Tony Martin held in relation to illegal firearms possession
Discussion
Scuffers said:
This thread has really shown up just how incapable the PH crowd are at debating anything sensibly in a joined up fashion
Quoted for posterity. By far the funniest sentence I've read this year. I'm never sure with PH if several prominent posters are diagnosed or undiagnosed bi-polar sufferers or if I'm simply being played. Nothing else seems to adequately explain it.Have a good Sunday everyone.
Astacus said:
La Liga said:
atCen do a lot of social research. They've been asking people this very question for many years. The support for the death penalty has been in a down trend since the 1980s. Their research indicates it's now below 50% whom support the death penalty for some offences.
Cant help being pedantic here. That graph does not show what you assert. The downward trend stopped about 2001 and the line has remained pretty static at be tween 50 and 60% since then. The last data point shows a downward blip, that cannot be considered a trendAs you were
Sorry, I hate people messing with the facts
Your assertion that 2014 is a blip is pure conjecture.
Based on what is indicated at this moment in time, from the data available, it is reasonable to call the trend downward.
Scuffers said:
This thread has really shown up just how incapable the PH crowd are at debating anything sensibly in a joined up fashion.
You spent half of yesterday shouting into your tablet that every who didn't answer your questions within some arbitrary timescale set by yourself was a "sanctimonious tosser" and then you come out with that gem? 
We have the usual PH appeasers and those that think TM's original burglars were little kids collecting a lost ball, plus those who would not be able to make the decisions TM had to, or had their own home ransacked and property regarded as a free for all because they live on their own.
Woe betide anyone who is caught messing with my stuff, it's happened three times now and the police did nothing. As I said before even the discarded remains I found of a jewellery theft were not given back to the victim, the police didn't return in daylight with detectors to find more in the mud as they said they would. After a week I did the detecting myself and found a fistful of gold stuff and managed to track down the victim to give it to her - she hadn't had any contact from plod.
Ahm oot.
Woe betide anyone who is caught messing with my stuff, it's happened three times now and the police did nothing. As I said before even the discarded remains I found of a jewellery theft were not given back to the victim, the police didn't return in daylight with detectors to find more in the mud as they said they would. After a week I did the detecting myself and found a fistful of gold stuff and managed to track down the victim to give it to her - she hadn't had any contact from plod.
Ahm oot.
Astacus said:
Cant help being pedantic here. That graph does not show what you assert. The downward trend stopped about 2001 and the line has remained pretty static at be tween 50 and 60% since then. The last data point shows a downward blip, that cannot be considered a trend
As you were
Sorry, I hate people messing with the facts
You're right insofar as it has spent as much time going sideways as down, but I would say overall it's fair to call it a down trend, especially with the new low it has made with the last data point, albeit that could just be an atypical result away from the recent mean, but that remains to be seen.As you were
Sorry, I hate people messing with the facts
DoubleSix said:
Hmmm I work in trend analysis for financial markets and I'd be happy to use (from that limited data set) the three lows '91, '01 and '14 to plot a downwards trend line.
Your assertion that 2014 is a blip is pure conjecture.
Based on what is indicated at this moment in time, from the data available, it is reasonable to call the trend downward.
It looks like the sort of pattern people get caught out on trying to 'bottom pick' / 'catch a falling knife' with. 'The trend is your friend', 'But I must go long!' Your assertion that 2014 is a blip is pure conjecture.
Based on what is indicated at this moment in time, from the data available, it is reasonable to call the trend downward.
scenario8 said:
Scuffers said:
This thread has really shown up just how incapable the PH crowd are at debating anything sensibly in a joined up fashion
Quoted for posterity. By far the funniest sentence I've read this year. I'm never sure with PH if several prominent posters are diagnosed or undiagnosed bi-polar sufferers or if I'm simply being played. Nothing else seems to adequately explain it.Have a good Sunday everyone.
Scuffers said:
Oh, I'm sorry, are you feeling left out?
As with most polls, a lot depends on what the question is.
if the question was:
"do you support the death penalty for criminals that are serving full life terms?"
or
"do you support the death penalty for repeated child sex offenders?"
or
"do you support the death penalty for criminals that have kill Police officers?"
I suspect the answer would be somewhat different.
AKA it doesn't show what you want so you dismiss it. Where's your evidence your baseless assumption was correct? As with most polls, a lot depends on what the question is.
if the question was:
"do you support the death penalty for criminals that are serving full life terms?"
or
"do you support the death penalty for repeated child sex offenders?"
or
"do you support the death penalty for criminals that have kill Police officers?"
I suspect the answer would be somewhat different.
I would speculate the question is one which would bring out the harshest answers as it allows the person the question is being asked of to decide which crimes the death penalty would apply to. That could encompass all of the above.
V6Pushfit said:
We have the usual PH appeasers and those that think TM's original burglars were little kids collecting a lost ball, plus those who would not be able to make the decisions TM had to, or had their own home ransacked and property regarded as a free for all because they live on their own.
It's not really about TM. It's about the wider implications of the law if you allow people to extract revenge, including the force the police would be able to use on the public. Points and questions I have raised over the pages that have gone ignored because there isn't a simple answer to them. The law is entwined and complex. Changes are often going to be like the 'butterfly effect'. That's why no one really liked the examples of the theoretical 10 year olds with their proposed changes. It's easy to think of the scenarios we'd be happy for people to be killed, but not so the ones were wouldn't.
DoubleSix said:
Astacus said:
La Liga said:
atCen do a lot of social research. They've been asking people this very question for many years. The support for the death penalty has been in a down trend since the 1980s. Their research indicates it's now below 50% whom support the death penalty for some offences.
