Can we talk about Austria a little?
Discussion
Sam All said:
Axionknight said:
I think he will lose out - just. That might not mean the end of any displeasure many have with the political system of course, it may even make it worse if they feel cheated or the obligatory cries of "we were cheated" arise.
This ^ - other governments take note, uncontrolled immigration results in undesirable consequences.Surely the key point here is that the view is split damn nearly 50 50 between two "extreme" parties. I.e. Josef Durchschnitt is taking the opportunity to lodge a protest vote against the mainstream parties in an election to a fairly unimportant office.
It's not so much that Merkel et al misread the public mood, but that public opinion is deeply divided and there is widespread (mainly irrational) discontent with mainstream politics.
This is nothing new. When talking about the EU, a lot of Brits give the impression that there is some broadly held European consensus view that the EU should become ever more tightly integrated and that national identities will be diluted. This is starkly at odds with reality as shown by this current election and plenty of others in the past. There is a huge amount of opposition to the creation of a centralised superstate, so much so that I think it is a pure fantasy to think it'll come about in the foreseeable future regardless of whether the UK remains in or leaves.
It's not so much that Merkel et al misread the public mood, but that public opinion is deeply divided and there is widespread (mainly irrational) discontent with mainstream politics.
This is nothing new. When talking about the EU, a lot of Brits give the impression that there is some broadly held European consensus view that the EU should become ever more tightly integrated and that national identities will be diluted. This is starkly at odds with reality as shown by this current election and plenty of others in the past. There is a huge amount of opposition to the creation of a centralised superstate, so much so that I think it is a pure fantasy to think it'll come about in the foreseeable future regardless of whether the UK remains in or leaves.
ATG said:
Surely the key point here is that the view is split damn nearly 50 50 between two "extreme" parties. I.e. Josef Durchschnitt is taking the opportunity to lodge a protest vote against the mainstream parties in an election to a fairly unimportant office.
It's not so much that Merkel et al misread the public mood, but that public opinion is deeply divided and there is widespread (mainly irrational) discontent with mainstream politics.
This is nothing new. When talking about the EU, a lot of Brits give the impression that there is some broadly held European consensus view that the EU should become ever more tightly integrated and that national identities will be diluted. This is starkly at odds with reality as shown by this current election and plenty of others in the past. There is a huge amount of opposition to the creation of a centralised superstate, so much so that I think it is a pure fantasy to think it'll come about in the foreseeable future regardless of whether the UK remains in or leaves.
It's known as "Political Polarisation", it's becoming quite a thing in America tooIt's not so much that Merkel et al misread the public mood, but that public opinion is deeply divided and there is widespread (mainly irrational) discontent with mainstream politics.
This is nothing new. When talking about the EU, a lot of Brits give the impression that there is some broadly held European consensus view that the EU should become ever more tightly integrated and that national identities will be diluted. This is starkly at odds with reality as shown by this current election and plenty of others in the past. There is a huge amount of opposition to the creation of a centralised superstate, so much so that I think it is a pure fantasy to think it'll come about in the foreseeable future regardless of whether the UK remains in or leaves.
http://www.people-press.org/2014/06/12/section-1-g...
If you click "animate" in that link you can see that even in the past 5 years voters are moving towards the extremes much more than previously.
EnglishTony said:
I feel that I should just point out that the candidate is supported by the Greens. He's not a member of the party.
Then again there's no Green that would support the UKIP energy policy and it's the most realistic of all such from UK parties.If the Greens say OK it's likely not. They really are that far off kilter even for their own supposed aims.
BBC now reporting van der Bellen has won.
Austria 'rejects far-right president, electing Van der Bellen'
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-36362505
Austria 'rejects far-right president, electing Van der Bellen'
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-36362505
ATG said:
Surely the key point here is that the view is split damn nearly 50 50 between two "extreme" parties. I.e. Josef Durchschnitt is taking the opportunity to lodge a protest vote against the mainstream parties in an election to a fairly unimportant office.
It's not so much that Merkel et al misread the public mood, but that public opinion is deeply divided and there is widespread (mainly irrational) discontent with mainstream politics.
This is nothing new. When talking about the EU, a lot of Brits give the impression that there is some broadly held European consensus view that the EU should become ever more tightly integrated and that national identities will be diluted. This is starkly at odds with reality as shown by this current election and plenty of others in the past. There is a huge amount of opposition to the creation of a centralised superstate, so much so that I think it is a pure fantasy to think it'll come about in the foreseeable future regardless of whether the UK remains in or leaves.
I don't think it's that public opinion is 'deeply divided' any more than it ever has been, it's more that in the rush to the centre, the traditional 'left' and 'right' politics has been lost and unfortunately many people are identifying less and less with mainstream politicians of either of the main parties. It's not so much that Merkel et al misread the public mood, but that public opinion is deeply divided and there is widespread (mainly irrational) discontent with mainstream politics.
This is nothing new. When talking about the EU, a lot of Brits give the impression that there is some broadly held European consensus view that the EU should become ever more tightly integrated and that national identities will be diluted. This is starkly at odds with reality as shown by this current election and plenty of others in the past. There is a huge amount of opposition to the creation of a centralised superstate, so much so that I think it is a pure fantasy to think it'll come about in the foreseeable future regardless of whether the UK remains in or leaves.
This is happening across Europe and as more and more mainstream parties agree (or appear to agree to win centrist votes) with one another's policies, more and more countries are seeing the rise of parties that answer the questions ordinary people have that aren't being answered by the old establishment (cf. Gordon Brown's 'racist' statement).
The influence of the EU has hastened this process as it extended it's reach into the mainstream politics of it's member states leaving few places to go for voters who don't like the direction it's heading and a uniformity of message they're being given, especially at the moment around the migration crisis.
jb2410 said:
BBC now reporting van der Bellen has won.
Austria 'rejects far-right president, electing Van der Bellen'
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-36362505
well, to be fair the postal votes decided who won. See also: EU referendum next monthAustria 'rejects far-right president, electing Van der Bellen'
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-36362505
Otispunkmeyer said:
is the FAR-FAR-FAR-OFF-INTO-THE-DISTANCE-RIGHT Guy really super RIGHT? or is he just in the middle somewhere and everyone else is so left that he looks right? Am I right or am I left wrong?
He's probably to the right of the loony far-left... which makes him sort of centre but maybe a little to the left....EnglishTony said:
I feel that I should just point out that the candidate is supported by the Greens. He's not a member of the party.
Fair enough, Austrian politics isn't something I know about, but support isn't free is it! No doubt there will be more damaging/crackpot carbon tax/reduction policies as a result.swimd said:
The fact that Van der Bellen barely scraped by with a 0.3% win despite full support from virtually all other parties, the national and international media and many public figures is food for thought. The trend is very clear. I would not want to be in his shoes.
And even then only won because of postal votes??????Mmmmm that's all legit then...
Budflicker said:
swimd said:
The fact that Van der Bellen barely scraped by with a 0.3% win despite full support from virtually all other parties, the national and international media and many public figures is food for thought. The trend is very clear. I would not want to be in his shoes.
And even then only won because of postal votes??????Mmmmm that's all legit then...
Mr GrimNasty said:
EnglishTony said:
I feel that I should just point out that the candidate is supported by the Greens. He's not a member of the party.
Fair enough, Austrian politics isn't something I know about, but support isn't free is it! No doubt there will be more damaging/crackpot carbon tax/reduction policies as a result.
The Austrian president doesn't have many powers. Their greatest power is the ability to dissolve parliament, but otherwise they are a figurehead.
Puggit said:
Mr GrimNasty said:
EnglishTony said:
I feel that I should just point out that the candidate is supported by the Greens. He's not a member of the party.
Fair enough, Austrian politics isn't something I know about, but support isn't free is it! No doubt there will be more damaging/crackpot carbon tax/reduction policies as a result.The Austrian president doesn't have many powers. Their greatest power is the ability to dissolve parliament, but otherwise they are a figurehead.
(although I'm sure you're underestimating how the levers of power actually work)! Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff