Brexit Poll 1/2/16
Poll: Brexit Poll 1/2/16
Total Members Polled: 1469
Discussion
eharding said:
PRTVR said:
steveT350C said:
PRTVR said:
The age of the audience appears young not many over forty in the audience, how is that representative?
It was specifically showcased as a younger audience; 18-25Careful you don't tune in half way through, assume it to be a huge Remainain propaganda creature-feature, and then make a minor bell-end of yourself belly-aching about it on PH......
gothatway said:
blueg33 said:
Not going to argue on here, but my vote will be to remain
Why not - embarrassed or inadequate ?As we start the final run to the wire, the Brexit camp should be working hard not to appear like a bunch of increasingly angry @reswipes, but more as positive evangelists for the post-Brexit reality - whatever that is.
You're not much of an evangelist, it would seem.
PRTVR said:
eharding said:
PRTVR said:
steveT350C said:
PRTVR said:
The age of the audience appears young not many over forty in the audience, how is that representative?
It was specifically showcased as a younger audience; 18-25Careful you don't tune in half way through, assume it to be a huge Remainain propaganda creature-feature, and then make a minor bell-end of yourself belly-aching about it on PH......
Apologies - having read it completely, am now fully assured that you were, in fact, being a bell-end.
HTH
I know I'm being biased but I've never known a Prime Minister sink this low,surely whether you are leave or remain you can see he's playing a pretty discusting game.Its one thing for normal politicians to play dirty but for someone who's meant to lead the country,trying to literally scare the crap out of people is beyond words.
Funkycoldribena said:
I know I'm being biased but I've never known a Prime Minister sink this low,surely whether you are leave or remain you can see he's playing a pretty discusting game.Its one thing for normal politicians to play dirty but for someone who's meant to lead the country,trying to literally scare the crap out of people is beyond words.
I think that rather depends on your point of view - if you think we'd be worse off out of the EU - as I do - and it seems the PM does - them wants the harm in expressing that view?If he thinks it is the case - and most of his advisors, the IFS, CBI and many other established entities agree - then surely it is fair for him to say so.
You may disagree, but he is entitled to his opinion, and to share it.
Funkycoldribena said:
I know I'm being biased but I've never known a Prime Minister sink this low,surely whether you are leave or remain you can see he's playing a pretty discusting game.Its one thing for normal politicians to play dirty but for someone who's meant to lead the country,trying to literally scare the crap out of people is beyond words.
It's criminal tbh, in my eyes. What a farce.gothatway said:
blueg33 said:
Not going to argue on here, but my vote will be to remain
Why not - embarrassed or inadequate ?Put simply, I am yet to hear a coherent, logical argument for why leaving will be better. The condominium arguments are full of "maybe" and "if", the stats on expenditure have been skewed to headlines ignoring rebates. Immigration, we have always had it, it's not going to stop, we have many migrants working in vital services, European migrants tend to be net contributors to the economy.
Non of the out arguments put forward address these points, the focus on sound bites and target the unthinking lowest bigoted common denominator.
blueg33 said:
gothatway said:
blueg33 said:
Not going to argue on here, but my vote will be to remain
Why not - embarrassed or inadequate ?Put simply, I am yet to hear a coherent, logical argument for why leaving will be better. The condominium arguments are full of "maybe" and "if", the stats on expenditure have been skewed to headlines ignoring rebates. Immigration, we have always had it, it's not going to stop, we have many migrants working in vital services, European migrants tend to be net contributors to the economy.
Non of the out arguments put forward address these points, the focus on sound bites and target the unthinking lowest bigoted common denominator.
Trouble is, we'll leave the organisation but still have to abide by its rules, whilst also having no influence on them. What is truly naive is to think you can leave a club & once you're out ignore all the bits you don't like, but keep all the benefits.
If we do leave then I think we're in for an awakening. I don't see the EU doing us any real favours, just because we're British & we voted to leave the club.
Post-Brexit the EU could unravel economically. Doing around 50% trade with them the consequences for us would be profound.
Of course that's not much of a problem if your "job" entails posting right wing garbage on a car forum 200 times a day, but for those of us with work to do & not living in ivory towers this is a major reason why we'll be voting remain.
Not an ideal solution, but far better in my opinion than the alternative.
Edited by zygalski on Friday 27th May 06:50
zygalski said:
blueg33 said:
gothatway said:
blueg33 said:
Not going to argue on here, but my vote will be to remain
Why not - embarrassed or inadequate ?Put simply, I am yet to hear a coherent, logical argument for why leaving will be better. The condominium arguments are full of "maybe" and "if", the stats on expenditure have been skewed to headlines ignoring rebates. Immigration, we have always had it, it's not going to stop, we have many migrants working in vital services, European migrants tend to be net contributors to the economy.
Non of the out arguments put forward address these points, the focus on sound bites and target the unthinking lowest bigoted common denominator.
Trouble is, we'll leave the club but still have to abide by its rules, whilst also having no influence on them. What is truly naive is to think you can leave a club & once you're out ignore all the bits you don't like, but keep all the benefits.
