Lots of angry people today.

[lostkiwi]

Soov535 said:

UK markets a bit volatile due to derivatives trading on the outcome of the referendum, now settling

Really? Have you seen what has been happening to the pound this morning?
It hit a low of $1.31 earlier - lower than the morning of the referendum results.

[Pan Pan Pan]

Kermit power said:

AJS- said:

they never had a mandate to be in the EU in the first place.

How do you figure that one out?

We were taken into the EU by a democratically elected government to whom we had granted a mandate at the ballot box, and therefore there was a mandate for joining the EU. That's how British politics works.

If you want all decisions large or small to be decided by direct referendum to ensure that they have a recognisable individual mandate, we're all going to be rather busy moving forwards!

No. In the last general election people in the UK voted to keep the disastrous labour government out of, and as far away from No:10 as possible. Voting for a party which `might' give the people a referendum on EU membership, was low down (if it was on it at all) in most peoples list of priorities when they voted in the last GE.
For a decision as fundamental as changing from the EEC to the EU should have been the subject of a referendum in all countries, not just the UK. That change was about as sneaky, un democratic, and underhanded as it was possible to get, and would be a large part of the reason why many who voted, chose to leave the EU.

[SeeFive]

One of the main things impacting our market performance over the last few days is the remain campaign and its continued negative bleating.

Osborn prior to the vote - "it's all doom, doom doom doom". And today, "nah, honest guv, no problem, we'll all be fine".

All we need to do is work out who was lying, and when. I have my suspicions... In the meantime, keep up the good work.

Edited by SeeFive on Monday 27th June 12:10

[anonymous-user]

Ste1987 said:

A worrying portion of racist brexiters think leaving the EU means we can kick out all foreigners

Source?

[SeeFive]

bmw535i said:

Source?

I think it was the guy in the pic above.

[jamoor]

The biggest problem with this whole palaver is that everyone would vote in or out.

Voting in - everyone knows exactly what is on offer and what happens.
Vote out - nothing was negotiated except a very vague "leave the EU" there wasn't any trade deals or in fact anything on the table as an alternative.

So people really didn't know what they were voting for when voting out, except it would change things.

[onemorelap]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

Agreed, the message seems to have been lost in all the extreme views from both sides that the referendum was as a result of our dis-satisfaction at the EU. The EU stuck their feet in, wouldnt move and we were left with a decision of either staying in and attempt to effect reform from within at the risk of losing sovereignty or accept that reform would never happen so leave and protect sovereignty..

This was quite a straightforward message which was incredibly badly pedalled by the respective campaigns.

Everyone is looking inwardly at the minute for allocation of blame, responsibility and action, no one is looking at the EU.

To blame remainers or leavers as a whole for the outcome (and associate it with demographics) is just pointless, damaging and insulting to the electorate.

I believe the majority who voted remain did so to protect sovereignty but on the basis of attempting to reform the EU from within.

I voted leave to protect sovereignty because I don't believe the EU will reform and I believe continued membership will see our sovereignty diminish.

For holding that belief I am currently being pedalled on sky news as a scruffy northern fisherman and the associated unspoken overtones that go with it.

It's b@llocks, we had a referendum to protect sovereignty and the far bigger swing towards remain would have been at least some recognition by the EU of the importance of retaining this to the UK.

[don4l]

lostkiwi said:

It hit a low of $1.31 earlier - lower than the morning of the referendum results.

Fantastic news for British exporters.

[WinstonWolf]

jamoor said:

The biggest problem with this whole palaver is that everyone would vote in or out.

Voting in - everyone knows exactly what is on offer and what happens.
Vote out - nothing was negotiated except a very vague "leave the EU" there wasn't any trade deals or in fact anything on the table as an alternative.

So people really didn't know what they were voting for when voting out, except it would change things.

Things would not have remained the same if we'd voted for remain, we would have moved further towards European integration.

[SeeFive]

jamoor said:

The biggest problem with this whole palaver is that everyone would vote in or out.

Voting in - everyone knows exactly what is on offer and what happens.
Vote out - nothing was negotiated except a very vague "leave the EU" there wasn't any trade deals or in fact anything on the table as an alternative.

So people really didn't know what they were voting for when voting out, except it would change things.

And everyone seemed to be suggesting that change was required (change from within).

So, your missus is playing the field to her own rules and ignoring you, and you are effectively making a major contribution to her doing that by helping finance it. You Work at it with her for 40 years, and suddenly realise that despite your protestations about her behaviour, she is actually moving further away from your life goals and dreams, holding you back in many ways and you have less say in the relationship than when you took your vows.

