Turkey Shoots Down Jet Near Syria Border

[Eric Mc]

A certain newspaper is claiming that this pictures shows the SU-24 being shot down. Spot the mistake -

[hornetrider]

AJS- said:

Why does he increasingly sound like the only one who is actually playing relatively straight here?

I don't know. I can't be the only one that's glad Putin is involved either. He's not fking about.

[CAPP0]

Just curious here. Our office has TVs on but no sound. I've just seen on Sky news, a clip of a flaming plane heading for the ground. Looked like the rear was alight (are missiles heat-seeking, ie the exhaust?) and the front was intact, but there was no visible ejection? Would the pilots not have baled?

[Rovinghawk]

Eric Mc said:

A certain newspaper is claiming that this pictures shows the SU-24 being shot down. Spot the mistake -

Are they pulling a bit of a flanker here?

I realise it's a fulcrum

[Puggit]

CAPP0 said:

Just curious here. Our office has TVs on but no sound. I've just seen on Sky news, a clip of a flaming plane heading for the ground. Looked like the rear was alight (are missiles heat-seeking, ie the exhaust?) and the front was intact, but there was no visible ejection? Would the pilots not have baled?

Both airmen baled, both are dead.

One seemingly shot on his way down to prevent him escaping in to Turkey.

[RichB]

CAPP0 said:

Just curious here. Our office has TVs on but no sound. I've just seen on Sky news, a clip of a flaming plane heading for the ground. Looked like the rear was alight (are missiles heat-seeking, ie the exhaust?) and the front was intact, but there was no visible ejection? Would the pilots not have baled?

According to BBC reports: "A spokesman for a rebel group operating in the area, the 10th Brigade of the Coast, told the Associated Press that the jet's crew had tried to parachute into government-held territory, but that they came under fire from members of the group. One of them was dead when he landed on the ground, he added. The fate of the second was not immediately known"

[Halb]

That was STarscream shot down by Megatron?

[vonuber]

AJS- said:

Why does he increasingly sound like the only one who is actually playing relatively straight here?

Scary isn't it.

[Bluebarge]

dandarez said:

Bluebarge said:

dandarez said:

Bloody hell. Articulate and to the point ...very sharp. I would not underestimate Putin, one tiny bit.

but also complete bks. Russia is no respecter of borders (Ukraine, Crimea, Georgia) routinely sends planes and subs on aggressive missions to probe others' airspace, and is conducting more airstrikes against non-ISIL rebels than against ISIL.

Was bound to happen at some point.

Oh thanks Mr Expert. Lots of you abound these days.

And the west is a respecter of borders? Goes on all the time.

And if 'we' go in bombing in Syria, I could say the same as you 'was bound to happen at some point' (you know, the usual, civvies getting killed or similar).

Hope we keep the f. out of this.

Your man-love for Putin clearly runs deep. Remind me which Western nation has actually seized territory from another in recent years? Which has launched proxy invasions of its neighbours?

Putin is not targeting ISIl or "civvies", he is targeting Assad's enemies. One does not have to be an expert to know this, one just has to read the news and remember it.

Still, every one loves a bare chest, so I can see where you're coming from

[AJS-]

Bluebarge said:

Putin is not targeting ISIl or "civvies", he is targeting Assad's enemies. One does not have to be an expert to know this, one just has to read the news and remember it.

Sounds foolproof...

[Eric Mc]

Rovinghawk said:

re they pulling a bit of a flanker here?

I realise it's a fulcrum

It looks like a Flanker to me.

[Halb]

Russia seems to be targeting ISIS

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3330232/Ru...

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-11-23/russia-bo...

[vonuber]

RichB said:

According to BBC reports: "A spokesman for a rebel group operating in the area, the 10th Brigade of the Coast, told the Associated Press that the jet's crew had tried to parachute into government-held territory, but that they came under fire from members of the group. One of them was dead when he landed on the ground, he added. The fate of the second was not immediately known"

And Call-Me-Dave wanta us to get involved in this. Madness, absolute madness.

[anonymous-user]

Russian tactics here seem a bit ad hoc. Are they really operating in old jets and no awacs and no communications with the Turks, right up to (and inside) the Turkish border? No wonder these incidents happen. The whole of Syria is awash with targets they bomb within a few KM of turkey? It just shows that it's anti Assad forces not ISIS being bombed by the Russians.

Not really the way to lead a coalition of forces to fight ISIS.

[vonuber]

So the view from the Greeks:

Diplomats are expressing thinly disguised alarm. In a country, which frequently complains of Turkish fighter jets both violating and buzzing Greek airspace over the Aegean, the shooting of the SU-24 is being described by diplomats in private “as an extremely serious incident” that has prompted “high concern.”

“This is the first time since the beginning of the cold war that a member of Nato destroys a Russian military aircraft,” said one. “It is an extremely serious incident. There is high concern [in Athens].”


Maybe the Greeks need to start shooting down the Turks then! This has nothing to do with airspace and all to do with the Turkish campaign against the Kurds and extending its influence in Syria by aiding ISIS and other rebel factions.

[fido]

Bluebarge said:

Remind me which Western nation has actually seized territory from another in recent years? Which has launched proxy invasions of its neighbours?

Let's widen that definition to collective of nations - EU.

[stripy7]

simo1863 said:

what's interesting to me is Russia' reporting of it being rebels. In my mind this is because Russia doesn't want a conflict with Turkey but would have to take action against them, in the eyes of it's people, should it be abundantly clear (without any doubt) that it was Turkish forces that shot it down.

It's ironic that the Turks may well have shot themselves in the foot by showing the world, as fast as possible, that they downed the plane and why they did.

I can't see it escalating the current conflict though, they will both be more careful and Russia will double the gas prices to Turkey or something.

Then Turkey would blockade the Bospherous. Won't happen.

[maxxy5]

vonuber said:

This has nothing to do with airspace and all to do with the Turkish campaign against the Kurds and extending its influence in Syria by aiding ISIS and other rebel factions.

Yup

[anonymous-user]

vonuber said:

And Call-Me-Dave wanta us to get involved in this. Madness, absolute madness.

Does he still want to bomb Assad or just ISIS, I've lost track. What about Al Queda or the Kurds or the Syrian Rebels, Does he want to bomb them too? What's going to happen to the Kurds and Syrian Rebels if/when Assad and the Russians get control of Syria? Will they become the next terror group wanting revenge on the west after they get abandoned?

Crazy for the Russians to be bombing in this area so close to turkey. Crazy for the Turks to shoot the aircraft down.

Hopefully this event will lead to Russia and 'the west' getting together and formulating a plan and end game for Syria and all the groups fighting inside it. Except ISIS of course, they just need killing.

Edited by el stovey on Tuesday 24th November 14:12

[srj2411]

Sounds similar to earlier this year a Russian jet flew into British airspace and failed to respond to radio calls from the RAF. Two Typhoon's were scrambled and escorted the jet out of airspace.

I know next to nothing about any form of military activity but it seems they're both at fault here. If the 10 radio calls from Turkey were genuine then why didn't the pilots respond? Surely there would have been a "we are engaging a missile now" warning. Given Russia did the same thing near to the UK as mentioned, they seem to have a track record of flying on the edge of airspace borders (not to mention the repeated submarine sightings). The cynic in me does wonder if the primary aim is to antagonise and get this sort of reaction as part of a master-plan.

On the flip side whoever made the call to shoot it down must have been feeling pretty trigger happy knowing the eyes of the world are on this issue.

What a mess