The economic consequences of Brexit

[PurpleMoonlight]

davepoth said:

So that's access to the Single Market then?

No, it's a trade agreement with the EU.

[anonymous-user]

With the latest talk of banks relocating, how do those with industry knowledge think it will pan out?

[davepoth]

PurpleMoonlight said:

davepoth said:

So that's access to the Single Market then?

No, it's a trade agreement with the EU.

You might want to read those other five links.

[sidicks]

PurpleMoonlight said:

It is currently fact as the EU have stated several times there will be no special deal and we are either in the single market or out.

The EU Leaders are posturing. The government leaders will be more sensible / reasonable, for their own benefit.

[RYH64E]

sidicks said:

The EU Leaders are posturing. The government leaders will be more sensible / reasonable, for their own benefit.

Guessing with confidence, the new reality.

[don'tbesilly]

PurpleMoonlight said:

don'tbesilly said:

Favoured technique of PM, word play is something he excels at.

Or you could look at the links I posted earlier and then you might understand the difference.

I do understand the difference thanks.

When both Cameron and Osborne, and then Gove/others spelt out prior to the referendum that leaving the EU meant relinquishing membership of the Single market, I and I'd imagine millions of voters who were considering the options,consequences and responsibilities of their vote looked into what leaving the single market meant and voted accordingly, either to stay in the EU or leave the EU, some of course didn't do any of the above.

I'm sure some who voted to leave might now be questioning their vote, others who voted remain will perhaps also be doing the same.
It makes for a good discussion for those who made it to the polling booth because they valued the future of the UK either in the EU or out of the EU which the UK will now be.

[sidicks]

RYH64E said:

sidicks said:

The EU Leaders are posturing. The government leaders will be more sensible / reasonable, for their own benefit.

Guessing with confidence, the new reality.

Seems more likely than your assumption of 'There will be no deal, the EU will deliberately damage themselves to prove a point'...

Until the agreement is finalised, there are no facts, only opinions.

Edited by sidicks on Sunday 23 October 11:44

[Garvin]

PurpleMoonlight said:

Garvin said:

You have an obvious opinion that there will be no 'access' to services within the single market. You are entitled to that opinion, but that is all it is, it is not fact as you keep asserting.

It is currently fact as the EU have stated several times there will be no special deal and we are either in the single market or out.

Define 'out'. Define 'special'.

Yes, we will not be a full member of the single market, only a few misguided people on the Brexit side believe that. We can be 'out' of the single market, as in not a member, but still retain some access to certain services etc. in return for some consideration can we not?

By 'special' I take that to mean that we won't be given any preferential advantages over any other non-EU country. However, if that were strictly true then every trade deal between EU and non-EU countries would be identical which they are not! The realities of what economic advantages/benefits UK offer to the EU, whch are different to other countries, will be taken into account. They may be ignored at the end of the day but claiming an end position now as fact is nothing of the sort.

[don4l]

MG CHRIS said:

Some good news today Nissan is set to announce its to build the new suv model at the sunderland car plant didn't the remainers say sunderland would lose out on jobs if we left because Nissan would leave. Not another lie by the remainers by any chance is it?

I'm sure the Remainers will console themselves with the "fact" that Toyota are very likely to leave the UK altogether.

Lies, lies and more lies.

Utterly despicable.

[PurpleMoonlight]

don'tbesilly said:

I do understand the difference thanks.

When both Cameron and Osborne, and then Gove/others spelt out prior to the referendum that leaving the EU meant relinquishing membership of the Single market, I and I'd imagine millions of voters who were considering the options,consequences and responsibilities of their vote looked into what leaving the single market meant and voted accordingly, either to stay in the EU or leave the EU, some of course didn't do any of the above.

I'm sure some who voted to leave might now be questioning their vote, others who voted remain will perhaps also be doing the same.
It makes for a good discussion for those who made it to the polling booth because they valued the future of the UK either in the EU or out of the EU which the UK will now be.

Back to that bigotry I see huh.

You need to grow up.

[BlackLabel]

The British Bankers’ Association wouldn't be doing their job properly if they didn't threaten,and lobby the government in such a way. Of course that isn't to say the threat of leaving isn't real.

[RYH64E]

sidicks said:

RYH64E said:

sidicks said:

The EU Leaders are posturing. The government leaders will be more sensible / reasonable, for their own benefit.

Guessing with confidence, the new reality.

Seems more likely than your assumption of 'There will be no deal, the EU will deliberately damage themselves to prove a point'...

No, all along I've said that it will be a political decision, I've never believed the 'we'll get a deal because they need us more than we need them', or 'Germany will make sure we get a deal because their car manufacturers need our business', which were two popular themes on here in the run up to the referendum.

What we get will be determined by politics, what the government leaders believe they can sell to their electorate, and what the eu leaders believe is in the best interests of their project - and a good deal for the UK won't send out the right messages to other wavering states.

