Discussion
philv said:
I imagine there are a fair few people who woke up the next day after voting and tnought....oh fook...what have i/we done.
We've all jumped off a cliff hoping there's a more comfy mattress to land on down below, when half ten population don't know what a mattress is.
Were't we a basket case of a country before joining tne EU?
Bit worried we are going back to ten early 70s.
Not fun.
I don't get this pessimism at all. We've come quite a long way since the 70's. In spite of the EU draining us. We've all jumped off a cliff hoping there's a more comfy mattress to land on down below, when half ten population don't know what a mattress is.
Were't we a basket case of a country before joining tne EU?
Bit worried we are going back to ten early 70s.
Not fun.
Just throwing this out there, a lot of people keep referring to the "will of the people" etc. but do we think that all 52% still think the same way today as they did on Thursday?
It seems to me, anecdotally, that there are quite a few of them who now think they were lied to "let's spend £350m on the NHS", "let's stop immigration" (it doesn't matter that it's not quite what was said, that was what they heard).
Now that they're waking up to some serious uncertainty, Downing St admitting it has no plan for this eventuality, Bo Jo himself looking like he didn't really want this outcome, admissions from Nigel Farrage that the NHS thing was "a mistake", and from Danial Hannan that they shouldn't expect us not to be accepting some free movement of people, do we honestly think all 52% are happy with the way they voted?
I think the government could quite easily get away with not implementing article 50 at this rate and, without having a sort of "are you sure you're sure?" referendum, it would be very hard to keep a straight face and say that all 52% are still in favour of leaving.
It seems to me, anecdotally, that there are quite a few of them who now think they were lied to "let's spend £350m on the NHS", "let's stop immigration" (it doesn't matter that it's not quite what was said, that was what they heard).
Now that they're waking up to some serious uncertainty, Downing St admitting it has no plan for this eventuality, Bo Jo himself looking like he didn't really want this outcome, admissions from Nigel Farrage that the NHS thing was "a mistake", and from Danial Hannan that they shouldn't expect us not to be accepting some free movement of people, do we honestly think all 52% are happy with the way they voted?
I think the government could quite easily get away with not implementing article 50 at this rate and, without having a sort of "are you sure you're sure?" referendum, it would be very hard to keep a straight face and say that all 52% are still in favour of leaving.
Blue Oval84 said:
Just throwing this out there, a lot of people keep referring to the "will of the people" etc. but do we think that all 52% still think the same way today as they did on Thursday?
It's irrelevant.People regret voting for Blair. Too late.
We didn't get a second general election. No second referendum is due either, to do so would be to abandon democracy via excuses of what some unidentified people somewhere might or might not think...even if it were so, in three years they may think their original thoughts again.
It's madness as a suggestion and lethal if carried out. The UK would be dead as a democratic country.
Einion Yrth said:
philv said:
I imagine
Yes, plainly. Might I suggest you write a novel?About a super breed of lemmings.
48% of which realize that they don't have to Jump off the cliff.
But then get shouted down and dragged over anyway.
Just looking for a title.
Seriously, i had no idea how to vote or the true reprucussions.
I am reasonably well educated, worked and lived all over the world.
What the heck do I know?
Or anyone else for that matter?
turbobloke said:
It's irrelevant.
People regret voting for Blair. Too late.
We didn't get a second general election. No second referendum is due either, to do so would be to abandon democracy via excuses of what some unidentified people somewhere might or might not think...even if it were so, in three years they may think their original thoughts again.
It's madness as a suggestion and lethal if carried out. The UK would be dead as a democratic country.
.. and just supposing that over half of those that could vote, signed the petition to run it again. Would that still be the death of democracy?People regret voting for Blair. Too late.
We didn't get a second general election. No second referendum is due either, to do so would be to abandon democracy via excuses of what some unidentified people somewhere might or might not think...even if it were so, in three years they may think their original thoughts again.
It's madness as a suggestion and lethal if carried out. The UK would be dead as a democratic country.
philv said:
Einion Yrth said:
philv said:
I imagine
Yes, plainly. Might I suggest you write a novel?About a super breed of lemmings.
48% of which realize that they don't have to Jump off the cliff.
But then get shouted down and dragged over anyway.
Just looking for a title.
Seriously, i had no idea how to vote or the true reprucussions.
I am reasonably well educated, worked and lived all over the world.
What the heck do I know?
Or anyone else for that matter?
Not to do includes not conspiring to overturn democracy, and not to start talking the country down. Also not widening divisions...lemmings eh? Oh dear.
What to do, for me, includes making another cup of tea and carrying on working and paying taxes while providing some work for some other people.
turbobloke said:
Blue Oval84 said:
Just throwing this out there, a lot of people keep referring to the "will of the people" etc. but do we think that all 52% still think the same way today as they did on Thursday?
It's irrelevant.People regret voting for Blair. Too late.
We didn't get a second general election. No second referendum is due either, to do so would be to abandon democracy via excuses of what some unidentified people somewhere might or might not think...even if it were so, in three years they may think their original thoughts again.
It's madness as a suggestion and lethal if carried out. The UK would be dead as a democratic country.
If I buy a new car and it doesn't perform as I'd hoped over a few years, I can always change it. Slightly different if I buy a new car that I'm basically stuck with for life and the next morning the salesman says "oh yeah, the brochure's wrong by the way, it doesn't have the features you expected".
I really do see both sides to this one.
Blue Oval84 said:
Just throwing this out there, a lot of people keep referring to the "will of the people" etc. but do we think that all 52% still think the same way today as they did on Thursday?
It seems to me, anecdotally, that there are quite a few of them who now think they were lied to "let's spend £350m on the NHS", "let's stop immigration" (it doesn't matter that it's not quite what was said, that was what they heard).
