Why so much referendum decision remorse?
Discussion
don4l said:
nadger said:
don4l said:
Matt UK said:
Maybe it's just the news coverage, but I'm staggered there so many people saying they voted leave "but are now not sure if they made the right decision" or are "surprised it actually happened and now feel nervous".
Seriously, did the people of this country not understand what they were voting for?
This is an orchestrated campaign to destabilise the referendum result.Seriously, did the people of this country not understand what they were voting for?
Votes can be traced. I bet that if we do a little investigation, we will discover that they are lying through their teeth.
The whole Remain campaign has been built on lies.
If you disagree that the Remain campaign was built on lies, then all you need to do is give us an example of a truth that they told.
Can we please move on and look ahead to making Brexit work as well as possible instead of b
hing about the last few weeks?Elysium said:
I expect there is a dawning realisation for many that:
1. The leave campaign was founded on a bunch of random entirely made up nonsense that cannot be delivered (£350m a week saved, new hospitals, cancer drugs, free movement for us but not for the foreigners and access to the single market free of charge)
2. Boris and his gang had no plan at all. Nothing.
3. The predictions made by almost all financial institutions and experts have come true - our markets are suffering and our personal finances will also suffer in time.
4. The architect of our misfortune, David Cameron led a lacklustre campaign, failing to explain why we should stay and after losing has simply opted out.
I think it is natural that many will feel misled and let down. I expect they will stand by their reasoning for wanting to leave, but will be wondering if this will happen and if the price of an illusory freedom will be worth paying.
Given the major political earthquake is just a week past it is hardly surprising to learn of unease /concern . The Government and main opposition need to find new leaders. Nobody said that a leave vote would not bring about some turmoil but given a sensible amount of time, a few years perhaps, and the new life of the Country will have a clearer horizon. 1. The leave campaign was founded on a bunch of random entirely made up nonsense that cannot be delivered (£350m a week saved, new hospitals, cancer drugs, free movement for us but not for the foreigners and access to the single market free of charge)
2. Boris and his gang had no plan at all. Nothing.
3. The predictions made by almost all financial institutions and experts have come true - our markets are suffering and our personal finances will also suffer in time.
4. The architect of our misfortune, David Cameron led a lacklustre campaign, failing to explain why we should stay and after losing has simply opted out.
I think it is natural that many will feel misled and let down. I expect they will stand by their reasoning for wanting to leave, but will be wondering if this will happen and if the price of an illusory freedom will be worth paying.
oyster said:
I'd be willing to bet my house that less than 10% of the leave voters had that in mind when casting their vote.
To be fair, people like you (and indeed many other PH 'leavers') have been consistent in arguing for this view from the beginning of the campaign. But I can't help thinking you're in the educated/thinking minority. As an undecided voter last week, the cause of sovereignty was the main Brexit tenet I had a pull toward. But I know most weren't thinking that way.
There is some merit in this view but I would suggest that in all elections there is this type of voting. You see it especially when Labour get in on their "economic" promises. It may be more prevalent with this vote but I'd also bet that most remain voters still think that the EU is a nice fluffy trading bloc who just want everyone to be able to sell stuff to each other. To be fair, people like you (and indeed many other PH 'leavers') have been consistent in arguing for this view from the beginning of the campaign. But I can't help thinking you're in the educated/thinking minority. As an undecided voter last week, the cause of sovereignty was the main Brexit tenet I had a pull toward. But I know most weren't thinking that way.
230TE said:
Well the FTSE 100 is still down a whopping 1% on last Thursday's close. Now stop being so optimistic and let people enjoy their schadenfreude.
I do get the feeling many people are sad and so pissed off that the world hasn't ended just as they had predicted. The other view of course is all "leave" voters are as thick as pigst and racist.Dakkon said:
You mean the people it will affect the most could not be arsed to get out of bed and actually vote, so it's their own god damned fault, 30% of 18 - 24 actually voted, if the rest could have been bothered remain would have won.
