The economic consequences of Brexit

The economic consequences of Brexit

Poll: The economic consequences of Brexit

Total Members Polled: 732

Far worse off than EU countries.: 15%
A bit worse off than if we'd stayed in.: 35%
A bit better off than if we'd stayed in.: 41%
Roughly as rich as the Swiss.: 10%
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Author
Discussion

Digga

40,206 posts

282 months

Friday 26th August 2016
quotequote all
SilverSixer said:
The financial fall out caused by the break up of political and trade relations between our major partners would have political and economic effects of enormous an mainly negative consequence. Isn't that obvious?
Not that I disagree with the point, but rather the cause; what are you seeing when you look at France, Italy, Spain, and Portugal that does not suggest severely difficult economic conditions ahead, irrespective of Brexit?

Jockman

17,912 posts

159 months

Friday 26th August 2016
quotequote all
Digga said:
Not that I disagree with the point, but rather the cause; what are you seeing when you look at France, Italy, Spain, and Portugal that does not suggest severely difficult economic conditions ahead, irrespective of Brexit?
You just forget Greece, Digga?

Dr Jekyll

Original Poster:

23,820 posts

260 months

Friday 26th August 2016
quotequote all
SilverSixer said:
The financial fall out caused by the break up of political and trade relations between our major partners would have political and economic effects of enormous an mainly negative consequence. Isn't that obvious?
What is far from obvious is why there has to be an EU in order for countries to have political and trade relations. If there were trade restrictions between current EU countries that would be a disadvantage but hardly catastrophic, and the lack of an EU would remove protectionist barriers to the rest of the world.

youngsyr

14,703 posts

191 months

Friday 26th August 2016
quotequote all
Digga said:
youngsyr said:
And that wise spending on decent infrastructure projects will be by the same mob that has delivered the 3rd runway at Heathrow, HS2 and Hinkley Point C?!

I'm not sure having the government spend billions to prop up the economy is any better than just giving every person a few grand direct into their bank account. Sure, a lot of that money may well be sat on or end up overseas via imports, but the way we're going that's the same with large infrastructure projects anyway - at least you can say it's democratic, which seems to be all the rage at the moment.
We don't have Hinkley - that seems to be being held as a bargaining chip in the Brexit negotiations. As for the other two projects, I do actually think they will both bring the unarguable benefits of greater volume capabilities'
We don't have the other examples either, that was my point - our government doesn't exactly have a glowing CV of efficiently delivered large infrastructure projects. wink

SilverSixer

8,202 posts

150 months

Friday 26th August 2016
quotequote all
Digga said:
SilverSixer said:
The financial fall out caused by the break up of political and trade relations between our major partners would have political and economic effects of enormous an mainly negative consequence. Isn't that obvious?
Not that I disagree with the point, but rather the cause; what are you seeing when you look at France, Italy, Spain, and Portugal that does not suggest severely difficult economic conditions ahead, irrespective of Brexit?
Oh, nothing. Just that the leave vote has potentially made the situation even worse, and a realised brexit would compound that. Both events are not conducive to an improvement in the condition of our partners, and are therefore detrimental to our own prospects concurrently. Where we could have helped, we have poured petrol. The vote to leave has given encouragement to other right-wing Eurosceptic parties and given their position more credence than it previously had, increasing the chances of further leave votes/Eurosceptic governments being elected across the EU, increasing the chances of a breakdown of the EU entirely, increasing the prospect of a political and economic decline across the continent, increasing the chances of impoverishing us all. Meanwhile we wrap ourselves in flags and say everything's better because Nationalism.

I can't see any way in which the leave vote has, or can have, positive political or economic consequences across the wider EU, let alone in the UK.

loafer123

15,404 posts

214 months

Friday 26th August 2016
quotequote all
SilverSixer said:
Digga said:
SilverSixer said:
The financial fall out caused by the break up of political and trade relations between our major partners would have political and economic effects of enormous an mainly negative consequence. Isn't that obvious?
Not that I disagree with the point, but rather the cause; what are you seeing when you look at France, Italy, Spain, and Portugal that does not suggest severely difficult economic conditions ahead, irrespective of Brexit?
Oh, nothing. Just that the leave vote has potentially made the situation even worse, and a realised brexit would compound that. Both events are not conducive to an improvement in the condition of our partners, and are therefore detrimental to our own prospects concurrently. Where we could have helped, we have poured petrol. The vote to leave has given encouragement to other right-wing Eurosceptic parties and given their position more credence than it previously had, increasing the chances of further leave votes/Eurosceptic governments being elected across the EU, increasing the chances of a breakdown of the EU entirely, increasing the prospect of a political and economic decline across the continent, increasing the chances of impoverishing us all. Meanwhile we wrap ourselves in flags and say everything's better because Nationalism.