Cant help being pedantic here. That graph does not show what you assert. The downward trend stopped about 2001 and the line has remained pretty static at be tween 50 and 60% since then. The last data point shows a downward blip, that cannot be considered a trendAs you were
Sorry, I hate people messing with the facts
Your assertion that 2014 is a blip is pure conjecture.
Based on what is indicated at this moment in time, from the data available, it is reasonable to call the trend downward.
In the meantime we all look at and argue about statistics and a little graph that is bent because plod does everything he can not to record unsolved crime by not recording it in the first place, calling it something else or not turning up at all. Easy.
Ahm oot fer gud noo
V6Pushfit said:
What brilliant news that potentially there's a downward trend. That makes it so much more acceptable to those burgled in the last couple of days, had their possessions taken and home damaged, in fact they should be jumping with joy shouldn't they?
It was in response to someone asking the question of how many people support the death penalty or not. It's nothing to do with those burgled. What irrelevant emotive rubbish in response to people having a debate about public support for the death penalty. V6Pushfit said:
In the meantime we all look at and argue about statistics and a little graph that is bent because plod does everything he can not to record unsolved crime by not recording it in the first place, calling it something else or not turning up at all. Easy.
The graph has nothing to do with any police data. The crime data quoted earlier on the thread has nothing to do with the police, either.0/2.
eharding said:
Scuffers said:
This thread has really shown up just how incapable the PH crowd are at debating anything sensibly in a joined up fashion.
Supremely rich, coming from someone who struggles to complete even a single posting in a sensible, joined-up fashion. 
Once him and his ilk have been removed, we can return things to normal. And better! And we'd have Scuffers to thank for it!
<mind bending paradox>
Greg66 said:
Here's an idea: let's adopt Scuffers' idea and start culling those who are of no use to society. It won't be too long before Scuffers himself is identified as being of no use to society, surely. He must be in the bottom 5 or 10%, no?
Once him and his ilk have been removed, we can return things to normal. And better! And we'd have Scuffers to thank for it!
<mind bending paradox>
Has this thread morphed into the writing style of a Famous Five book?Once him and his ilk have been removed, we can return things to normal. And better! And we'd have Scuffers to thank for it!
<mind bending paradox>
V6Pushfit said:
DoubleSix said:
Astacus said:
La Liga said:
atCen do a lot of social research. They've been asking people this very question for many years. The support for the death penalty has been in a down trend since the 1980s. Their research indicates it's now below 50% whom support the death penalty for some offences.
Cant help being pedantic here. That graph does not show what you assert. The downward trend stopped about 2001 and the line has remained pretty static at be tween 50 and 60% since then. The last data point shows a downward blip, that cannot be considered a trendAs you were
Sorry, I hate people messing with the facts
Your assertion that 2014 is a blip is pure conjecture.
Based on what is indicated at this moment in time, from the data available, it is reasonable to call the trend downward.
In the meantime we all look at and argue about statistics and a little graph that is bent because plod does everything he can not to record unsolved crime by not recording it in the first place, calling it something else or not turning up at all. Easy.
Ahm oot fer gud noo
Edited by DoubleSix on Sunday 3rd January 17:07
V6Pushfit said:
Greg66 said:
Here's an idea: let's adopt Scuffers' idea and start culling those who are of no use to society. It won't be too long before Scuffers himself is identified as being of no use to society, surely. He must be in the bottom 5 or 10%, no?
Once him and his ilk have been removed, we can return things to normal. And better! And we'd have Scuffers to thank for it!
<mind bending paradox>
Has this thread morphed into the writing style of a Famous Five book?Once him and his ilk have been removed, we can return things to normal. And better! And we'd have Scuffers to thank for it!
<mind bending paradox>
"Ahm oot fer gud noo"
I'm still waiting to find out where we draw the line in regards to those who deserve to die for their lack of positive contribution to society.
I do know it is somewhere between repeat burglars who should be exterminated and repeat traffic offenders who deserve to live (and have their questions answered promptly).
I do know it is somewhere between repeat burglars who should be exterminated and repeat traffic offenders who deserve to live (and have their questions answered promptly).
MTech535 said:
I'm still waiting to find out where we draw the line in regards to those who deserve to die for their lack of positive contribution to society.
I think if you're expecting the line in question to be drawn by Scuffers, you should also expect it to be drawn in crayon....with his toes.Having met an old mate today who has had a a six figure sum in cash stolen by while he was held at sledgehammer point on his bed (I doubt he will ever get over it) as far as I'm concerned the real world of crime needs real defence. No they weren't kids and they dressed as police. Staggering.
V6Pushfit said:
Having met an old mate today who has had a a six figure sum in cash stolen by while he was held at sledgehammer point on his bed (I doubt he will ever get over it) as far as I'm concerned the real world of crime needs real defence. No they weren't kids and they dressed as police. Staggering.
Really? - that must have made the headlines, surely?Any links to reports of this dreadful event in the media?
Not that I'm aware of, it was last August since when he's had a breakdown and a suicide attempt. Plod haven't put effort into it and makes me wonder how much of this gets swept under the carpet. Can't go into detail but there weren't many that knew he had the cash and he's the sort that drives a battered polo so you wouldn't guess.
V6Pushfit said:
Having met an old mate today who has had a a six figure sum in cash stolen by while he was held at sledgehammer point on his bed (I doubt he will ever get over it) as far as I'm concerned the real world of crime needs real defence. No they weren't kids and they dressed as police. Staggering.
So being armed wouldn't have any help whatsoever then, and potentially could have put a gun into the hand of criminals to use on the next poor victim.Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff