Could UK U-turn on Referendum Result

[RizzoTheRat]

Mark Benson said:

My point entirely.

I didn't believe Osborne when he said we'd have to have an emergency budget either.

not sure what I'm supposed to be ignoring, if you believed most of the rot from either side you're a fool.

And there you have the biggest problem with a referendum, a huge number of people did believe this things.

I know the Independent is hardly independent but:
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/near...

ETA: 1% of people didn't even know if they'd heard of it FFS!

Edited by RizzoTheRat on Tuesday 28th June 11:58

[Mark Benson]

Crafty_ said:

Mark Benson said:

My point entirely.

I didn't believe Osborne when he said we'd have to have an emergency budget either.

not sure what I'm supposed to be ignoring, if you believed most of the rot from either side you're a fool.

The point is those fools exist and believed the £350m thing and voted accordingly. Sad but true.

There were fools on both sides. As there are in every election. Some believe what the politicians tell them, some don't. Most believe whatever confirms their beliefs and prejudices.

None of that is a case for overturning the result of a vote however.

[alfie2244]

Crafty_ said:

The point is those fools exist and believed the £350m thing and voted accordingly. Sad but true.

Do you think the "see-saw" poster influenced any voters?

[Crafty_]

alfie2244 said:

Do you think the "see-saw" poster influenced any voters?

The poster asked for an example of lies from one side and I gave one. I'm quite sure some believed some of the remain stuff too and I never said otherwise.

[ATG]

Jimbeaux said:

Don't panic! The economic dip is normal. The investors went with the polls and loaded cash into what would have been the proper places, now they are trying to snatch it back. This is expected and will get better!

London did not become a world center of banking because of the E.U. it did so because of lighter regulation and well-managed U.K. institutions.

Most investors and banks will have gone into this as flat as possible.

A very great deal of London's success as a financial centre is directly down to the UK's membership of the EU and it has nothing to do with light regulation.

The UK has a first rate reputation for financial regulation and civil law; you can deal with a UK regulated financial services company with confidence and you can enforce contracts efficiently in our courts. That's the bit the UK has done on its own, and that won't change.

EU "passporting" means that regulatory consent granted by one EU nation could be used in any EU country. This was perfect for the UK. It meant business would set up in London because of the benefits mentioned above and they'd then be able to sell financial services across the entire EU. If we leave the EU that passporting arrangement is gone. Financial institutions will have no choice but to set up new entities in an EU state with a good regulatory regime and they'll move some of their business activity out of London and into the EU entities.

And there is a second problem. At the moment an awful lot of Euro money market trading occurs in London. The Eurozone will now be able to require that activity to be moved back on shore. Until now the UK was able to block that move, but we've just thrown away our protection. That'll take more job roles and business out of London.

I work for a large non-UK bank in London. Because we don't know how the UK's exit will pan out, we can't predict accurately how many job roles will have to be moved out of the UK, but it seems likely that it will be between about 5% and 25% ... several thousand jobs. HSBC and Morgan Stanley have already announced several thousand roles are moving to the EU. So much for scaremongering.

We're not looking at some temporary glitch in the FX rate here. Leaving the EU is going to have a big impact on financial services and therfore on the UK economy. Of course the City will continue to innovate as it continuously does anyway, but it would be daft to think leaving the EU isn't going to do it some serious, permanent damage.

[marshalla]

ATG said:

I work for a large non-UK bank in London. Because we don't know how the UK's exit will pan out, we can't predict accurately how many job roles will have to be moved out of the UK, but it seems likely that it will be between about 5% and 25% ... several thousand jobs. HSBC and Morgan Stanley have already announced several thousand roles are moving to the EU. So much for scaremongering.

We're not looking at some temporary glitch in the FX rate here. Leaving the EU is going to have a big impact on financial services and therfore on the UK economy. Of course the City will continue to innovate as it continuously does anyway, but it would be daft to think leaving the EU isn't going to do it some serious, permanent damage.

And even if some sort of free movement and passporting arrangement remains in place post-exit, they are highly unlikely to move anything back because we, as a nation, have sent a very clear message. Confidence in the UK has been shaken and its status as an "aircraft carrier" for companies wanting to trade freely within the EU has been damaged.

