, nothing excuses or mitigates his behaviour.

Sorry, my mistake, from only watching the video once with no sound I didn't realise they were married to each other.

Edited by Moulder on Wednesday 26th August 10:06

[TheSnitch]

Moulder said:

TheSnitch said:

Moulder said:

Surely this is the same as any conflict, large or small? A does something to B, B retaliates/escalates, A doesn't like it much so retaliates/escalates or walks away, and repeat...

The lady cyclist who is the weaker party is relying on polite society for it not to get out of hand, but in this case it doesn't turn out like that. The consequences in this case are quite extreme but once she instigates or retaliates/escalates then she shouldn't expect that to be the end of it. I would think her being more mobile and likely having done similar with no consequences before may also be a factor.

This is not apportioning blame based on gender, type of transport, etc.

Is that not the standard domestic violence excuse?

"S/he nagged me/did A/didn't do B so I beat the crap out of him/her"

Doesn't matter what she said to him, nothing excuses or mitigates his behaviour.

Sorry, my mistake, from only watching the video once with no sound I didn't realise they were married to each other.

Edited by Moulder on Wednesday 26th August 10:06

I was making a comparison, not commenting on their marital status.

Sorry for not making that abundantly clear. Would you like to push me under some traffic?

[Calletrece]

ReaderScars said:

Troll

Yeah, how dare someone call it how it ACTUALLY is. It's really funny seeing this as the default reaction of anyone who walks round baaaaaing the herd mentality.

Why are so many of you lot unable to see that things aren't black and white? He shouldn't have pushed her off the bike, she shouldn't have been a sanctimonious div and given him the finger.

If you fail to accept that, you go round correcting people who are doing nothing wrong and abusing them, and see how you get on!

[TheSnitch]

Calletrece said:

ReaderScars said:

Troll

Yeah, how dare someone call it how it ACTUALLY is. It's really funny seeing this as the default reaction of anyone who walks round baaaaaing the herd mentality.

Why are so many of you lot unable to see that things aren't black and white? He shouldn't have pushed her off the bike, she shouldn't have been a sanctimonious div and given him the finger.

If you fail to accept that, you go round correcting people who are doing nothing wrong and abusing them, and see how you get on!

To look at this from the point of the Highway code - Yes, I know, but bear with me - this is what he should have done

The Highway Code said:

D. If traffic is coming, let it pass. Look all around again and listen. Do not cross until there is a safe gap in the traffic and you are certain that there is plenty of time. Remember, even if traffic is a long way off, it may be approaching very quickly.

E. When it is safe, go straight across the road – do not run. Keep looking and listening for traffic while you cross, in case there is any traffic you did not see, or in case other traffic appears suddenly. Look out for cyclists and motorcyclists travelling between lanes of traffic. Do not walk diagonally across the road.

And this is from the rules for cyclists

The Highway Code also said:

be considerate of other road users, particularly blind and partially sighted pedestrians. Let them know you are there when necessary, for example, by ringing your bell if you have one. It is recommended that a bell be fitted.

and

look well ahead for obstructions in the road, such as drains, pot-holes and parked vehicles so that you do not have to swerve suddenly to avoid them. Leave plenty of room when passing parked vehicles and watch out for doors being opened or pedestrians stepping into your path

Which begs the question, if she had a little bell, and dinged that at him, would he have behaved the same way?

He was in the road. She was making him aware of her presence. He might not have liked it, but he shouldn't have been sauntering in front of traffic

[saaby93]

TheSnitch said:

To look at this from the point of the Highway code - Yes, I know, but bear with me - this is what he should have done

The Highway Code said:

D. If traffic is coming, let it pass. Look all around again and listen. Do not cross until there is a safe gap in the traffic and you are certain that there is plenty of time. Remember, even if traffic is a long way off, it may be approaching very quickly.

E. When it is safe, go straight across the road – do not run. Keep looking and listening for traffic while you cross, in case there is any traffic you did not see, or in case other traffic appears suddenly. Look out for cyclists and motorcyclists travelling between lanes of traffic. Do not walk diagonally across the road.

In my mind he was doing that. The traffic was slow moving he was looking for a safe gap in it
He'd also looked out for a cyclist
Any other day it would have passed off without incident

Edited by saaby93 on Wednesday 26th August 13:37

[glazbagun]

saaby93 said:

I put this down to a typical dashcam incident. It doesn't seem to matter whether its a bike with one or a car with one, the sequence is the same. Provoke the type of person you wouldn't normally be bothered about, act surprised when the inevitable happens, post it up on the internet and claim that escalated quickly

As always what happens at the end isn't defensible but step back and ask who is really surprised?

Here's where it starts with the guy waiting to cross the road in a stream of slow moving traffic

Surely he could have chosen to cross there in front of the bike. As a pedestrian he does have priority but chose not to exercise it. Wouldnt most people on a bike, in a car or truck have nodded or waved him across out the way - it doesnt take a few seconds and barely any effect on the traffic there.

Instead he waits for the bike, and instead of thanks mate, gets warned for doing something he wasn't going to do and the escalation begins
What do people have for breakfast?

Pretty much this. Of course he should have shook his head and carried on building a massively successful and happy life as means of revenge, but I don't see his reaction as anything to be shocked by.

It's just one of those "natural justice" things. If I skip the queue at a nightclub/bar and throw insulting words at anyone who complains, then I may not actually *deserve* a broken jaw and some stitches in any rational sense, but the probability of it being a consequence of such actions is high enough that I should expect it as a possible outcome and can't really complain if/when it happens. Skydivers and rock climbers seem to accept and even embrace the increased risk of bad outcomes, this woman less so.

Regardless of the finer points of the law, if you go around being a prick to lots of people, you have nothing to moan about when you bump into someone who reacts very strongly to such behavior.

[oyster]

Willy Nilly said:

RUNAMOK said:

Interesting people think the cyclist is in the wrong or 'started' this - I just watched the video. The man is crossing the road in front of her trying to make her stop for him. She calmly says please don't knock me off, he then swears at her. So she gives him the finger. Sorry but if someone did that to me id probably do the same, or should we apologise for getting in his way?!

Patronising tone in the voice and gave him the finger, then wonders why someone lamps her. Cyclists do like crossing pedestrian crossings when they should be waiting.

six and two threes.

Did this happen at a pedestrian crossing? If not, then what is your point?

I wonder why he lamped her. 99.9% of people wonder it too. As will the police. As will a judge. Only neanderthals think otherwise.

[oyster]

Countdown said:

It's easy to say that we should look down/ignore/accept twuntish behaviour and not react to it. But it's easier said than done.

More importantly, do we want to live in a society where we all turn a blind eye to anti-social or criminal behaviour?

Much as I want to get home safely to see my kids, I am acutely aware of not wanting them to grow up in a society that has broken down and allowed thugs to rule. It's difficult to just look the other way.

[hornetrider]

oyster said:

I wonder why he lamped her. 99.9% of people wonder it too. As will the police. As will a judge. Only neanderthals think otherwise.

Indeed.

The nuance here is would he have lamped her if she hadn't flipped him the bird? What do you think?

[Calletrece]

Great analogy about nightclubs further up.

oyster said:

I wonder why he lamped her. 99.9% of people wonder it too. As will the police. As will a judge. Only neanderthals think otherwise.

She was abusive to him, after previously being condescending to him.

HTH

[NEEP]

hornetrider said:

Indeed.

The nuance here is would he have lamped her if she hadn't flipped him the bird? What do you think?

So, you feel assault is justified by someone flipping the bird? Best of luck with that defence.

[Calletrece]

NEEP said:

So, you feel assault is justified by someone flipping the bird? Best of luck with that defence.

It depends if by justified you mean 'legally acceptable' or 'likely social outcome'.

As has been explained, if you go up to strangers, chastise them wrongly, and then abuse them, it's fairly likely you may get a gentle shove at best (as has happened here) and a proper wallop at worst.

It might not be right, but it is fairly likely to happen.