I can't see any way in which the leave vote has, or can have, positive political or economic consequences across the wider EU, let alone in the UK.
Two likely beneficial consequences of the Brexit vote are;

1 that it triggers a more realistic vision for the EU which means that the EU survives (it won't if they don't)
2 it means we have greater access to world markets through agreeing bi-lateral trade agreements, creating additional economic growth

Dr Jekyll

Original Poster:

23,820 posts

260 months

Friday 26th August 2016
quotequote all
SilverSixer said:
Oh, nothing. Just that the leave vote has potentially made the situation even worse, and a realised brexit would compound that. Both events are not conducive to an improvement in the condition of our partners, and are therefore detrimental to our own prospects concurrently. Where we could have helped, we have poured petrol. The vote to leave has given encouragement to other right-wing Eurosceptic parties and given their position more credence than it previously had, increasing the chances of further leave votes/Eurosceptic governments being elected across the EU, increasing the chances of a breakdown of the EU entirely, increasing the prospect of a political and economic decline across the continent, increasing the chances of impoverishing us all. Meanwhile we wrap ourselves in flags and say everything's better because Nationalism.

I can't see any way in which the leave vote has, or can have, positive political or economic consequences across the wider EU, let alone in the UK.
in what way could we conceivably have helped?

Digga

40,206 posts

282 months

Friday 26th August 2016
quotequote all
Jockman said:
You just forget Greece, Digga?
Greece is utterly screwed, granted, but in terms of significance to the EU or Euro - and in a way, this was it's problem; it was small enough to fail - it matter little, other than to pour a bit more malcontent and discord into the mix.

Dr Jekyll said:
in what way could we conceivably have helped?
I'm awaiting the response with baited breath. I wonder if it includes Bono and Bob Geldoff?

don'tbesilly

13,900 posts

162 months

Friday 26th August 2016
quotequote all
SilverSixer said:
Digga said:
SilverSixer said:
The financial fall out caused by the break up of political and trade relations between our major partners would have political and economic effects of enormous an mainly negative consequence. Isn't that obvious?
Not that I disagree with the point, but rather the cause; what are you seeing when you look at France, Italy, Spain, and Portugal that does not suggest severely difficult economic conditions ahead, irrespective of Brexit?
Oh, nothing. Just that the leave vote has potentially made the situation even worse, and a realised brexit would compound that. Both events are not conducive to an improvement in the condition of our partners, and are therefore detrimental to our own prospects concurrently. Where we could have helped, we have poured petrol. The vote to leave has given encouragement to other right-wing Eurosceptic parties and given their position more credence than it previously had, increasing the chances of further leave votes/Eurosceptic governments being elected across the EU, increasing the chances of a breakdown of the EU entirely, increasing the prospect of a political and economic decline across the continent, increasing the chances of impoverishing us all. Meanwhile we wrap ourselves in flags and say everything's better because Nationalism.

I can't see any way in which the leave vote has, or can have, positive political or economic consequences across the wider EU, let alone in the UK.
So your saying that pre - Brexit everything in the EU garden was rosy.
All the countries now showing utter disdain for their Lords and masters within the EU have woken up smelt the same coffee that the Brits are drinking and because they like the smell they want some of the same.

My only two questions to the other countries would be:

Do you take milk?
Sugar?


SilverSixer

8,202 posts

150 months

Friday 26th August 2016
quotequote all
loafer123 said:
SilverSixer said:
Digga said:
SilverSixer said:
The financial fall out caused by the break up of political and trade relations between our major partners would have political and economic effects of enormous an mainly negative consequence. Isn't that obvious?
Not that I disagree with the point, but rather the cause; what are you seeing when you look at France, Italy, Spain, and Portugal that does not suggest severely difficult economic conditions ahead, irrespective of Brexit?
Oh, nothing. Just that the leave vote has potentially made the situation even worse, and a realised brexit would compound that. Both events are not conducive to an improvement in the condition of our partners, and are therefore detrimental to our own prospects concurrently. Where we could have helped, we have poured petrol. The vote to leave has given encouragement to other right-wing Eurosceptic parties and given their position more credence than it previously had, increasing the chances of further leave votes/Eurosceptic governments being elected across the EU, increasing the chances of a breakdown of the EU entirely, increasing the prospect of a political and economic decline across the continent, increasing the chances of impoverishing us all. Meanwhile we wrap ourselves in flags and say everything's better because Nationalism.

