The 'No to the EU' campaign Vol 2

The 'No to the EU' campaign Vol 2

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Discussion

hedgefinder

3,418 posts

169 months

Saturday 2nd July 2016
quotequote all
can ALL of the well educated Remainers who got passes in the their GCSE, A level or degree courses with between 52% and 60% on ANY of their exams or assignmets/modules/coursework please hand back all their qualifications.... the percentage wasnt high enough, obviously.

dandarez

13,246 posts

282 months

Saturday 2nd July 2016
quotequote all
romeogolf said:
boxxob said:
You seem to be presuming that a large proportion of those voting Remain understand what they were voting for.

So if we voted 52-48 in favour of remain but parliament decided to leave anyway, then what would you say?
The difference is that 'to leave' is to make a change. Remaining is 'as it always was'. We cannot be neither in nor out.

Were the vote in favour of remain my response would be the same: Clearly half the country are not satisfied with the EU as it stands and we need change. The threshold should always have been a wider margin. A near 50-50 split as it has been is not conclusive in either direction.
Course it's not, so why weren't all you Remainians squealing 'before' the vote, that it must be more than conclusive, it must be, what at least 60/40 either way? But you didn't did you, none of you. You thought Remain was a forgone conclusion. It wasn't. You lost. Get over it. Just as I would have if Remain had won.

As for Remaining is 'as it always was', that is not simply true. When I (was young) voted stay in 75 it was a common market with 9 other members. NINE!
Remaining is 'as it always was'. rolleyes

steveatesh

4,893 posts

163 months

Saturday 2nd July 2016
quotequote all
romeogolf said:
The difference is that 'to leave' is to make a change. Remaining is 'as it always was'. We cannot be neither in nor out.

Were the vote in favour of remain my response would be the same: Clearly half the country are not satisfied with the EU as it stands and we need change. The threshold should always have been a wider margin. A near 50-50 split as it has been is not conclusive in either direction.
But sadly for your opinion it was 52 - 48 and by the rules that was decisive enough for Leave to win.

Curious as to when will be the right time for you to accept that and move on with your life?

Axionknight

8,505 posts

134 months

Saturday 2nd July 2016
quotequote all
steveatesh said:
romeogolf said:
The difference is that 'to leave' is to make a change. Remaining is 'as it always was'. We cannot be neither in nor out.

Were the vote in favour of remain my response would be the same: Clearly half the country are not satisfied with the EU as it stands and we need change. The threshold should always have been a wider margin. A near 50-50 split as it has been is not conclusive in either direction.
But sadly for your opinion it was 52 - 48 and by the rules that was decisive enough for Leave to win.

Curious as to when will be the right time for you to accept that and move on with your life?
When a second referedum is held and remain wins by a small margin, perhaps?

Result I want = democracy in action
Result I didn't want = the uneducated masses ruining it for "the rest of us".

steveatesh

4,893 posts

163 months

Saturday 2nd July 2016
quotequote all
Axionknight said:
When a second referedum is held and remain wins by a small margin, perhaps?

Result I want = democracy in action
Result I didn't want = the uneducated masses ruining it for "the rest of us".
The last point is important isn't it. They are all trying to find reasons why leave was the result rather than face the truth which is that a majority of the voters simply no longer want to be part of the EU for reasons they have rationalised themselves.

I came across the term a "black swan" event and this appears to have been one - something huge and unexpected, an outlier, which the masses then find a simplistic excuse or reason for using hindsight.


don4l

10,058 posts

175 months

Saturday 2nd July 2016
quotequote all
steveatesh said:
romeogolf said:
The difference is that 'to leave' is to make a change. Remaining is 'as it always was'. We cannot be neither in nor out.

Were the vote in favour of remain my response would be the same: Clearly half the country are not satisfied with the EU as it stands and we need change. The threshold should always have been a wider margin. A near 50-50 split as it has been is not conclusive in either direction.
But sadly for your opinion it was 52 - 48 and by the rules that was decisive enough for Leave to win.

Curious as to when will be the right time for you to accept that and move on with your life?
I'm astonished.

Everybody sulks now and again.

...but 8 days???

FiF gave out to me early on in this discussion for being a bit abrasive. My position was that you couldn't reason with lefties.

I think that I have been vindicated. It is absolutely impossible to have a sensible discussion with them. They will always back the course of action that will do most harm to their country.

I first noticed this when I was only 23 years old. I had a neighbour who was a Trotskyist. He was a nice, intelligent chap, but the poison was unbelievable. I once asked him if both of us could live after his revolution came, and he admitted that one of us would have to die.






AJS-

15,366 posts

235 months

Saturday 2nd July 2016
quotequote all
Ha any party ever won 52% at a general election? Yet they have all made changes.

Highest I could find was 49% for Harold MacMillain. Heath won with under 42% in 1970 and felt this was enough to take us into the EU.

danllama

5,728 posts

141 months

Saturday 2nd July 2016
quotequote all
romeogolf said:
boxxob said:
You seem to be presuming that a large proportion of those voting Remain understand what they were voting for.

So if we voted 52-48 in favour of remain but parliament decided to leave anyway, then what would you say?
The difference is that 'to leave' is to make a change. Remaining is 'as it always was'. We cannot be neither in nor out.

Were the vote in favour of remain my response would be the same: Clearly half the country are not satisfied with the EU as it stands and we need change. The threshold should always have been a wider margin. A near 50-50 split as it has been is not conclusive in either direction.
Yeah, i guess those 1.4 million people don't really mean st.

don4l

10,058 posts

175 months

Saturday 2nd July 2016
quotequote all
AJS- said:
Heath won with under 42% in 1970 and felt this was enough to take us into the EU.
So, we went in with 42%, and the bedwetters are saying that we shouldn't leave even though we got 52%.

This is truely the greatest Sulk in history.

I'm looking forward to seeing YouTube interviews of some of today's "educated" London anti-democratic protesters.

Where are you, Zod?




Trabi601

4,865 posts

94 months

Saturday 2nd July 2016
quotequote all
don4l said:
So, we went in with 42%, and the bedwetters are saying that we shouldn't leave even though we got 52%.

This is truely the greatest Sulk in history.

I'm looking forward to seeing YouTube interviews of some of today's "educated" London anti-democratic protesters.

Where are you, Zod?
Why not look at the *real* figure which took us in?

You know, the referendum which was 67/33 in favour?

FiF

43,964 posts

250 months

Saturday 2nd July 2016
quotequote all
don4l said:
I'm astonished.

Everybody sulks now and again.

...but 8 days???

FiF gave out to me early on in this discussion for being a bit abrasive. My position was that you couldn't reason with lefties.

I think that I have been vindicated. It is absolutely impossible to have a sensible discussion with them. They will always back the course of action that will do most harm to their country.

I first noticed this when I was only 23 years old. I had a neighbour who was a Trotskyist. He was a nice, intelligent chap, but the poison was unbelievable. I once asked him if both of us could live after his revolution came, and he admitted that one of us would have to die.
I thought our main point of contention was over the use of the gross figure before any rebate etc in the story of what we send to the EU. My point was that this would over the course of the campaign be more of a hindrance than a help, which reckon I've been vindicated over that.

Yes, fair enough abrasive approach and frequent use of bedwetter taunt did grate, but to be perfectly frank some of the remainers appeared to deserve it, and possibly still do.

Likewise astonished at the 8 days and it's still going on. On the other hand, regardless the country has to be pulled together from the current fractured state. I'd like to see to that effect some effort to recognise that 48% of the population are against the current path. It's probably more than that as a significant number of the lazy arsed couldn't be bothered to vote, but that's tough, unfortunately they didn't count, and weren't counted.

On the other hand, fully accept I'm being too soft. If it had been 52/48 the other way, would any sop have been thrown in the Leave direction? Very much doubt it. So in short, you've had more than a week to display your anguish, so stfu big cry baby whiners. BBC especially you in that, or else.

PRTVR

7,073 posts

220 months

Saturday 2nd July 2016
quotequote all
AJS- said:
Ha any party ever won 52% at a general election? Yet they have all made changes.

Highest I could find was 49% for Harold MacMillain. Heath won with under 42% in 1970 and felt this was enough to take us into the EU.
I love the way % are used by the remain side all the time to signify only a small majority, but if I remember the actually result was 1.2 million more people voted to leave, that's a lot of people to ignore but I am sure there is a lot of people who would just love to ignore them and have a re run till they get the answer they want, and then of course it would be binding and not just advisory.
I really do wonder what planet these people live on.

FiF

43,964 posts

250 months

Saturday 2nd July 2016
quotequote all
Trabi601 said:
don4l said:
So, we went in with 42%, and the bedwetters are saying that we shouldn't leave even though we got 52%.

This is truely the greatest Sulk in history.

I'm looking forward to seeing YouTube interviews of some of today's "educated" London anti-democratic protesters.

Where are you, Zod?
Why not look at the *real* figure which took us in?

You know, the referendum which was 67/33 in favour?
We're you there at the time, suspect not, otherwise you wouldn't post such utter twaddle.

Trabi601

4,865 posts

94 months

Saturday 2nd July 2016
quotequote all
FiF said:
We're you there at the time, suspect not, otherwise you wouldn't post such utter twaddle.
Are you denying that the 1975 referendum was 67/33 in favour of joining?

In a strange twist of fate, the 'out' vote this year is almost identical to the 'in' vote in 1975.

mybrainhurts

90,809 posts

254 months

Saturday 2nd July 2016
quotequote all
FiF said:
Trabi601 said:
don4l said:
So, we went in with 42%, and the bedwetters are saying that we shouldn't leave even though we got 52%.

This is truely the greatest Sulk in history.

I'm looking forward to seeing YouTube interviews of some of today's "educated" London anti-democratic protesters.

Where are you, Zod?
Why not look at the *real* figure which took us in?

You know, the referendum which was 67/33 in favour?
We're you there at the time, suspect not, otherwise you wouldn't post such utter twaddle.
I was. We were promised a trade deal. Nobody mentioned political emasculation.

Trabi601

4,865 posts

94 months

Saturday 2nd July 2016
quotequote all
mybrainhurts said:
I was. We were promised a trade deal. Nobody mentioned political emasculation.
Nobody delivered it, either.

Balmoral

40,660 posts

247 months

Saturday 2nd July 2016
quotequote all
Trabi601 said:
Why not look at the *real* figure which took us in?

You know, the referendum which was 67/33 in favour?
That wasn't a referendum on the EU though, it was for the EEC. Very, very different organisation and in very different times.

mybrainhurts

90,809 posts

254 months

Saturday 2nd July 2016
quotequote all
Trabi601 said:
mybrainhurts said:
I was. We were promised a trade deal. Nobody mentioned political emasculation.
Nobody delivered it, either.
Where did you buy your blinkers? They work very well.

AJS-

15,366 posts

235 months

Saturday 2nd July 2016
quotequote all
Trabi601 said:
Why not look at the *real* figure which took us in?

You know, the referendum which was 67/33 in favour?
Because that *kept* us in. And it kept us in a common market that was a bright new future for tired post imperial Britain.

This was about whether to remain part of process of a political union which we never wanted to be in to begin with.


Trabi601

4,865 posts

94 months

Saturday 2nd July 2016
quotequote all
Balmoral said:
Trabi601 said:
Why not look at the *real* figure which took us in?

You know, the referendum which was 67/33 in favour?
That wasn't a referendum on the EU though, it was for the EEC. Very, very different organisation and in very different times.
That may well be the case, but things evolve over time and the current incarnation of the EU has maintained peace on the continent for longer than we've ever managed before. By destabilising, what will we get in the future?

However, it just shows that the current result is an incredibly narrow margin, and that many 'leave' voters now acknowledge they voted the wrong way - add that to the far right and national socialist vote, I think we are deciding our future based on some very dodgy ground.