How many divorces are resolved amicably? Some maybe, but in my experience most end up with tears, petty acts of revenge, and long term animosity.

[sidicks]

RYH64E said:

No, all along I've said that it will be a political decision, I've never believed the 'we'll get a deal because they need us more than we need them', or 'Germany will make sure we get a deal because their car manufacturers need our business', which were two popular themes on here in the run up to the referendum.

What we get will be determined by politics, what the government leaders believe they can sell to their electorate, and what the eu leaders believe is in the best interests of their project - and a good deal for the UK won't send out the right messages to other wavering states.

How many divorces are resolved amicably? Some maybe, but in my experience most end up with tears, petty acts of revenge, and long term animosity.

That's your opinion. Plenty of others have different ones.

You much be pretty naive if you think that the other governments will be able to sell a story to their electorate that says 'we agreed a deal that makes us worse off, because we wanted to punish the UK'...

[Garvin]

don4l said:

MG CHRIS said:

Some good news today Nissan is set to announce its to build the new suv model at the sunderland car plant didn't the remainers say sunderland would lose out on jobs if we left because Nissan would leave. Not another lie by the remainers by any chance is it?

I'm sure the Remainers will console themselves with the "fact" that Toyota are very likely to leave the UK altogether.

Lies, lies and more lies.

Utterly despicable.

They aren't really lies are they! They are just the concerned outpourings of Remainers who through a mixture of fear, disappointment and frustration are making wild predictions which are not based on a lot of factual evidence. Mind you, there are a fair few Brexiteers who do the same.

A lot of reaminers have still not rationalised the fact that we are leaving the EU and need to be helped through the classic change curve. Hopefully, they will eventually come to terms with the reality of the situation and transfer their focus from the negatives to the positives/possibilities that Brexit can offer. This takes time.

Those that don't rationalise the situation in their own minds will remain bitter and twisted for the rest of their lives. That is their problem and, hopefully, there will not be many of them.

[RYH64E]

sidicks said:

That's your opinion. Plenty of others have different ones.

You much be pretty naive if you think that the other governments will be able to sell a story to their electorate that says 'we agreed a deal that makes us worse off, because we wanted to punish the UK'...

Isn't that the deal that the Brexit side successfully sold to the UK electorate? All the 'experts' said don't do it, but we know what happened.

[don'tbesilly]

PurpleMoonlight said:

don'tbesilly said:

I do understand the difference thanks.

When both Cameron and Osborne, and then Gove/others spelt out prior to the referendum that leaving the EU meant relinquishing membership of the Single market, I and I'd imagine millions of voters who were considering the options,consequences and responsibilities of their vote looked into what leaving the single market meant and voted accordingly, either to stay in the EU or leave the EU, some of course didn't do any of the above.

I'm sure some who voted to leave might now be questioning their vote, others who voted remain will perhaps also be doing the same.
It makes for a good discussion for those who made it to the polling booth because they valued the future of the UK either in the EU or out of the EU which the UK will now be.

Back to that bigotry I see huh.

You need to grow up.

Can you point out the bigotry in my post please?

[sidicks]

RYH64E said:

Isn't that the deal that the Brexit side successfully sold to the UK electorate? All the 'experts' said don't do it, but we know what happened.

Some experts said some things. Some have already been proved wrong.

Until things are finalised, all options are still open. Politics doesn't operate in a vacuum.

[don4l]

PurpleMoonlight said:

don'tbesilly said:

I do understand the difference thanks.

When both Cameron and Osborne, and then Gove/others spelt out prior to the referendum that leaving the EU meant relinquishing membership of the Single market, I and I'd imagine millions of voters who were considering the options,consequences and responsibilities of their vote looked into what leaving the single market meant and voted accordingly, either to stay in the EU or leave the EU, some of course didn't do any of the above.

I'm sure some who voted to leave might now be questioning their vote, others who voted remain will perhaps also be doing the same.
It makes for a good discussion for those who made it to the polling booth because they valued the future of the UK either in the EU or out of the EU which the UK will now be.

Back to that bigotry I see huh.

You need to grow up.

What bigotry?

You appear to be going into meltdown.

[davepoth]

don4l said:

What bigotry?

You appear to be going into meltdown.

I think he's upset about people who voted asserting moral superiority in this discussion over people who didn't. Did he vote in the referendum?

[RYH64E]

sidicks said:

RYH64E said:

Isn't that the deal that the Brexit side successfully sold to the UK electorate? All the 'experts' said don't do it, but we know what happened.

Some experts said some things. Some have already been proved wrong.

Until things are finalised, all options are still open. Politics doesn't operate in a vacuum.

So on what basis do you conclude that a potentially damaging proposal couldn't be sold to the EU electorate? Screw the UK and London banks and car manufacturers will move to France for instance? Add in a touch of bigotry and anti-English sentiment (which is never in short supply in France) and it's job done.