I can't see any way in which the leave vote has, or can have, positive political or economic consequences across the wider EU, let alone in the UK.
Two likely beneficial consequences of the Brexit vote are;

1 that it triggers a more realistic vision for the EU which means that the EU survives (it won't if they don't)
2 it means we have greater access to world markets through agreeing bi-lateral trade agreements, creating additional economic growth
This sounds like a brexiter's version of that much derided socialist magic money tree.

SilverSixer

8,202 posts

150 months

Friday 26th August 2016
quotequote all
don'tbesilly said:
SilverSixer said:
Digga said:
SilverSixer said:
The financial fall out caused by the break up of political and trade relations between our major partners would have political and economic effects of enormous an mainly negative consequence. Isn't that obvious?
Not that I disagree with the point, but rather the cause; what are you seeing when you look at France, Italy, Spain, and Portugal that does not suggest severely difficult economic conditions ahead, irrespective of Brexit?
Oh, nothing. Just that the leave vote has potentially made the situation even worse, and a realised brexit would compound that. Both events are not conducive to an improvement in the condition of our partners, and are therefore detrimental to our own prospects concurrently. Where we could have helped, we have poured petrol. The vote to leave has given encouragement to other right-wing Eurosceptic parties and given their position more credence than it previously had, increasing the chances of further leave votes/Eurosceptic governments being elected across the EU, increasing the chances of a breakdown of the EU entirely, increasing the prospect of a political and economic decline across the continent, increasing the chances of impoverishing us all. Meanwhile we wrap ourselves in flags and say everything's better because Nationalism.

I can't see any way in which the leave vote has, or can have, positive political or economic consequences across the wider EU, let alone in the UK.
So your saying that pre - Brexit everything in the EU garden was rosy.
All the countries now showing utter disdain for their Lords and masters within the EU have woken up smelt the same coffee that the Brits are drinking and because they like the smell they want some of the same.

My only two questions to the other countries would be:

Do you take milk?
Sugar?
rofl Yes.

Great user name.

I love it when someone says "So you're saying", immediately followed by something which has not been said.

SilverSixer

8,202 posts

150 months

Friday 26th August 2016
quotequote all
Dr Jekyll said:
SilverSixer said:
Oh, nothing. Just that the leave vote has potentially made the situation even worse, and a realised brexit would compound that. Both events are not conducive to an improvement in the condition of our partners, and are therefore detrimental to our own prospects concurrently. Where we could have helped, we have poured petrol. The vote to leave has given encouragement to other right-wing Eurosceptic parties and given their position more credence than it previously had, increasing the chances of further leave votes/Eurosceptic governments being elected across the EU, increasing the chances of a breakdown of the EU entirely, increasing the prospect of a political and economic decline across the continent, increasing the chances of impoverishing us all. Meanwhile we wrap ourselves in flags and say everything's better because Nationalism.

I can't see any way in which the leave vote has, or can have, positive political or economic consequences across the wider EU, let alone in the UK.
in what way could we conceivably have helped?
Er, by remaining. Which we probably will in the end anyway.

CaptainSlow

13,179 posts

211 months

Friday 26th August 2016
quotequote all
SilverSixer said:
De Gaulle may well be proved right on that one if brexit does happen. And mark my words a collapse of the entire EU would be catastrophic for us.

Well done, leave voters. Slow hand clap.
Rubbish, if you want someone to blame, point the finger at the EU elite that have, in an underhand way, changed the arrangement from a trading zone to a political union. These are the people that have caused the collapse.

Well done Junckers et Tusk. Slow hand clap.

Funk

26,254 posts

208 months

Friday 26th August 2016
quotequote all
loafer123 said:
SilverSixer said:
Digga said:
SilverSixer said:
The financial fall out caused by the break up of political and trade relations between our major partners would have political and economic effects of enormous an mainly negative consequence. Isn't that obvious?
Not that I disagree with the point, but rather the cause; what are you seeing when you look at France, Italy, Spain, and Portugal that does not suggest severely difficult economic conditions ahead, irrespective of Brexit?
Oh, nothing. Just that the leave vote has potentially made the situation even worse, and a realised brexit would compound that. Both events are not conducive to an improvement in the condition of our partners, and are therefore detrimental to our own prospects concurrently. Where we could have helped, we have poured petrol. The vote to leave has given encouragement to other right-wing Eurosceptic parties and given their position more credence than it previously had, increasing the chances of further leave votes/Eurosceptic governments being elected across the EU, increasing the chances of a breakdown of the EU entirely, increasing the prospect of a political and economic decline across the continent, increasing the chances of impoverishing us all. Meanwhile we wrap ourselves in flags and say everything's better because Nationalism.

I can't see any way in which the leave vote has, or can have, positive political or economic consequences across the wider EU, let alone in the UK.
Two likely beneficial consequences of the Brexit vote are;

1 that it triggers a more realistic vision for the EU which means that the EU survives (it won't if they don't)
2 it means we have greater access to world markets through agreeing bi-lateral trade agreements, creating additional economic growth
Good points, succinctly made.

Worth remembering that the EU's share of global GDP is in decline (and has been for some time) and our share of the declining EU pot is also declining. Arguably to stay in and focused on the EU would be to chase the water down the plughole especially given the current economic situations in various southern EU member states.

don'tbesilly

13,900 posts

162 months

Friday 26th August 2016
quotequote all
SilverSixer said:
Dr Jekyll said:
SilverSixer said:
Oh, nothing. Just that the leave vote has potentially made the situation even worse, and a realised brexit would compound that. Both events are not conducive to an improvement in the condition of our partners, and are therefore detrimental to our own prospects concurrently. Where we could have helped, we have poured petrol. The vote to leave has given encouragement to other right-wing Eurosceptic parties and given their position more credence than it previously had, increasing the chances of further leave votes/Eurosceptic governments being elected across the EU, increasing the chances of a breakdown of the EU entirely, increasing the prospect of a political and economic decline across the continent, increasing the chances of impoverishing us all. Meanwhile we wrap ourselves in flags and say everything's better because Nationalism.

I can't see any way in which the leave vote has, or can have, positive political or economic consequences across the wider EU, let alone in the UK.
in what way could we conceivably have helped?
Er, by remaining. Which we probably will in the end anyway.
Carry on with the fantasy, although I'd recommend the coffee, it's not as bitter as you are wink

SilverSixer

8,202 posts

150 months

Friday 26th August 2016
quotequote all
don'tbesilly said:
SilverSixer said:
Dr Jekyll said:
SilverSixer said:
Oh, nothing. Just that the leave vote has potentially made the situation even worse, and a realised brexit would compound that. Both events are not conducive to an improvement in the condition of our partners, and are therefore detrimental to our own prospects concurrently. Where we could have helped, we have poured petrol. The vote to leave has given encouragement to other right-wing Eurosceptic parties and given their position more credence than it previously had, increasing the chances of further leave votes/Eurosceptic governments being elected across the EU, increasing the chances of a breakdown of the EU entirely, increasing the prospect of a political and economic decline across the continent, increasing the chances of impoverishing us all. Meanwhile we wrap ourselves in flags and say everything's better because Nationalism.

I can't see any way in which the leave vote has, or can have, positive political or economic consequences across the wider EU, let alone in the UK.
in what way could we conceivably have helped?
Er, by remaining. Which we probably will in the end anyway.
Carry on with the fantasy, although I'd recommend the coffee, it's not as bitter as you are wink
Dunno, sounds a bit foreign to me. Shouldn't we all be drinking Yorkshire Tea with 8 sugars now, tea and sugar being such native crops to Our England?

BJG1

5,966 posts

211 months

Friday 26th August 2016
quotequote all
don4l said:
Nonsense. I fully support free trade.

It is basic economics that it is better to manfufacture than to import.
It really isn't.

Dr Jekyll

Original Poster:

23,820 posts

260 months

Friday 26th August 2016
quotequote all
SilverSixer said:
Dunno, sounds a bit foreign to me. Shouldn't we all be drinking Yorkshire Tea with 8 sugars now, tea and sugar being such native crops to Our England?
No, because once we leave the EU we can import from coffee producing areas of the world without the EU interfering and insisting on tariffs.

sidicks

25,218 posts

220 months

Friday 26th August 2016
quotequote all
SilverSixer said:
This sounds like a brexiter's version of that much derided socialist magic money tree.
Does that mean you don't understand them restrictions on trade negotiation we are facing while in the EU (and the strong desire from multiple countries to engage with us post-Brexit?

SilverSixer

8,202 posts

150 months

Friday 26th August 2016
quotequote all
Dr Jekyll said:
SilverSixer said:
Dunno, sounds a bit foreign to me. Shouldn't we all be drinking Yorkshire Tea with 8 sugars now, tea and sugar being such native crops to Our England?
No, because once we leave the EU we can import from coffee producing areas of the world without the EU interfering and insisting on tariffs.
Interesting economic theory that we'll get a better price as a single buyer than as part of a consortium placing a much bigger order.

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