[London424]

marshalla said:

ATG said:

I work for a large non-UK bank in London. Because we don't know how the UK's exit will pan out, we can't predict accurately how many job roles will have to be moved out of the UK, but it seems likely that it will be between about 5% and 25% ... several thousand jobs. HSBC and Morgan Stanley have already announced several thousand roles are moving to the EU. So much for scaremongering.

We're not looking at some temporary glitch in the FX rate here. Leaving the EU is going to have a big impact on financial services and therfore on the UK economy. Of course the City will continue to innovate as it continuously does anyway, but it would be daft to think leaving the EU isn't going to do it some serious, permanent damage.

And even if some sort of free movement and passporting arrangement remains in place post-exit, they are highly unlikely to move anything back because we, as a nation, have sent a very clear message. Confidence in the UK has been shaken and its status as an "aircraft carrier" for companies wanting to trade freely within the EU has been damaged.

Any job announcements made already about moving (I haven't seen any links so if you don't mind sending them) are nothing to do with Brexit. Why would you go to the expense of moving anyone/anything when you have no idea of the conditions going forward?

[Pesty]

Crafty_ said:

Mark Benson said:

My point entirely.

I didn't believe Osborne when he said we'd have to have an emergency budget either.

not sure what I'm supposed to be ignoring, if you believed most of the rot from either side you're a fool.

The point is those fools exist and believed the £350m thing and voted accordingly. Sad but true.

Cancelled out by fools on the remain side who believed the crazy tales of doom war and pestilence

Oh that's right only one side told lies eh.

[_dobbo_]

Pesty said:

Cancelled out by fools on the remain side who believed the crazy tales of doom war and pestilence

Oh that's right only one side told lies eh.

Well the leave lies unravelled on D+1. The remain stuff is yet to be proven as lies or truth, but given the immediate aftermath they are looking like reasonably accurate predictions so far.

Edit to mention that yes, the budget thing, I guess. Anything else I've forgotten?

[Pesty]

From cancer to war

We don't know about the economy yet, there is a recovery I imagine that the BBC et al started being positive the economy would do even better. Uncertainty is causing this. It will settle down.

[Crafty_]

Pesty said:

Cancelled out by fools on the remain side who believed the crazy tales of doom war and pestilence

Oh that's right only one side told lies eh.

And where did I state that only leavers lied ?

I didn't. The poster asked for an example of a lie from the leavers and I gave one.

Do not attempt to try and twist what I posted.

[Terminator X]

_dobbo_ said:

Pesty said:

Cancelled out by fools on the remain side who believed the crazy tales of doom war and pestilence

Oh that's right only one side told lies eh.

Well the leave lies unravelled on D+1. The remain stuff is yet to be proven as lies or truth, but given the immediate aftermath they are looking like reasonably accurate predictions so far.

Edit to mention that yes, the budget thing, I guess. Anything else I've forgotten?

You do understand though that it's way too soon to predict anything. Tales of Armageddon though will be unfounded mark my words, indeed the only thing "screwing the economy" at the moment afaik is all this dithering with no plan to do anything seemingly for months yet. Nuts if you ask me.

If you want so see how volatile the stock market is on any given day / week / year take a look here (seriously it is no better than random):

http://www.londonstockexchange.com/exchange/prices...

TX.

[Mr GrimNasty]

_dobbo_ said:

Well the leave lies unravelled on D+1. The remain stuff is yet to be proven as lies or truth, but given the immediate aftermath they are looking like reasonably accurate predictions so far.

Edit to mention that yes, the budget thing, I guess. Anything else I've forgotten?

Have you had your head in the sand or some sort of reverse reality helmet?

[paul789]

marshalla said:

ATG said:

I work for a large non-UK bank in London. Because we don't know how the UK's exit will pan out, we can't predict accurately how many job roles will have to be moved out of the UK, but it seems likely that it will be between about 5% and 25% ... several thousand jobs. HSBC and Morgan Stanley have already announced several thousand roles are moving to the EU. So much for scaremongering.

We're not looking at some temporary glitch in the FX rate here. Leaving the EU is going to have a big impact on financial services and therfore on the UK economy. Of course the City will continue to innovate as it continuously does anyway, but it would be daft to think leaving the EU isn't going to do it some serious, permanent damage.