Now that they're waking up to some serious uncertainty, Downing St admitting it has no plan for this eventuality, Bo Jo himself looking like he didn't really want this outcome, admissions from Nigel Farrage that the NHS thing was "a mistake", and from Danial Hannan that they shouldn't expect us not to be accepting some free movement of people, do we honestly think all 52% are happy with the way they voted?
I think the government could quite easily get away with not implementing article 50 at this rate and, without having a sort of "are you sure you're sure?" referendum, it would be very hard to keep a straight face and say that all 52% are still in favour of leaving.
This^^. I know I'm biased as a Remainer, but I do genuinely think that in the last 48 hours or so when the ramifications of what has been voted for have started to become apparent, there are a statistically significant number of people who voted Leave who'd probably give a different Ref answer today than on Thursday as they were "soft" (i.e. it was a close run thing for them) Leavers. Conversely if you were a "soft" Remainer, I can't see anything that would push you the other way as I've seen literally no good short term news. And that doesn't even account for what I imagine would be a larger youth turnout and likely great Remain vote now that a great many of them would realise they can't be lazy and expect everything to be fine.It seems to me, anecdotally, that there are quite a few of them who now think they were lied to "let's spend £350m on the NHS", "let's stop immigration" (it doesn't matter that it's not quite what was said, that was what they heard).
Now that they're waking up to some serious uncertainty, Downing St admitting it has no plan for this eventuality, Bo Jo himself looking like he didn't really want this outcome, admissions from Nigel Farrage that the NHS thing was "a mistake", and from Danial Hannan that they shouldn't expect us not to be accepting some free movement of people, do we honestly think all 52% are happy with the way they voted?
I think the government could quite easily get away with not implementing article 50 at this rate and, without having a sort of "are you sure you're sure?" referendum, it would be very hard to keep a straight face and say that all 52% are still in favour of leaving.
Blue Oval84 said:
Just throwing this out there, a lot of people keep referring to the "will of the people" etc. but do we think that all 52% still think the same way today as they did on Thursday?
It seems to me, anecdotally, that there are quite a few of them who now think they were lied to "let's spend £350m on the NHS", "let's stop immigration" (it doesn't matter that it's not quite what was said, that was what they heard).
Now that they're waking up to some serious uncertainty, Downing St admitting it has no plan for this eventuality, Bo Jo himself looking like he didn't really want this outcome, admissions from Nigel Farrage that the NHS thing was "a mistake", and from Danial Hannan that they shouldn't expect us not to be accepting some free movement of people, do we honestly think all 52% are happy with the way they voted?
I think the government could quite easily get away with not implementing article 50 at this rate and, without having a sort of "are you sure you're sure?" referendum, it would be very hard to keep a straight face and say that all 52% are still in favour of leaving.
that seems like the way it may well goIt seems to me, anecdotally, that there are quite a few of them who now think they were lied to "let's spend £350m on the NHS", "let's stop immigration" (it doesn't matter that it's not quite what was said, that was what they heard).
Now that they're waking up to some serious uncertainty, Downing St admitting it has no plan for this eventuality, Bo Jo himself looking like he didn't really want this outcome, admissions from Nigel Farrage that the NHS thing was "a mistake", and from Danial Hannan that they shouldn't expect us not to be accepting some free movement of people, do we honestly think all 52% are happy with the way they voted?
I think the government could quite easily get away with not implementing article 50 at this rate and, without having a sort of "are you sure you're sure?" referendum, it would be very hard to keep a straight face and say that all 52% are still in favour of leaving.
when the outcome will be so far from the promises, a referendum on are you sure seems entirely appropriate.
if sovereignty is really that important and drove 52% of the vote, leave have nothing to fear, have they?
///ajd said:
when the outcome will be so far from the promises, a referendum on are you sure seems entirely appropriate.
Yes, I think what I'm getting at is that the way I understand it, this referendum was nothing more than an opinion poll, the government is not legally obliged to carry it out (even though they said they would)If they ran their opinion poll again today I think it would at least have swung 52/48 the other way, if not an overwhelming majority for remain.
philv said:
I might do tnat.
About a super breed of lemmings.
48% of which realize that they don't have to Jump off the cliff.
But then get shouted down and dragged over anyway.
Just looking for a title.
Seriously, i had no idea how to vote or the true reprucussions.
I am reasonably well educated, worked and lived all over the world.
What the heck do I know?
Or anyone else for that matter?
Lemmings don't actually jump off cliffs, it's a myth. Now you're a little more educated.About a super breed of lemmings.
48% of which realize that they don't have to Jump off the cliff.
But then get shouted down and dragged over anyway.
Just looking for a title.
Seriously, i had no idea how to vote or the true reprucussions.
I am reasonably well educated, worked and lived all over the world.
What the heck do I know?
Or anyone else for that matter?
Blue Oval84 said:
///ajd said:
when the outcome will be so far from the promises, a referendum on are you sure seems entirely appropriate.
Yes, I think what I'm getting at is that the way I understand it, this referendum was nothing more than an opinion poll, the government is not legally obliged to carry it out (even though they said they would)If they ran their opinion poll again today I think it would at least have swung 52/48 the other way, if not an overwhelming majority for remain.
Blue Oval84 said:
///ajd said:
when the outcome will be so far from the promises, a referendum on are you sure seems entirely appropriate.
Yes, I think what I'm getting at is that the way I understand it, this referendum was nothing more than an opinion poll, the government is not legally obliged to carry it out (even though they said they would)If they ran their opinion poll again today I think it would at least have swung 52/48 the other way, if not an overwhelming majority for remain.
Also, what if you re-run and get 49/51 in favour of Leave? re-run again? or are we certain this time
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