Another US Campus mass shooting.
Discussion
p1stonhead said:
Whats the problem? Creampuff thinks its ok for 8 year olds to have guns. This guy is practically a veteran at 11 years old.
I was in Vegas a few weeks ago and took my dad to a range as a birthday present.I shot a Glock, MP5, Remington 870, Remington 700 and added an AK47.
I have to admit it was great fun for a bit of entertainment, very well run and secure with 2 armor plate doors between the range and the store. However i was quite pleased to be leaving when I saw what looked to be a 12 year old boy getting ready to shoot a rifle almost as big as him.
creampuff said:
longblackcoat said:
creampuff said:
Not that there are any more suicides in the US than the UK, Americans just tend to use guns..
You continue to make yourself look foolish. Unless you think the World Health Organisation just make stuff up, the suicide rate in the US is 12.1/100,000 population. The comparable figure in the UK is 6.2.But yeah, the rates are the same.
creampuff said:
The authors actually bothered to do research
Unlike you, perhaps?The UK rate is just under 12 per 100k per year. The US rate is just over 12.
So my apologies for that; you did do some research! I have no idea why the data's so different between sources though.
http://apps.who.int/gho/data/node.main.MHSUICIDE?l...
petrolsniffer said:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-34450841
WTF?!
I know it would be a long hard battle and pro gunners will think its the beginning of the end but at least have some laws of how people are storing and securing their weapons.
Tragic. It really doesn't compute how can people see this and still be pro-gun ownership. WTF?!
I know it would be a long hard battle and pro gunners will think its the beginning of the end but at least have some laws of how people are storing and securing their weapons.
longblackcoat said:
creampuff said:
longblackcoat said:
creampuff said:
Not that there are any more suicides in the US than the UK, Americans just tend to use guns..
You continue to make yourself look foolish. Unless you think the World Health Organisation just make stuff up, the suicide rate in the US is 12.1/100,000 population. The comparable figure in the UK is 6.2.But yeah, the rates are the same.
creampuff said:
The authors actually bothered to do research
Unlike you, perhaps?The UK rate is just under 12 per 100k per year. The US rate is just over 12.
So my apologies for that; you did do some research! I have no idea why the data's so different between sources though.
http://apps.who.int/gho/data/node.main.MHSUICIDE?l...
petrolsniffer said:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-34450841
WTF?!
I know it would be a long hard battle and pro gunners will think its the beginning of the end but at least have some laws of how people are storing and securing their weapons.
Well, if this sort of thing can happen and they still do nothing then then there's no hope of change.WTF?!
I know it would be a long hard battle and pro gunners will think its the beginning of the end but at least have some laws of how people are storing and securing their weapons.
Talk about desensitised. They must be to not immediately say 'That's it. No more. We need change'.
longshot said:
petrolsniffer said:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-34450841
WTF?!
I know it would be a long hard battle and pro gunners will think its the beginning of the end but at least have some laws of how people are storing and securing their weapons.
Well, if this sort of thing can happen and they still do nothing then then there's no hope of change.WTF?!
I know it would be a long hard battle and pro gunners will think its the beginning of the end but at least have some laws of how people are storing and securing their weapons.
Talk about desensitised. They must be to not immediately say 'That's it. No more. We need change'.
The truly horrific thing is that people - mostly Americans - assert that they need to have handguns available for personal protection purposes, and that's why they're not always locked away. In that case, they should be with the owner at all times (a) because if there really is a threat they're going to need it (b) to stop 11 year old boys from getting their hands on them and shooting their neighbour over a puppy.
"Guns don't kill people. People kill people." Sure. But people with guns tend to kill more than people without guns.
longblackcoat said:
In that case, they should be with the owner at all times (a) because if there really is a threat they're going to need it (b) to stop 11 year old boys from getting their hands on them.
Not always a good idea.http://www.cbsnews.com/news/3-year-old-ohio-boy-ki...
creampuff said:
La Liga said:
t's a shame you didn't show such statistical diligence when you declared knife crime was on the rise in the UK.
I don't believe I did, though I'm disinclined to read back over the last 10 pages to remind myself what I did say. I believe it was along the lines of 10 teenagers have already died due to knife crime so far this year in London, which seams like a lot to me given that everyone seems qualified to tell what Americans to do when teenagers are also randomly stabbing each other in London. That would be a quiet weekend in a place like Chicago (population 2.7 mil) http://chicago.cbslocal.com/tag/weekend-shootings/ That link is a week by week summary of 1 US city.
petrolsniffer said:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-34450841
WTF?!