If we do leave then I think we're in for an awakening. I don't see the EU doing us any real favours, just because we're British & we voted to leave the club.
Post-Brexit the EU could unravel economically. Doing around 50% trade with them the consequences for us would be profound.
Of course that's not much of a problem if your "job" entails posting right wing garbage on a car forum 200 times a day, but for those of us with work to do & not living in ivory towers this is a major reason why we'll be voting remain.
Not an ideal solution, but far better in my opinion than the alternative.
Wait, you're serious.
A report from the Department of Transport released today says that remaps will produce a 10% lower increase in BHP if we leave the EU. Commenting on the findings, the Institute of Pulling Figures Out of The Air observed that whilst the report was at the lower end of projections, it was in line with all other studies which also indicated lower power and less opportunities for power oversteer if Brexit did take place. When asked to comment on the effects on car handling and ride quality of EU standard 22" alloys and rock hard suspension, they declined to comment.
///ajd said:
Funkycoldribena said:
I know I'm being biased but I've never known a Prime Minister sink this low,surely whether you are leave or remain you can see he's playing a pretty discusting game.Its one thing for normal politicians to play dirty but for someone who's meant to lead the country,trying to literally scare the crap out of people is beyond words.
I think that rather depends on your point of view - if you think we'd be worse off out of the EU - as I do - and it seems the PM does - them wants the harm in expressing that view?If he thinks it is the case - and most of his advisors, the IFS, CBI and many other established entities agree - then surely it is fair for him to say so.
You may disagree, but he is entitled to his opinion, and to share it.
He's not entitled to lie to us, feed us blatant propaganda and not explain or justify his 'opinion'.
And, either way, I believe he'll live to regret that he has.
REALIST123 said:
He's not entitled to lie to us, feed us blatant propaganda and not explain or justify his 'opinion'.
And, either way, I believe he'll live to regret that he has.
Seems many Brexiters are so keen to be governed exclusively by British politicians, they have forgotten how much they hate British politicians!
sealtt said:
REALIST123 said:
He's not entitled to lie to us, feed us blatant propaganda and not explain or justify his 'opinion'.
And, either way, I believe he'll live to regret that he has.
Seems many Brexiters are so keen to be governed exclusively by British politicians, they have forgotten how much they hate British politicians!
zygalski said:
My understanding is that the leave campaign isn't really concerned about the economic arguments. They are often glossed-over with a peculiar kind of rest of the world needs us more than we need them mentality. The main reason most of the Brexit/Flexit/Part-Ex-it will vote leave is because of what they see as purely ethical reasons, such as political sovereignty & economic/fiscal independence.
I think the problem is one of the credibility of economic forecasts - those made by the remainers assume that the EU stays as it is (ignoring the fact that it is declining in most measures of prosperity/economic growth/progress), while the forecasters themselves have a very poor track record. It is even more difficult to forecast the impact of leaving the EU - but that doesn't mean that the impact might well be less negative. So if we cannot rely on objective forecasts, then we all have to look at other aspects. Such as sovereignty, democracy, culture, fiscal integrity, ....zygalski said:
Trouble is, we'll leave the organisation but still have to abide by its rules, whilst also having no influence on them. What is truly naive is to think you can leave a club & once you're out ignore all the bits you don't like, but keep all the benefits.
Well no, not quite. Norway for example has plenty of influence prior to EU legislation being drafted.zygalski said:
If we do leave then I think we're in for an awakening. I don't see the EU doing us any real favours, just because we're British & we voted to leave the club.
Post-Brexit the EU could unravel economically. Doing around 50% trade with them the consequences for us would be profound.
I certainly wouldn't expect any such favours from the EU, and I can foresee the whole experiment unravelling. In fact, leave it a few more years without having Brexited I think the unravelling could be a lot more fraught. I would like to see the EU revert to something more like the EEC - a trading organisation without the "ever closer union" baggage. Maybe then we might consider buying back into it. And don't discount the opportunity for us to grow our trade with the rest of the world when freed from the shackles of EU trading rules.Post-Brexit the EU could unravel economically. Doing around 50% trade with them the consequences for us would be profound.
zygalski said:
Of course that's not much of a problem if your "job" entails posting right wing garbage on a car forum 200 times a day, but for those of us with work to do & not living in ivory towers this is a major reason why we'll be voting remain.
Not an ideal solution, but far better in my opinion than the alternative.
Do you think that last bit warrants a response ? You were doing quite well up until then.Not an ideal solution, but far better in my opinion than the alternative.
I think that if we leave, the EU will have to trade with us. They can't go it alone. Aren't we Germany's biggest trading partner and the second biggest economy in the EU?
There's also the rest of the world to trade with. We'll be in a strong position so no need to accept a whole load of migrants if we don't want them. Let them stay in France and Germany who after all wanted them. I hope this pack of cards falls down and countries like Sweden and Norway can deport the migrants they don't want.
There's also the rest of the world to trade with. We'll be in a strong position so no need to accept a whole load of migrants if we don't want them. Let them stay in France and Germany who after all wanted them. I hope this pack of cards falls down and countries like Sweden and Norway can deport the migrants they don't want.
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