And even if some sort of free movement and passporting arrangement remains in place post-exit, they are highly unlikely to move anything back because we, as a nation, have sent a very clear message. Confidence in the UK has been shaken and its status as an "aircraft carrier" for companies wanting to trade freely within the EU has been damaged.

We'll rue this self-inflicted stupidity for decades.Still, we've "got our fackin' count-wy back".

[CrutyRammers]

Crafty_ said:

Mark Benson said:

So, less of a promise and more of another pie-in-the-sky claim. Just like all the others.

My point being, anyone claiming 'broken promises' has to have believed the person making it was in a position to deliver.

Funny how you get given an answer and conveniently ignore it.
If you want promises from people who are in a position to deliver then surely you wouldn't have believed anything that anyone had said during the entire campaign ?

Least of all anything that Farage said who refuses to take any responsibility so he can promise what he likesays and never have to deliver.

That's probably because Farage didn't say it.
You just wish he had.
He did say that it was a mistake for the leave campaign to have said it, a pov which presumably you agree with.
So you agree with Farage.
Have a nice day

[CrutyRammers]

sidicks said:

fooby said:

Stay in the single market or lose our biggest tradable commodity to the EU... What exactly is the point of leaving again? I really hope the UK comes royally crashing down between now and October. Not a chance we will leave if the big banks actually want to leave London.

Doesn't bother me as much as I have both an English and an Irish passport, but I would feel very sorry for the amount of forward thinking people who are stuck in this mess.

With an attitude like that it's quite clear we'll be better off without you!

Agreed. He wishes real harm on the country just so that he can be "right". An appalling view to have, though I sadly suspect quite common amongst the more vocal whingers.

[_dobbo_]

Terminator X said:

You do understand though that it's way too soon to predict anything.

Yes, which was sort of precisely my point. You can say that someone has lied about something that hasn't happened yet.

If it doesn't happen, then they lied.

[CrutyRammers]

Terminator X said:

Mrr T said:

loafer123 said:

Mrr T said:

I suggest your knowledge of financial services regulations is out of date. You cannot register a company and with a couple of employees its become a regulated entity. Regulators require most sales staff, all key individuals, from senior management to risk and compliance to be based in the country of the regulated entity. Regulator do not like the idea of finding a regulated entity is in breach of regulations and the managers are outside its jursdiction.

My guess is 400/500k jobs moving. Which in my view is a lot.

Given there are only 400k people working in the City of London, I think you are an idiot.

You did read I said financial services and not the City of London. There are about 2m people in the UK who work in financial services.

My estimate is about 25% of the job will be lost if we lose financial services passporting.

Which suggests I may not be an idiot but you do seem to have some of the attributes.

Where did this "estimate" come from or are you just pulling %ages out of your arse?

TX.

He's been parading his "estimates" around as if they're facts for the last couple of months. I think he thinks that the more he says it, the more true it will become. I also don't think it's convincing anybody at all.

[_dobbo_]

Mr GrimNasty said:

Have you had your head in the sand or some sort of reverse reality helmet?

List the lies then please? I did ask. I'll even take off my helmet to read your post, I double triple promise I will.

[Murph7355]

ATG said:

... If we leave the EU that passporting arrangement is gone. ...

As things stand "may be" is more appropriate than "is".

ATG said:

...HSBC and Morgan Stanley have already announced several thousand roles are moving to the EU. So much for scaremongering.
...

Is this confirmed or still just a threat? As an example I believe Deutsche were touted as doing the same and have denied it.

ATG said:

......Of course the City will continue to innovate as it continuously does anyway, but it would be daft to think leaving the EU isn't going to do it some serious, permanent damage.

I suspect you're right, but it will depend on the outcome of the negotiations and the extent to which financial institutions are able to innovate.

There is also the question of just how many of those staff moves would have happened anyway. None of the banks are averse to shuffling roles around the globe as it suits them to do so. It's been happening for decades, it will continue to do so. 2008 should have been all the wake up call (again) needed for the UK to realise it should look to reduce reliance on the sector (which does not mean give up on it...but beef up every other sector and quit leaning on finance).