I know it would be a long hard battle and pro gunners will think its the beginning of the end but at least have some laws of how people are storing and securing their weapons.
No, see, you can't have them in a locked safe because then they can't be used for home defence when all the WTF?!
I know it would be a long hard battle and pro gunners will think its the beginning of the end but at least have some laws of how people are storing and securing their weapons.
longshot said:
Well, if this sort of thing can happen and they still do nothing then then there's no hope of change.
Talk about desensitised. They must be to not immediately say 'That's it. No more. We need change'.
No, eventually everyone in the US will have been affected, directly or indirectly, (ie, lost a loved one/ friend themselves or know someone who has) from these sort of events that the mindset will change. Talk about desensitised. They must be to not immediately say 'That's it. No more. We need change'.
Right now the likes of creampuff don't give a s
t because it doesn't affect them personally. WinstonWolf said:
bullies180 said:
How long will it be until some nut in the US insists that the solution would have been for the 8 year old girl to be packing so that she could defend herself, her puppy and her family! Madness!
It's already been suggested...You know it makes sense
Chris Rock has a solution:
Chris Rock said:
You don’t need no gun control, you know what you need? We need some bullet control. Men, we need to control the bullets, that’s right. I think all bullets should cost five thousand dollars… five thousand dollars per bullet… You know why? 'Cause if a bullet cost five thousand dollars there would be no more innocent bystanders.
Yeah! Every time somebody get shot we’d say, ‘Damn, he must have done something ... st, he’s got fifty thousand dollars worth of bullets in his ass.’
And people would think before they killed somebody if a bullet cost five thousand dollars. ‘Man I would blow your fking head off…if I could afford it.’ ‘I’m gonna get me another job, I’m going to start saving some money, and you’re a dead man. You’d better hope I can’t get no bullets on layaway.’
So even if you get shot by a stray bullet, you wouldn't have to go to no doctor to get it taken out. Whoever shot you would take their bullet back, like "I believe you got my property.”
Yeah! Every time somebody get shot we’d say, ‘Damn, he must have done something ... s
t, he’s got fifty thousand dollars worth of bullets in his ass.’And people would think before they killed somebody if a bullet cost five thousand dollars. ‘Man I would blow your f
king head off…if I could afford it.’ ‘I’m gonna get me another job, I’m going to start saving some money, and you’re a dead man. You’d better hope I can’t get no bullets on layaway.’So even if you get shot by a stray bullet, you wouldn't have to go to no doctor to get it taken out. Whoever shot you would take their bullet back, like "I believe you got my property.”
Oakey said:
Right now the likes of creampuff don't give a st because it doesn't affect them personally.
Quite a disingenuous comment based on your own sense of moral outrage that guns should actually be allowed, rather either of anything that I said or than the reality is they are allowed, so there must be a way to reduce accidental and intentional shootings, while recognising the reality that almost half of US households have guns, will continue to have guns and in the overwhelming majority of cases use them safely. t because it doesn't affect them personally. I draw your attention to this:
http://everytownresearch.org/reports/innocents_los...
which discusses accidental shooting by or of children. The 11yo shoots the 8yo is no accident, but an 11yo lacks the judgement and personal responsibility of an adult and so the same gun storage methods which keep guns away from children so they can't accidentally shoot anyone also stop them intentionally shooting someone. My 8yo niece with the 22 never gets to take it out without her dad supervising btw.
Here is an example of a shooting from that article:
"Just hours after enjoying a Christmas dinner of chicken and macaroni and cheese, a father in Conway, South Carolina turned to make a phone-call and his two-year-old boy picked up his loaded handgun from the living-room table and accidentally shot and killed himself."
It's stupid. It's a tragedy. It just didn't need to happen, just like the 11yo shooting an 8yo as reported on the BBC did not need to happen. You should never leave a loaded gun or a gun and ammunition around where children can get at it unsupervised.
The article above lists some pretty simple steps which would stop accidental or intentional child shootings happening, all of which seem like a good idea to me:
- States should adopt stronger laws to prevent children from accessing unsecured guns, by authorizing criminal charges if an adult gun owner stores his or her gun negligently, a child gains access to the firearm, and harm results.
- Congress should appropriate funds for research to improve public health surveillance of unintentional child gun deaths and to develop effective educational materials for promoting safe storage.
- Congress should earmark funding for the Consumer Product Safety Commission to evaluate and set standards for emerging technologies that promote gun safety, such as biometric gun safes.
- Doctors should be allowed and encouraged to promote gun safety, and efforts to gag physicians should be opposed.
- Greater awareness of the issue should be promoted through a national public education campaign enlisting law enforcement, corporate, and non-profit partners.
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