Discussion
Jockman said:
Eric Mc said:
I would suggest that the death of Bowie was on a par with Elvis and Lennon and that Prince's death is actually at a slightly lower level - purely because popular music is less of a social influencer than it was in the 50s to the 70s.
It's all too subjective to be formulaic, Eric 
Memories of your first kiss, wedding song, no1 when your eldest was born, what you want to be played at your funeral....
Prince didn't connect with me so I haven't posted a memory. Along with you, I respect the right of others to feel differently.
First big gig I went to was Prince at the Wembley Arena with my sister. He was way too late on stage, but as we got there early we heard him doing the sound check (which was pretty darned epic). Absolutely brilliant show.
I was just left feeling numb at his death; whereas the others this year weren't anything like the same sort of impact.
clonmult said:
Jockman said:
Eric Mc said:
I would suggest that the death of Bowie was on a par with Elvis and Lennon and that Prince's death is actually at a slightly lower level - purely because popular music is less of a social influencer than it was in the 50s to the 70s.
It's all too subjective to be formulaic, Eric Memories of your first kiss, wedding song, no1 when your eldest was born, what you want to be played at your funeral....
Prince didn't connect with me so I haven't posted a memory. Along with you, I respect the right of others to feel differently.
First big gig I went to was Prince at the Wembley Arena with my sister. He was way too late on stage, but as we got there early we heard him doing the sound check (which was pretty darned epic). Absolutely brilliant show.
I was just left feeling numb at his death; whereas the others this year weren't anything like the same sort of impact.
clonmult said:
Jockman said:
Eric Mc said:
I would suggest that the death of Bowie was on a par with Elvis and Lennon and that Prince's death is actually at a slightly lower level - purely because popular music is less of a social influencer than it was in the 50s to the 70s.
It's all too subjective to be formulaic, Eric Memories of your first kiss, wedding song, no1 when your eldest was born, what you want to be played at your funeral....
Prince didn't connect with me so I haven't posted a memory. Along with you, I respect the right of others to feel differently.
First big gig I went to was Prince at the Wembley Arena with my sister. He was way too late on stage, but as we got there early we heard him doing the sound check (which was pretty darned epic). Absolutely brilliant show.
I was just left feeling numb at his death; whereas the others this year weren't anything like the same sort of impact.
I guess our emotions are some kind of electro-chemical reactions (to simplify) which are affected by what we see and what we hear. Prince quite clearly had imagery and sounds that offered the right stimuli for those reactions in many of us. If he made me feel good why would I not celebrate him and be sorry for his passing? I have lost something in my life that gave me joy, in essence, perhaps not the same loss as a family member or close friend but an important loss nonetheless. To mock mourning or to refer to extreme mourning and wailing on a thread where we are respectfully remembering what he did and our experiences of his music just seems irrelevant, unnecessary and crass.
Eric Mc said:
I still remember the mass upset caused by the deaths of Elvis Presley (aged 42) in 1977 and John Lennon (aged 40) in 1980.
I would suggest that the death of Bowie was on a par with Elvis and Lennon and that Prince's death is actually at a slightly lower level - purely because popular music is less of a social influencer than it was in the 50s to the 70s.
Me too, my Mum cried like a baby at the passing of Elvis, she'd been a huge fan since the early days. Lennon's death was on a different level to Bowie, due to his age and how he died, nothing to do with who was best. Bowie was an old man and contrary to the stories going around now had been rumoured to be ill for a long time.I would suggest that the death of Bowie was on a par with Elvis and Lennon and that Prince's death is actually at a slightly lower level - purely because popular music is less of a social influencer than it was in the 50s to the 70s.
Diana died not long after me and the O/H moved to London and we went around the Mall, Kensington Palace shortly after she died. The sea of flowers and candles really was an amazing site, beyond that her death didn't effect me in the slightest.
Eric Mc said:
I still remember the mass upset caused by the deaths of Elvis Presley (aged 42) in 1977 and John Lennon (aged 40) in 1980.
I would suggest that the death of Bowie was on a par with Elvis and Lennon and that Prince's death is actually at a slightly lower level - purely because popular music is less of a social influencer than it was in the 50s to the 70s.
I think this sort of thing is totally subjective.I would suggest that the death of Bowie was on a par with Elvis and Lennon and that Prince's death is actually at a slightly lower level - purely because popular music is less of a social influencer than it was in the 50s to the 70s.
If I told you that one of the formative albums of my youth was the Ace of Spades, and that Motorhead is comfortably the most played artisst on my iPod, you might surmise that the death of Lemmy last year was one of the most significant to me - you're right. But to me almost as significant and, in a way sadder and more poignant was the death earlier that year of his former band member Phil "Philthy Animal" Taylor.
Make no mistake about Lemmy though; he was under no illusion that, living life as he did, he was well into borrowed time and he faced the last few challenging years bravely and pragmatically and without backing down.
There is no doubt that certain singers and musicians will be very influential on certain individuals. I myself will have my own personal list.
