Hillsborough Inquest
Discussion
Vaud said:
RobinOakapple said:
That's reassuring, one wouldn't want any of the actual participants to feel guilty about anything.
They've only spent two years looking at the evidence. What would they know?lockhart flawse said:
As I said on the thread last year - the Police were always likely to cop the blame on this.
I accept that their response to the unfolding events was inadequate but it is hard to imagine the outcome on the day at any event other than a football match.
Agreed. I accept that their response to the unfolding events was inadequate but it is hard to imagine the outcome on the day at any event other than a football match.
Crowd fatalities only ever occur at football matches.
(Or do they?)
Are you trying to imply that these football fans brought this tragedy on themselves?
If you are, this is precisely the direction the OP didn't want this thread to go.
Dan_1981 said:
Full list of the 14 questions they need to answer here:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-merseyside-35...
Only on one of those questions. all the others were unanimous http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-merseyside-35...
Eric Mc said:
lockhart flawse said:
As I said on the thread last year - the Police were always likely to cop the blame on this.
I accept that their response to the unfolding events was inadequate but it is hard to imagine the outcome on the day at any event other than a football match.
I accept that their response to the unfolding events was inadequate but it is hard to imagine the outcome on the day at any event other than a football match.
Agreed.
Crowd fatalities only ever occur at football matches.
(Or do they?)
Are you trying to imply that these football fans brought this tragedy on themselves?
Eric Mc said:
lockhart flawse said:
As I said on the thread last year - the Police were always likely to cop the blame on this.
I accept that their response to the unfolding events was inadequate but it is hard to imagine the outcome on the day at any event other than a football match.
Agreed. I accept that their response to the unfolding events was inadequate but it is hard to imagine the outcome on the day at any event other than a football match.
Crowd fatalities only ever occur at football matches.
(Or do they?)
Are you trying to imply that these football fans brought this tragedy on themselves?
If you are, this is precisely the direction the OP didn't want this thread to go.
While those individuals who sadly died had probably no responsibility for what happened, collectively, as a group football fans had behaved so badly that they were put into cages. Not to excuse the lack of decisions from those in authority etc.
REALIST123 said:
Are you implying that the behaviour of the fans, as a whole, on that day had no bearing on what happened?
In what way was their behaviour different to any other football match at that time?Why was the outcome of such behaviour so different to any other football match at that time?
I was hesitant to start the thread, mainly as I've seen the outcome from previous ones - usually the mods end up locking it.
We managed almost 13 posts before things turned in that direction....
However on the other hand I don't think the event can go without discussion.
There are always going to be differing opinions in the blame attributed to fans - however could we at least be a little respectful when discussing?
Particularly in light of the finding from the inquest.
We managed almost 13 posts before things turned in that direction....
However on the other hand I don't think the event can go without discussion.
There are always going to be differing opinions in the blame attributed to fans - however could we at least be a little respectful when discussing?
Particularly in light of the finding from the inquest.
sirtyro said:
I do feel sorry for those in charge on the day who might now face criminal prosecution. Having to live with the fact that firstly all those people died under your watch and then wait 25 years to find out what might happen next. There are no winners today.
If they hadnt lied through there teeth to try and hide the fact they screwed up this would have been decided years ago. They brought it in themselves. simple as that
Quite.
If I might suggest, there is a slightly different point -- "the group behaviour of a crowd" may have caused issues (though I don't think this was asked), but not individual fan behaviour. To stretch an analogy, the wobbly Millennium bridge was in part caused by a group behaviour and not individuals.
Moving on, does this mean parties could now face criminal charges?
If I might suggest, there is a slightly different point -- "the group behaviour of a crowd" may have caused issues (though I don't think this was asked), but not individual fan behaviour. To stretch an analogy, the wobbly Millennium bridge was in part caused by a group behaviour and not individuals.
Moving on, does this mean parties could now face criminal charges?
Lincsblokey said:
sirtyro said:
I do feel sorry for those in charge on the day who might now face criminal prosecution. Having to live with the fact that firstly all those people died under your watch and then wait 25 years to find out what might happen next. There are no winners today.
If they hadnt lied through there teeth to try and hide the fact they screwed up this would have been decided years ago. They brought it in themselves. simple as that
'We've changed since then',
And words such as structural change, root and branch, systemic, integrity..
You know, all the usual suspects and perhaps a few more new ones to come. Who knows.
Lincsblokey said:
If they hadnt lied through there teeth to try and hide the fact they screwed up this would have been decided years ago.
They brought it in themselves. simple as that
This, that was/is the real problem.They brought it in themselves. simple as that
Every profession/trade is the same and oh yes, so are families and races.
surveyor said:
Taking a rare step into NP&E.
While those individuals who sadly died had probably no responsibility for what happened, collectively, as a group football fans had behaved so badly that they were put into cages. Not to excuse the lack of decisions from those in authority etc.
That's my view. They paid the price for a long history of bad behaviour by football fans in the past, by others most likely - and a set of prejudices and assumptions held against them by those authorities who were tasked with controlling them on a regular basis.While those individuals who sadly died had probably no responsibility for what happened, collectively, as a group football fans had behaved so badly that they were put into cages. Not to excuse the lack of decisions from those in authority etc.
It wouldn't have happened at other sporting venues most likely because they wouldn't have been penned in in the same way.
Having said that, other crowd situations at other types of events - such as rock concerts or religious ceremonies - have also caused multiple deaths. And at the bottom of nearly all these tragedies is often poor planning and a bad attitude held by those who are tasked with planning, managing and running the event.
sirtyro said:
I do feel sorry for those in charge on the day who might now face criminal prosecution. Having to live with the fact that firstly all those people died under your watch and then wait 25 years to find out what might happen next. There are no winners today.
Perhaps you are not aware of the systematic cover up and lies they told. That's the reason it's taken 27 years to get to this point.No-one purposefully and maliciously set out to cause the deaths of any of the 96 that day. May they rest in peace.
The lying and the cover up that followed was truly reprehensible.
I doubt any trials will be forthcoming from this. It would be better in my opinion to lay this to rest, to issue apologises and recompense where needed/deserved, and to take lessons learnt forward.
The lying and the cover up that followed was truly reprehensible.
I doubt any trials will be forthcoming from this. It would be better in my opinion to lay this to rest, to issue apologises and recompense where needed/deserved, and to take lessons learnt forward.
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