Could UK U-turn on Referendum Result

[Elysium]

bmw535i said:

Well done for holding your hands up George, but how on earth did he not realise his lies would only harden people's resolve. A lot of remainers still can't see that the bullying and lies just made people all the more determined to vote leave.

I guess some people have a complete lack of self awareness

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.express.co.uk/n...

What makes you think that a 'lot of remainers' cannot see this?

Who bullied you?

What lies are you talking about?

[FiF]

Exactly so TB, it sounds like he is making an oblique attempt to say that the reason people voted out was a simple anti establishment vote as opposed to they actually wanted to leave the EU for a whole host of reasons. Desperation stuff perhaps which we've heard on here before. Doesn't wash.

[Elysium]

FiF said:

Exactly so TB, it sounds like he is making an oblique attempt to say that the reason people voted out was a simple anti establishment vote as opposed to they actually wanted to leave the EU for a whole host of reasons. Desperation stuff perhaps which we've heard on here before. Doesn't wash.

It seems quite obvious to me that for some people the vote was an attack on the establishment. None of us know how widespread that sentiment is, but I have seen interviews with and spoken to several people who are clear this was in their thinking.

That does not mean that there are not a great many other reasons for the leave vote. Although in my experience the sort of people posting in this thread, who have thought deeply about the issue are not, unfortunately, representative of the majority of leave voters.

[turbobloke]

Elysium said:

FiF said:

Exactly so TB, it sounds like he is making an oblique attempt to say that the reason people voted out was a simple anti establishment vote as opposed to they actually wanted to leave the EU for a whole host of reasons. Desperation stuff perhaps which we've heard on here before. Doesn't wash.

It seems quite obvious to me that for some people the vote was an attack on the establishment. None of us know how widespread that sentiment is, but I have seen interviews with and spoken to several people who are clear this was in their thinking.

As FiF made clear, it wasn't a simple anti-establishment vote. That leaves room for some sentiment along those lines.

Even then, a proportion of those will have spoken that way having been fed the line by reading or listening to a coterie of disappointed Remainer politicians and activists who can't quite comprehend what really happened.

[FN2TypeR]

turbobloke said:

Not forgetting this:

"Osborne should have admitted he made another 'mistake' in office by underestimating the the general public's ability to spot that his nose had grown almost as long as CMD's hooter in the run-up to Brexit."

ETA the poll from that article only has a few votes cast at the mo but it's not good news if Osborne thinks a moment of tactical contrition will save his political career.

Edited by turbobloke on Saturday 22 October 08:53

Politically he is damaged goods, Theresa May was bang on the money when she turfed him to the back benches, his career as a front bencher is over.

The after dinner speaking pay days await!

[///ajd]

jsf said:

NerveAgent said:

jsf said:

I don't read the gutter press, but even if that were the case, the Polish woman was happy in this country until just a few months ago, so your 30+ years seems irrelevant in this particular case.

I hope what can come out of this issue, is more work is done to reassure the current EU migrants that they are not unwelcome and people like ///ajd can contribute towards this, rather than doing nothing but trying to reinforce a view that the vast majority do not hold.

Nah, millions do hold this view. Always have, but haven't had the testes to publicly air it.

Its just in the current climate, a certain "type" has grown half a bk and a couple of vertebrae to almost act how they really want to. Hence these little (safety in numbers) outbursts.

We aren't allowed to talk about it though, with the professionally outraged, obviously.

I don't disagree at all, there will always be a small minority that hold racists views.

What I object to is people like ///ajd saying the majority of people (who voted) in this country are racists. The bloke doesn't know me or my family yet he is happy to suggest I (and 17.4 million others) hate foreigners, on the basis that I want to see some sensible policies in place that assist everyone moving forward.

It's not acceptable.

I've never called anyone a racist.

This has become the standard defence - as soon as any consequences on foreigners are discussed, you scream "you're calling me a racist, and I'm not a racist, so you're wrong".

Its not wrong to link that Polish womens feelings to brexit though is it? 535i calls her an idiot, but she's not, is she? What does that make 535i?

Brexit comes with alot of baggage, and it needs discussing. Frankly the backwards attitude to free movement enshrined in brexit is one of the key reasons for u-turn.

Some here have decided they are brave enough and feel safe to talk about the impacts of immigration on "social cohesion". Sad times.

[768]

///ajd said:

I've never called anyone a racist.

Maybe not anyone.

///ajd said:

of course not there is no clear correlation between brexiters & racists, but it cannot be denied there is some association

[Troubleatmill]

///ajd said:

Frankly the backwards attitude to free movement enshrined in brexit is one of the key reasons for u-turn.

Backwards???

There is nothing backward about wanting to be able to decide who you want to let into your country and for how long they can stay.

Apparently it works really well for almost every other country on the planet.

But you seem to have some beef with that very simple concept.

[FiF]

768 said:

///ajd said:

I've never called anyone a racist.

Maybe not anyone.

///ajd said:

of course not there is no clear correlation between brexiters & racists, but it cannot be denied there is some association

Nuked from orbit, as they say in these here parts.

[turbobloke]

Elysium said:

bmw535i said:

Well done for holding your hands up George, but how on earth did he not realise his lies would only harden people's resolve. A lot of remainers still can't see that the bullying and lies just made people all the more determined to vote leave.

I guess some people have a complete lack of self awareness

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.express.co.uk/n...

What makes you think that a 'lot of remainers' cannot see this?

Who bullied you?

What lies are you talking about?

Clearly nobody can answer for bmw535i, they may be along shortly to respond, or perhaps not.