HOWEVER, there will be some who transcend their genre and will have an influence beyond their immediate fan base - maybe even beyond the world of music. There have only been a small number who have done this over the life of the popular music industry which dates back just over 100 years.
In other words, what they did influenced not only music but also culture, lifestyle and society in general.
HOWEVER, there will be some who transcend their genre and will have an influence beyond their immediate fan base - maybe even beyond the world of music. There have only been a small number who have done this over the life of the popular music industry which dates back just over 100 years.
In other words, what they did influenced not only music but also culture, lifestyle and society in general.
Elvis's death was a huge event. But personal 'grief' was tempered by the fact that had had been finished as a creative artist for 20 years. And his death was a result of his own lifestyle. My immediate reaction to the news was "what a bloody stupid way to go" (literally eating yourself to death).
Lennon's death was much harder to take It was the sheer tragedy of him suffering an uninvited violent death at the hand of a deranged non-entity. He was also killed when he was happier than he had ever been.
Had he died from a heroin overdose or drank himself to death (as nearly happened in 1974) I doubt the outpouring of grief would have been so profound.
Between 1964 and 1970 Lennon was one of the four most famous people on the planet. His murder, much like Kennedy's, signalled the end of some mystical Age of Aquarius.
Lennon's death was much harder to take It was the sheer tragedy of him suffering an uninvited violent death at the hand of a deranged non-entity. He was also killed when he was happier than he had ever been.
Had he died from a heroin overdose or drank himself to death (as nearly happened in 1974) I doubt the outpouring of grief would have been so profound.
Between 1964 and 1970 Lennon was one of the four most famous people on the planet. His murder, much like Kennedy's, signalled the end of some mystical Age of Aquarius.
anonymous said:
[redacted]
You mean you were physically addicted to Prince in some way or you just liked his music? Anyway, absolutely no reason why someone shouldn't feel sorry for his passing. However when a celebrity passes that had the most tenuous link to a person that then overreacts in the manner more frequently displayed by certain quarters of the general public and on PH, it suggests a weak grip on reality, and an inability to recognise nostalgia for what it is. Other posters have noted the ever more mawkish postings of pretend grieving from narcissists on social fora - these are little more than 'look at me - I am more upset than you and can express it better' pathetic posts of bored loners that social medya gives voice to. Eric Mc said:
There is no doubt that certain singers and musicians will be very influential on certain individuals. I myself will have my own personal list.
HOWEVER, there will be some who transcend their genre and will have an influence beyond their immediate fan base - maybe even beyond the world of music. There have only been a small number who have done this over the life of the popular music industry which dates back just over 100 years.
In other words, what they did influenced not only music but also culture, lifestyle and society in general.
I would class Prince as one of those which transcends genres and encroaches into culture, film and fashion for example.Bowie was the same, Mercury too. Countless bands and artists today count Prince as an important influence. What artists from the current generation can live up to the likes of Prince and Bowie? Songwriting - Frank Ocean writea and sings some very classy songs with clever lyrics but he's not quite as flamboyant and doesn't do a show quite the same. Pharrell is a collaborator and can write well and has style. Ed Sheeran writes and sings well, with real instrumental talent and the ability to jump between genres. Lady Gaga, flamboyant but otherwise? HOWEVER, there will be some who transcend their genre and will have an influence beyond their immediate fan base - maybe even beyond the world of music. There have only been a small number who have done this over the life of the popular music industry which dates back just over 100 years.
In other words, what they did influenced not only music but also culture, lifestyle and society in general.
His type don't come round often.
popeyewhite said:
You mean you were physically addicted to Prince in some way or you just liked his music? Anyway, absolutely no reason why someone shouldn't feel sorry for his passing. However when a celebrity passes that had the most tenuous link to a person that then overreacts in the manner more frequently displayed by certain quarters of the general public and on PH, it suggests a weak grip on reality, and an inability to recognise nostalgia for what it is. Other posters have noted the ever more mawkish postings of pretend grieving from narcissists on social fora - these are little more than 'look at me - I am more upset than you and can express it better' pathetic posts of bored loners that social medya gives voice to.
I liked his music and considered him to be especially talented, a pretty iconic figure really. There's a range between 'just liking' something and being addicted to something. I think you and a few others are rather strange though. You come on a thread that is quite clearly populated by people that appreciate and value him and his music and want to talk about that between each other. You then propose the false premise that there is overreaction on PH towards his death. There is quite valid shock at his untimely death, there is appreciation, there is nostalgia too. And you talk about sad loners on social media. Why are you here? Are you a bored loner too?
anonymous said:
[redacted]
Yes. You suggested 'electro chemical reactions'! anonymous said:
[redacted]
No, first page reveals a mix of slightly disturbed and some level-headed posters.anonymous said:
[redacted]
No, It's a premise that qualifies my argument. I think you mean you disagree with my argument?anonymous said:
[redacted]
It's not really untimely though is it? He was 57 and ill.anonymous said:
[redacted]
Sorry if you like the other poster seem to have taken my comments personally, wasn't really directed specifically at you, just at the whole 'people who aren't important die and are afforded pathetically over-the-top reactions' brigade. I'd suggest most normal people will feel much more grief when they run over a cat, or somesuch. One of his more 'rock' oriented early songs.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=I30fIm0XiqE
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=I30fIm0XiqE
Edited by anonymous-user on Wednesday 27th April 00:24
popeyewhite said:
anonymous said:
[redacted]
Yes. You suggested 'electro chemical reactions'! anonymous said:
[redacted]
No, first page reveals a mix of slightly disturbed and some level-headed posters.anonymous said:
[redacted]
No, It's a premise that qualifies my argument. I think you mean you disagree with my argument?anonymous said:
[redacted]
It's not really untimely though is it? He was 57 and ill.anonymous said:
[redacted]
Sorry if you like the other poster seem to have taken my comments personally, wasn't really directed specifically at you, just at the whole 'people who aren't important die and are afforded pathetically over-the-top reactions' brigade. I'd suggest most normal people will feel much more grief when they run over a cat, or somesuch. Ali2202 said:
popeyewhite said:
anonymous said:
[redacted]
Yes. You suggested 'electro chemical reactions'! anonymous said:
[redacted]
No, first page reveals a mix of slightly disturbed and some level-headed posters.anonymous said:
[redacted]
No, It's a premise that qualifies my argument. I think you mean you disagree with my argument?anonymous said:
[redacted]
It's not really untimely though is it? He was 57 and ill.anonymous said:
[redacted]
Sorry if you like the other poster seem to have taken my comments personally, wasn't really directed specifically at you, just at the whole 'people who aren't important die and are afforded pathetically over-the-top reactions' brigade. I'd suggest most normal people will feel much more grief when they run over a cat, or somesuch. Edited by 98elise on Wednesday 27th April 08:50
The reason why more and more people feel the need now to express their grief when either a movie or music star dies is because I would like to think that like me they are part of the "rewind" generation.
If you were young in the 60s, you were limited to when you could hear your favourite music. It was either going to be live, when the song came on the very limited pop music radio stations or at home on a scratchy record player.
People who grew up in the late 70's and early 80's suddenly had music on demand. We had portable ghetto blasters, Walkman and in-car cassette decks and eventually CD players. We could listen to our favourite songs on the move and thanks to the rewind button again & again & again until the tape broke. And because of this joy of repetition we began to form our soundtrack to our lives. This being influenced by the ability to watch movies again & again, which were getting better at picking soundtracks which fitted certain scenes perfectly.
Basically think we are actors in our own lives. We hear something and it triggers deep memories in our psyche which takes us back to a certain time in our lives and we realise that people who created those memories will no longer be with us it makes sadder in a way that might not have affected previous generations. To say that expressing your loss is pathetic or annoying when certain songs, scenes and movies which an artist created formed such an important part of our lives seems more than a little petty.
Frankly, I'm very pleased that I have such strong memories that have been perfectly framed by some performers songs or films & I will continue to express my grief if I feel it.
If you were young in the 60s, you were limited to when you could hear your favourite music. It was either going to be live, when the song came on the very limited pop music radio stations or at home on a scratchy record player.
People who grew up in the late 70's and early 80's suddenly had music on demand. We had portable ghetto blasters, Walkman and in-car cassette decks and eventually CD players. We could listen to our favourite songs on the move and thanks to the rewind button again & again & again until the tape broke. And because of this joy of repetition we began to form our soundtrack to our lives. This being influenced by the ability to watch movies again & again, which were getting better at picking soundtracks which fitted certain scenes perfectly.
Basically think we are actors in our own lives. We hear something and it triggers deep memories in our psyche which takes us back to a certain time in our lives and we realise that people who created those memories will no longer be with us it makes sadder in a way that might not have affected previous generations. To say that expressing your loss is pathetic or annoying when certain songs, scenes and movies which an artist created formed such an important part of our lives seems more than a little petty.
Frankly, I'm very pleased that I have such strong memories that have been perfectly framed by some performers songs or films & I will continue to express my grief if I feel it.
I think Prince was an important and talented artist, I grew up hearing his songs, never a big fan but I could certainly see why people were.
Whether he is dead or alive makes not one iota of difference to me, he wont produce any more music but no doubt there will be numerous releases of unreleased stuff, even if he had released a new album, I probably would have bought it, might have heard it on the radio, so very little material difference to my life, just sad to hear that another human died before his time but then so do many others, another part of my younger years is now history, it was anyway but it brings it home that we are getting older.
No actual "grief" from me, just surprise at his passing and some respect for someone who was very innovative, flamboyant and talented.
Whether he is dead or alive makes not one iota of difference to me, he wont produce any more music but no doubt there will be numerous releases of unreleased stuff, even if he had released a new album, I probably would have bought it, might have heard it on the radio, so very little material difference to my life, just sad to hear that another human died before his time but then so do many others, another part of my younger years is now history, it was anyway but it brings it home that we are getting older.
No actual "grief" from me, just surprise at his passing and some respect for someone who was very innovative, flamboyant and talented.
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