What do you do?

[randlemarcus]

WinstonWolf said:

jamoor said:

The biggest problem with this whole palaver is that everyone would vote in or out.

Voting in - everyone knows exactly what is on offer and what happens.
Vote out - nothing was negotiated except a very vague "leave the EU" there wasn't any trade deals or in fact anything on the table as an alternative.

So people really didn't know what they were voting for when voting out, except it would change things.

Things would not have remained the same if we'd voted for remain, we would have moved further towards European integration.

Precisely.

Ideally, we would have had about eight options, ranging from "In with both feet, damn the flag" to "Out tomorrow, waving the flag and be damned to Ooman Rites, innit"

A clusterf*(k from start to finish. IMHO.

[blueg33]

don4l said:

lostkiwi said:

It hit a low of $1.31 earlier - lower than the morning of the referendum results.

Fantastic news for British exporters.

So how are the shares of those exporters performing?

Aerospace shares all down
Major car part makers, down
Chemicals all down
Financial services (major export) all down
General Industrials almost all are down

Doesn't look like investors agree with you

Weak pound also means increased energy costs for manufacturers (including exporters)

Edited by blueg33 on Monday 27th June 12:30

[jamoor]

WinstonWolf said:

Things would not have remained the same if we'd voted for remain, we would have moved further towards European integration.

And we already know that don't we?

We literally have zero idea about "Out" and nor do any of the protagonists of this movement, that's why they're so silent.

[Ed.]

Ste1987 said:

A worrying portion of racist brexiters think leaving the EU means we can kick out all foreigners

You forgot that a number of hysterical remain voters branded all leave voters as racist which probably spurred on the few actual racists to commit horrible acts because they thought half the country was with them?

[WinstonWolf]

jamoor said:

WinstonWolf said:

Things would not have remained the same if we'd voted for remain, we would have moved further towards European integration.

And we already know that don't we?

We literally have zero idea about "Out" and nor do any of the protagonists of this movement, that's why they're so silent.

We're not silent, we're just being drowned out at the moment by the sound of tears and tantrums.

[iphonedyou]

don4l said:

Fantastic news for British exporters.

And, of course, horrid news for British importers.

[Mr GrimNasty]

Brits don't quit Cameron taunted us, so clearly he is no Brit - he certainly doesn't have their best interests at heart.

So today we have confirmed:-

EU Army ASAP, already thousands serving under EU flag, no longer just a civilian power.
Even closer federalization/integration to make more countries leaving impossible.
Fiscal integration, joint EU taxes.
German car industry demands continued trading without barriers.
E.ON lobbying against barriers.
UK could rejoin.

Oh how Brexiteers were mocked for saying these things.

Now there are even stronger reasons to stay out.

[Soov535]

WinstonWolf said:

jamoor said:

WinstonWolf said:

Things would not have remained the same if we'd voted for remain, we would have moved further towards European integration.

And we already know that don't we?

We literally have zero idea about "Out" and nor do any of the protagonists of this movement, that's why they're so silent.

We're not silent, we're just being drowned out at the moment by the sound of tears and tantrums.

[SpeckledJim]

blueg33 said:

don4l said:

lostkiwi said:

It hit a low of $1.31 earlier - lower than the morning of the referendum results.

Fantastic news for British exporters.

So how are the shares of those exporters performing?

Aerospace shares all down
Major car part makers, down
Chemicals all down
Financial services (major export) all down
General Industrials almost all are down

Doesn't look like investors agree with you

Weak pound also means increased energy costs for manufacturers (including exporters)

Edited by blueg33 on Monday 27th June 12:30

That's because investors would rather have £50 than an amount chosen at random between £0 and £100. The problem is not the problem. The uncertainty about the problem is the problem.

In time there will be less uncertainty. And so less problem.

Patience, Iago!

[blueg33]

Mr GrimNasty said:

Brits don't quit Cameron taunted us, so clearly he is no Brit - he certainly doesn't have their best interests at heart.

So today we have confirmed:-

EU Army ASAP, already thousands serving under EU flag, no longer just a civilian power.
Even closer federalization/integration to make more countries leaving impossible.
Fiscal integration, joint EU taxes.
German car industry demands continued trading without barriers.
E.ON lobbying against barriers.
UK could rejoin.

Oh how Brexiteers were mocked for saying these things.



Now there are even stronger reasons to stay out.

Confirmed by who?
Which of those are subject to UK veto

Re-join with the same or better terms than we will leave with?