Red Ken suspended
Discussion
BlackLabel said:
Ken went on the BBC this morning to defend Keith Vaz however he ended up talking about Hitler again.
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/ken-living...
Total fhttp://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/ken-living...
kstick. If it were anyone else, I'd suspect incipient senility, but it's Ken. 
BlackLabel said:
Ken went on the BBC this morning to defend Keith Vaz however he ended up talking about Hitler again.
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/ken-living...
Forget anti-semitisim or bringing the party into disrepute, he should be kicked out for being grossly stupid.http://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/ken-living...
I bet Milne wishes he could sew Livingstone's lips together.
What is wrong with this man... he can't seem to go more than 5 minutes without talking about Jews, Hitler or the Nazis. How difficult is it to say "I'm not going to comment further on this matter" to interviewers that bait him?
What a fking moron, how on earth did he managed to be a top line politician and London mayor for so many years. I mean it is almost like he is deliberately trying to sabotage his own party because every time he opens his mouth he makes the entire Labour party look like a bunch of plonkers. They should stop fannying about with suspensions and just kick him out completely at this point.
What a f
king moron, how on earth did he managed to be a top line politician and London mayor for so many years. I mean it is almost like he is deliberately trying to sabotage his own party because every time he opens his mouth he makes the entire Labour party look like a bunch of plonkers. They should stop fannying about with suspensions and just kick him out completely at this point. VolvoT5 said:
What a fking moron, how on earth did he managed to be a top line politician and London mayor for so many years. I mean it is almost like he is deliberately trying to sabotage his own party because every time he opens his mouth he makes the entire Labour party look like a bunch of plonkers. They should stop fannying about with suspensions and just kick him out completely at this point.
He fits in perfectly with the other morons surrounding moron-in-chief Corbyn.king moron, how on earth did he managed to be a top line politician and London mayor for so many years. I mean it is almost like he is deliberately trying to sabotage his own party because every time he opens his mouth he makes the entire Labour party look like a bunch of plonkers. They should stop fannying about with suspensions and just kick him out completely at this point. BlackLabel said:
Ken went on the BBC this morning to defend Keith Vaz however he ended up talking about Hitler again.
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/ken-living...
I'm sure he must have some kind of mental condition going on there. Or he's winding us all up.http://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/ken-living...
hairyben said:
BlackLabel said:
Ken went on the BBC this morning to defend Keith Vaz however he ended up talking about Hitler again.
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/ken-living...
I'm sure he must have some kind of mental condition going on there. Or he's winding us all up.http://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/ken-living...
Nobody could be that stupid.
He's not young, is he?
Does anybody have an unedited version available? Did the reporter mention the H word or allude to Kens prior comments or did Ken just bring it up?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cdf8UvkjUbc
You all saw him, HE HAD A GUN!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cdf8UvkjUbc
You all saw him, HE HAD A GUN!
carinaman said:
Did the BBC lead him up the garden path?
Ffs Ken just stop digging.
guardian said:
Ken Livingstone has claimed there was at one point “real collaboration” between the Nazis and Jews, ahead of a hearing concerned with whether he has brought the Labour party into disrepute.
The former London mayor made the fresh series of highly controversial remarks before the start of an internal party tribunal that is hearing evidence about his suspension from the Labour party a year ago.
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/politics/2017/mar/30/ken-livingstone-repeats-claim-nazi-zionist-collaborationThe former London mayor made the fresh series of highly controversial remarks before the start of an internal party tribunal that is hearing evidence about his suspension from the Labour party a year ago.
BlackLabel said:
Ffs Ken just stop digging.
Can't stand not being in the news, obviously.guardian said:
Ken Livingstone has claimed there was at one point “real collaboration” between the Nazis and Jews, ahead of a hearing concerned with whether he has brought the Labour party into disrepute.
The former London mayor made the fresh series of highly controversial remarks before the start of an internal party tribunal that is hearing evidence about his suspension from the Labour party a year ago.
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/politics/2017/mar/30/ken-livingstone-repeats-claim-nazi-zionist-collaborationThe former London mayor made the fresh series of highly controversial remarks before the start of an internal party tribunal that is hearing evidence about his suspension from the Labour party a year ago.
It's a bit confusing. He's suggesting that Hitler supported the Jews right up until the start of WWII. So a positive there as he's not claiming they invaded Poland. It's downhill from there though.
There was a lot of intrigue in Germany around the time and I reckon that Hitler wasn't that supportive of Jews during krystallnacht and probably for some days beforehand. Read all about it in Meine Kampf. Livingstone is provably wrong. Mind you, when did that stop him.
There is a support for the argument that extermination camps, as opposed to concentration camps, didn't start until 1939. However, the concentration camps were hardly conducive to a long and healthy life. Jews were incarcerated from early on, probably 1934. I knew a lovely woman in Petticoat Towers, just off Petticoat Lane (Middlesex Street), who was sent to the UK by her middle class family in '35. Her extended family was 'rounded up' a little later and none survived the war.
Hitler said many things in order to obtain power - I'd have thought a politician would have taken this as read - and there was much propaganda in the middle to late 30s. I remember seeing a film of an orchestra, supposedly one in every concentration camp, that was made up of Jewish musicians. It convinced only the mentally feeble in Germany at the time.
In many ways I'm against any restriction on the discussion of history. No one is an authority. What is taught about German atrocities before and during the war should not be limited by any group, even one that suffered to the extent that the Jews did. However, one wonders about Livingstone's motives. If it was a genuine intent to bring a new interpretation to the facts and circumstances then we should accept it. It's history.
If he's doing it for reasons of antisemitism then he should be prosecuted in the same way anyone would if they lied about any race for reasons of hatred.
If labour want to be a serious party they need to get serious about the antisemitism that the party seems impregnated with.
I grew up amongst a rich racial spread, which included a number of Jews who had escaped from Germany. They were the most patriotic of any grouping. I had Jewish mates. In my time I saw no antisemitism. Anti-Irish - now there was antagonism. When Windrush unloaded, racialism was apparent. No one, but no one, had any problem with Jews. I didn't know them as Jews; they were just the same as me and the rest of the guys.
Antisemitism bewilders me. What's the problem?
There was a lot of intrigue in Germany around the time and I reckon that Hitler wasn't that supportive of Jews during krystallnacht and probably for some days beforehand. Read all about it in Meine Kampf. Livingstone is provably wrong. Mind you, when did that stop him.
There is a support for the argument that extermination camps, as opposed to concentration camps, didn't start until 1939. However, the concentration camps were hardly conducive to a long and healthy life. Jews were incarcerated from early on, probably 1934. I knew a lovely woman in Petticoat Towers, just off Petticoat Lane (Middlesex Street), who was sent to the UK by her middle class family in '35. Her extended family was 'rounded up' a little later and none survived the war.
Hitler said many things in order to obtain power - I'd have thought a politician would have taken this as read - and there was much propaganda in the middle to late 30s. I remember seeing a film of an orchestra, supposedly one in every concentration camp, that was made up of Jewish musicians. It convinced only the mentally feeble in Germany at the time.
In many ways I'm against any restriction on the discussion of history. No one is an authority. What is taught about German atrocities before and during the war should not be limited by any group, even one that suffered to the extent that the Jews did. However, one wonders about Livingstone's motives. If it was a genuine intent to bring a new interpretation to the facts and circumstances then we should accept it. It's history.
If he's doing it for reasons of antisemitism then he should be prosecuted in the same way anyone would if they lied about any race for reasons of hatred.
If labour want to be a serious party they need to get serious about the antisemitism that the party seems impregnated with.
I grew up amongst a rich racial spread, which included a number of Jews who had escaped from Germany. They were the most patriotic of any grouping. I had Jewish mates. In my time I saw no antisemitism. Anti-Irish - now there was antagonism. When Windrush unloaded, racialism was apparent. No one, but no one, had any problem with Jews. I didn't know them as Jews; they were just the same as me and the rest of the guys.
Antisemitism bewilders me. What's the problem?
Edited by Derek Smith on Thursday 30th March 19:57
Derek Smith said:
Antisemitism bewilders me. What's the problem?
Dates back to Jewish/Roman tensions and conflict which subsequently influenced the Roman catholic church.Ever wondered why there are so many Jewish involved with banking? Because they were persecuted and were the only ones allowed to lend money as Ursury was banned in the early catholic church.
Ever wondered why there are so many Jews in Media/Entertainment? Because it was seen as a dirty profession and one of the only places Jews could find work.
Edited by skyrover on Thursday 30th March 20:16
skyrover said:
Derek Smith said:
Antisemitism bewilders me. What's the problem?
Dates back to Jewish/Roman tensions and conflict which subsequently influenced the Roman catholic church.Ever wondered why there are so many Jewish involved with banking? Because they were persecuted and were the only ones allowed to lend money as Ursury was banned in the early catholic church.
Ever wondered why there are so many Jews in Media/Entertainment? Because it was seen as a dirty profession and one of the only places Jews could find work.
Edited by skyrover on Thursday 30th March 20:16
ks, of course, but held sway for a long, long time.basherX said:
skyrover said:
Derek Smith said:
Antisemitism bewilders me. What's the problem?
Dates back to Jewish/Roman tensions and conflict which subsequently influenced the Roman catholic church.Ever wondered why there are so many Jewish involved with banking? Because they were persecuted and were the only ones allowed to lend money as Ursury was banned in the early catholic church.
Ever wondered why there are so many Jews in Media/Entertainment? Because it was seen as a dirty profession and one of the only places Jews could find work.
Edited by skyrover on Thursday 30th March 20:16
ks, of course, but held sway for a long, long time.I was told in church that the 'Jews killed Jesus' and then told in history that the Romans killed Jesus, at least according to the only book available about the time. There were any number of films about Moses and stuff and they had no effect on me. Rather, the fact that Charlton Heston was in such things made it stories.
No one in my, quite large, group ever bothered about who did what to whom 2000 years ago.
Thinking back, the only Jewish lad we sort of took the mickey out of was a red-haired one, but that was because of his hair. We used to go to the Harp Club (Irish of course) and it was a shame I missed the irony of him fitting right in, certainly more than me.
If Mel Gibson is anti Jew then that's enough reason for me to know that it's all rubbish.
East End racism first came to my notice in the days when blacks were after jobs down the docks and stuff. The No blacks, no dogs, no Irish was everywhere in lodgings. I went out with a Jewish girl, from a rich Blackheath family, and it meant little on my side and, according to the girl, nothing to here parents either. Some of their religious days were when I was told it might be best to stay away.
Before the war, at least according to my dad, there was a lot of antisemitism brought on by Mosley and his mob. After the war Ozzy, as his mates called him, and Max tried the same thing and got nowhere. Everyone seemed against them.
We used to tell jokes that nowadays would generate a visit from the thought police, but there was no racial prejudice in them. The only time I was subjected to anything like racism was when kids I barely knew called me 'bog Irish'. I'm not sure they knew what they were saying. I certainly didn't. I told my nan and she was completely unfazed - having 18 kids does that to you. She just said, 'We are.' The perfect answer. Well done gran.
I know it's a secret, so don't tell no-one, but Jews are just like us. Shocking, but true.
Oh! And they didn't kill Jesus. If it was anyone it was the Romans. And they didn't either.
There's nothing like feeling better than someone else to make you forget your own inadequacies.
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