The 1975 EEC referendum

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Discussion

Pan Pan Pan

Original Poster:

9,777 posts

110 months

Tuesday 24th May 2016
quotequote all
If it were possible to turn back the clock to 1975, and ask the people of the UK (and a number of other countries now in the EU) to vote again on being a member of the EEC, what the result would be, knowing what we know now about the EU?


Eric Mc

121,770 posts

264 months

Tuesday 24th May 2016
quotequote all
And not forgetting the state of the UK as an economy and what it had just come through back in 1975.

Pan Pan Pan

Original Poster:

9,777 posts

110 months

Tuesday 24th May 2016
quotequote all
Eric Mc said:
And not forgetting the state of the UK as an economy and what it had just come through back in 1975.
Yes. it was in a dire position then, with James Callaghan having to go cap in hand to the IMF for a bailout. Possibly one of the UK`s lowest points since WW2?

Vincecj

469 posts

122 months

Tuesday 24th May 2016
quotequote all
I voted out in'75 and will vote out this time.

worsy

5,776 posts

174 months

Tuesday 24th May 2016
quotequote all
Pan Pan Pan said:
Eric Mc said:
And not forgetting the state of the UK as an economy and what it had just come through back in 1975.
Yes. it was in a dire position then, with James Callaghan having to go cap in hand to the IMF for a bailout. Possibly one of the UK`s lowest points since WW2?
Yup Eric makes a good point. In 1975 we looked across the channel to a smaller trading block who were doing very well, whereas the UK was suffering meltdown with high inflation, and soon to be national strikes and a 3 day week. The situation is reversed to a certain degree but neither are the UK streaks ahead, nor is the mainland EU suffering as much as we did then.

I was far too young to vote then but bearing in mind the USSR still a major power, the wall was still up in Berlin I very much doubt anyone would actually believe a time traveler.

RYH64E

7,960 posts

243 months

Tuesday 24th May 2016
quotequote all
Pan Pan Pan said:
Eric Mc said:
And not forgetting the state of the UK as an economy and what it had just come through back in 1975.
Yes. it was in a dire position then, with James Callaghan having to go cap in hand to the IMF for a bailout. Possibly one of the UK`s lowest points since WW2?
Whereas today the UK is doing quite well, the economy is growing, employment is high, life is good...

Our economy isn't failing in the same way as that of Greece, we don't have high rates of unemployment as is the case in Spain and Italy, our economy isn't in recession, we're not part of Schengen and don't have open borders, we're not accepting millions of refugees as is the case in Germany, we're not tied to the euro and still have control over our currency... We're part of the EU and we're doing well, within the EU. What's the problem?

JagLover

42,265 posts

234 months

Tuesday 24th May 2016
quotequote all
A more relevant time is just before the treaty of Maastricht.

Only a few brave Tory MPs rebelled against that treaty, but it was that treaty above all others that turned the EC onto the path of a federal state.

It rather puts into context complaints about Tory "infighting" in the period. Only a few actually realised the significance of what was being signed!

Puggit

48,354 posts

247 months

Tuesday 24th May 2016
quotequote all
RYH64E said:
Whereas today the UK is doing quite well, the economy is growing, employment is high, life is good...

Our economy isn't failing in the same way as that of Greece, we don't have high rates of unemployment as is the case in Spain and Italy, our economy isn't in recession, we're not part of Schengen and don't have open borders, we're not accepting millions of refugees as is the case in Germany, we're not tied to the euro and still have control over our currency... We're part of the EU and we're doing well, within the EU. What's the problem?
I'll have a go... Sovereignty?

RYH64E

7,960 posts

243 months

Tuesday 24th May 2016
quotequote all
Puggit said:
I'll have a go... Sovereignty?
A valid reason for voting out and one that isn't in dispute.

superlightr

12,842 posts

262 months

Tuesday 24th May 2016
quotequote all
Puggit said:
RYH64E said:
Whereas today the UK is doing quite well, the economy is growing, employment is high, life is good...

Our economy isn't failing in the same way as that of Greece, we don't have high rates of unemployment as is the case in Spain and Italy, our economy isn't in recession, we're not part of Schengen and don't have open borders, we're not accepting millions of refugees as is the case in Germany, we're not tied to the euro and still have control over our currency... We're part of the EU and we're doing well, within the EU. What's the problem?
I'll have a go... Sovereignty?
can I have a go as well.....

Its like being in a 40+ year abusive relationship.

You are unappreciated, abused, money taken from, bent over backwards and shafted, shouted down and told what to do, told you will fail if you leave the relationship, told you are useless and cant survive being outside, no one will like or be friends with you ever plus you will be poor forever and you've never had it so good as you do now and perhaps if you wont be abused AS much in the future if you keep quiet now.

BoRED S2upid

19,641 posts

239 months

Tuesday 24th May 2016
quotequote all
How close was the vote back in '75? I wasn't born.

Eric Mc

121,770 posts

264 months

Tuesday 24th May 2016
quotequote all
BoRED S2upid said:
How close was the vote back in '75? I wasn't born.
Wiki says -

Yes - 67.23%
No - 32.77%

BoRED S2upid

19,641 posts

239 months

Tuesday 24th May 2016
quotequote all
Eric Mc said:
BoRED S2upid said:
How close was the vote back in '75? I wasn't born.
Wiki says -

Yes - 67.23%
No - 32.77%
Not close at all then.

Eric Mc

121,770 posts

264 months

Tuesday 24th May 2016
quotequote all
Times were different.
Circumstances were different.
National concerns were different.


Puggit

48,354 posts

247 months

Tuesday 24th May 2016
quotequote all
Eric Mc said:
Times were different.
Circumstances were different.
National concerns were different.
The club we were joining was VERY different.

V8A*ndy

3,695 posts

190 months

Tuesday 24th May 2016
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Latest poll in Northern Ireland.....

Leave 23%

Undecided 22%

Remain 55%




RYH64E

7,960 posts

243 months

Tuesday 24th May 2016
quotequote all
superlightr said:
can I have a go as well.....

Its like being in a 40+ year abusive relationship.

You are unappreciated, abused, money taken from, bent over backwards and shafted, shouted down and told what to do, told you will fail if you leave the relationship, told you are useless and cant survive being outside, no one will like or be friends with you ever plus you will be poor forever and you've never had it so good as you do now and perhaps if you wont be abused AS much in the future if you keep quiet now.
To use your analogy, it's like divorcing your wife because she snores in bed and spends too much on shoes, then finding out you've saved £50/month on the shoe bill but the divorce has cost you £1m. Imo, learn to live with the snoring and don't get hung up over the cost of shoes.

randlemarcus

13,507 posts

230 months

Tuesday 24th May 2016
quotequote all
RYH64E said:
superlightr said:
can I have a go as well.....

Its like being in a 40+ year abusive relationship.

You are unappreciated, abused, money taken from, bent over backwards and shafted, shouted down and told what to do, told you will fail if you leave the relationship, told you are useless and cant survive being outside, no one will like or be friends with you ever plus you will be poor forever and you've never had it so good as you do now and perhaps if you wont be abused AS much in the future if you keep quiet now.
To use your analogy, it's like divorcing your wife because she snores in bed and spends too much on shoes, then finding out you've saved £50/month on the shoe bill but the divorce has cost you £1m. Imo, learn to live with the snoring and don't get hung up over the cost of shoes.
But surely that's only true if you expect your wife's shoe bill to remain at £50/month for ever. The fact that she has posted on Facebook that she is committed to the idea of ever closer foot-related union with Manolo Blahnik might want to give you cause for concern, and the cost now of the divorce may pale into insignificance compared to the longer term financial prognosis. Fail to divorce, and your protestations that a couple of pairs of Green Flash and a shiny black pair is enough will be ignored, as the current shoe budget agreement that you brought back recently has been revealed as not maritally binding.

Eric Mc

121,770 posts

264 months

Tuesday 24th May 2016
quotequote all
Puggit said:
The club we were joining was VERY different.
Indeed it is. Much has changed in the intervening decades - and much will change in the future too.

Pan Pan Pan

Original Poster:

9,777 posts

110 months

Tuesday 24th May 2016
quotequote all
superlightr said:
Puggit said:
RYH64E said:
Whereas today the UK is doing quite well, the economy is growing, employment is high, life is good...

Our economy isn't failing in the same way as that of Greece, we don't have high rates of unemployment as is the case in Spain and Italy, our economy isn't in recession, we're not part of Schengen and don't have open borders, we're not accepting millions of refugees as is the case in Germany, we're not tied to the euro and still have control over our currency... We're part of the EU and we're doing well, within the EU. What's the problem?
I'll have a go... Sovereignty?
can I have a go as well.....

Its like being in a 40+ year abusive relationship.

You are unappreciated, abused, money taken from, bent over backwards and shafted, shouted down and told what to do, told you will fail if you leave the relationship, told you are useless and cant survive being outside, no one will like or be friends with you ever plus you will be poor forever and you've never had it so good as you do now and perhaps if you wont be abused AS much in the future if you keep quiet now.

I would go as far as saying the majority of the UK public were far less well informed in 1975, and most probably believed they were only signing up to trading agreement, not a European super state, headed in the main by one country, that would infiltrate its unwanted control over all aspects of life in the UK, and other member states.
If they had been told then, that they were joining an organization which would be controlled by the very country, that just a few years before they been fighting and dying against to prevent it from controlling Europe, and into something, that would change into something very different from what they were being sold at the time, I imagine manyu would vote to stay out.
If they had been told then, they would be joining an organization which agreed to make significant changes to its CAP in exchange for extra billions of UK taxpayers cash, but which then not only made NO changes whatsoever to the CAP (remind me again, which country gets the most out of the CAP, a clue it is not the UK!) and continued to take the extra billions of UK taxpayers cash, but gave none of it back to the UK, which is ironic since it is the UK`s money in the first place. And then the EU has the nerve to fine the UK millions of pounds, for not spending its own money the way the EU wants it to!
Or how about the leader of a certain single EU country, who invited in millions of immigrants, and when that leader realized what a mistake they had made, wanted to foist them off onto other member states, who were given NO say in the matter, and were threatened with a 250 thousand Euro fine, for Every single immigrant they refused to take./
Or how about an organization which was happy to throw billions of Euros at a corrupt basket case country which should never have been admitted in the first place to keep the European super state wet dream alive (much of which came from the UK, as the UK is the EU`s second largest net contributor of funds INTO the EU coffers) but which would not even consider modest reforms requested by its second largest net contributor claiming that the UK was already receiving `special treatment'
Or how about an organization which makes some member states carry out several referendums until those countries come up with the result the EU wants, or in some cases completely ignores the results, because it does not suit the EU`s agenda.
My guess would be that, knowing what we know now, about the corrupt, un democratic, unaccountable, money grabbing, money wasting, over regulating monster that the EEC has morphed into, most people with any intelligence, would want to stay as far away from the cancer that is the current EU as possible, and would have voted resoundingly to keep away from it in 1975.

Edited by Pan Pan Pan on Tuesday 24th May 13:34