In terms of the bullying angle, there was considerable high-and-mighty doom-mongering from Osborne via his commandeering of the one-sided Treasury computer model churning out gigo about the future of the UK economy and its impact on families and jobs.

This combination of spurious accuracy and biased pre-judgement foretold that each family would be precisely £4300 per year worse off after Brexit, that there would be a DIY recession lasting a year (economists and various institutions have been falling over themselves removing their projections of a recession and many have increased growth forecasts since the vote), a 6% drop in GDP, there would be an instant emergency budget with £30bn of spending cuts and tax hikes ho ho ho, house prices would fall and mortgages would be more expensive.

That pile of hooey, which some describe as lies, was at the very least an attempt to cajole and hector if not bully the more gullible types within the population into voting Remain in order to avoid the fantasy fairytales of doom and gloom.

[///ajd]

FiF said:

768 said:

///ajd said:

I've never called anyone a racist.

Maybe not anyone.

///ajd said:

of course not there is no clear correlation between brexiters & racists, but it cannot be denied there is some association

Nuked from orbit, as they say in these here parts.

Nonsense.

Try and twist my words all you like.

You're just proving my point - dismiss any discussion.

Any association between Farage's poster and racism? By the bucketload. Did the poster not appeal to anyone then? What a waste of money, Farage obviously doesn't understand his target audience.

The Channel 4 interviewee was a classic.

What are you going to do about these unleashed forces? Not discussing it or even failing to realise it is a problem is not the answer.

[Stickyfinger]

///ajd said:

FiF said:

768 said:

///ajd said:

I've never called anyone a racist.

Maybe not anyone.

///ajd said:

of course not there is no clear correlation between brexiters & racists, but it cannot be denied there is some association

Nuked from orbit, as they say in these here parts.

Nonsense.

Try and twist my words all you like.

You're just proving my point - dismiss any discussion.

Any association between Farage's poster and racism? By the bucketload. Did the poster not appeal to anyone then? What a waste of money, Farage obviously doesn't understand his target audience.

The Channel 4 interviewee was a classic.

What are you going to do about these unleashed forces? Not discussing it or even failing to realise it is a problem is not the answer.

/

Desperate plonker

[WinstonWolf]

///ajd said:

FiF said:

768 said:

///ajd said:

I've never called anyone a racist.

Maybe not anyone.

///ajd said:

of course not there is no clear correlation between brexiters & racists, but it cannot be denied there is some association

Nuked from orbit, as they say in these here parts.

Nonsense.

Try and twist my words all you like.

You're just proving my point - dismiss any discussion.

Any association between Farage's poster and racism? By the bucketload. Did the poster not appeal to anyone then? What a waste of money, Farage obviously doesn't understand his target audience.

The Channel 4 interviewee was a classic.

What are you going to do about these unleashed forces? Not discussing it or even failing to realise it is a problem is not the answer.

That's not twisting your words, they *are* your words.

I'm not saying there's any correlation between your words and bigotry, but it cannot be denied there's some association...

[///ajd]

WinstonWolf said:

///ajd said:

FiF said:

768 said:

///ajd said:

I've never called anyone a racist.

Maybe not anyone.

///ajd said:

of course not there is no clear correlation between brexiters & racists, but it cannot be denied there is some association

Nuked from orbit, as they say in these here parts.

Nonsense.

Try and twist my words all you like.

You're just proving my point - dismiss any discussion.

Any association between Farage's poster and racism? By the bucketload. Did the poster not appeal to anyone then? What a waste of money, Farage obviously doesn't understand his target audience.

The Channel 4 interviewee was a classic.

What are you going to do about these unleashed forces? Not discussing it or even failing to realise it is a problem is not the answer.

That's not twisting your words, they *are* your words.

I'm not saying there's any correlation between your words and bigotry, but it cannot be denied there's some association...

Hey, its me who wants to talk about it, I'm not the one intolerant of discussion.

Do you think - like 535i - the polish lady on QT was an idiot. He seems rather intolerant of her views - is there a word for that?

[768]

///ajd said:

Do you think - like 535i - the polish lady on QT was an idiot. He seems rather intolerant of her views - is there a word for that?

I haven't seen QT, but if you think a Polish (did you really mean polish?) person can't be seen as an idiot without calling someone racist, I'm not surprised you're struggling to get people to debate with you.

Keep playing the racist card though as far as I'm concerned, it's done wonders so far.

Sometimes you just have to know when to quit, FWIW for you that looks to have been about 4 months ago.

[davepoth]

///ajd said:

Its not wrong to link that Polish womens feelings to brexit though is it? 535i calls her an idiot, but she's not, is she? What does that make 535i?

There is an argument to say that her statement on Question Time was racist itself.

[anonymous-user]

Elysium said:

What makes you think that a 'lot of remainers' cannot see this?

Who bullied you?

What lies are you talking about?

1. This thread
2. As discussed previously. For the avoidance or doubt o was called a xenophobic loser when I discussed the possibility that I might vote leave.
3. The ones the remain campaign told.

[Mrr T]

turbobloke said:

EU nitwit demands Brexit talks are held in French.

Seems perfectly reasonable to me. Why should they be held in English. Perhaps compromise and use German.

[alfie2244]

Mrr T said:

turbobloke said:

EU nitwit demands Brexit talks are held in French.

Seems perfectly reasonable to me. Why should they be held in English. Perhaps compromise and use German.

Auf wiedersehen...............simples

[///ajd]

davepoth said:

///ajd said:

Its not wrong to link that Polish womens feelings to brexit though is it? 535i calls her an idiot, but she's not, is she? What does that make 535i?

There is an argument to say that her statement on Question Time was racist itself.

Its a pretty poor argument though isn't it, usually used by.....