I have no time for this argument that the older generations have ruined the future of the younger, they could have controlled their own destiny, they CHOSE not to.
Further, the inevitable short-term impacts of 'Brexit' were always going to include:I have no time for this argument that the older generations have ruined the future of the younger, they could have controlled their own destiny, they CHOSE not to.
- market volatility (equity falls)
- expected reduction in interest rates
Neither of the above benefit the older generations particularly, so it is quite reasonable to assess that the older generation voting 'leave' did so less out of personal gain and more out of personal belief that the long-term outcome for the country would be improved.
Tycho said:
You are being shortsighted about this just like most remainers. It isn't about now but about the path the EU is taking. They went from a trade bloc to a political entity with the stated aim of total assimilation of all nations into one with no mandate from the people. This is the first time we have had a say on this and although history is littered with referendum reversals and fudges to ensure the "right" result, a lot of people cannot see the corruption and self serving nature of the EU. Remainers are bleating on about their view that they are the only ones who are thinking of the children but this is complete rubbish.
Sorry, but your bit in bold is the complete rubbish.The very first page of the introduction to the Treaty of Rome bangs on about ever closer union, removing barriers across Europe and unifying European economies. We voted to be a part of that in a referendum, as did the voters of other countries.
OK, you might not have understood the ramifications of what you were signing up to, even though it was written in perfectly clear English, but that just serves to underline why deciding these sorts of things by referendum isn't always a good idea!
We signed up to something. We have now decided we don't want to be in it any more. That's fair enough and it's our democratic right to do so, but claiming that we never gave it a mandate is wrong.
Kermit power said:
Tycho said:
You are being shortsighted about this just like most remainers. It isn't about now but about the path the EU is taking. They went from a trade bloc to a political entity with the stated aim of total assimilation of all nations into one with no mandate from the people. This is the first time we have had a say on this and although history is littered with referendum reversals and fudges to ensure the "right" result, a lot of people cannot see the corruption and self serving nature of the EU. Remainers are bleating on about their view that they are the only ones who are thinking of the children but this is complete rubbish.
Sorry, but your bit in bold is the complete rubbish.The very first page of the introduction to the Treaty of Rome bangs on about ever closer union, removing barriers across Europe and unifying European economies. We voted to be a part of that in a referendum, as did the voters of other countries.
OK, you might not have understood the ramifications of what you were signing up to, even though it was written in perfectly clear English, but that just serves to underline why deciding these sorts of things by referendum isn't always a good idea!
We signed up to something. We have now decided we don't want to be in it any more. That's fair enough and it's our democratic right to do so, but claiming that we never gave it a mandate is wrong.
If I am mistaken and this isn't unusual I will admit it but also say that this is the first time I have had a vote on this and don't want a part of it.
Edited by Tycho on Wednesday 29th June 12:11
The European Union always was a CIA project, as Brexiteers discover .
The above headline from an Article in the telegraph. Just watching another guy Dr Paul craig Roberts who confirms this and suggests the EU reports to Washington . He also says it is why we are always at odds with Russia.
When we all cast our votes last week (well most of us some stayed in bed) little did we know the ripple effect going around the world and I think its a good thing. Politics needed a kick up the backside and start representing the views of the people.
The above headline from an Article in the telegraph. Just watching another guy Dr Paul craig Roberts who confirms this and suggests the EU reports to Washington . He also says it is why we are always at odds with Russia.
When we all cast our votes last week (well most of us some stayed in bed) little did we know the ripple effect going around the world and I think its a good thing. Politics needed a kick up the backside and start representing the views of the people.
oyster said:
jshell said:
Well, it hasn't affected my oil shares, they're still rising. What happened to the global meltdown that was predicted?
You're alright Jack.Now, quit whining and get on with it! We've got a job to do now, so STFU and help create a better future for all of us...
Kermit power said:
I think the main reason for regret goes something like this....
1. Quite a lot of people have belatedly realised that this was a one time vote, and they're not going to get to do it again in five years.
2. Many of those same people have effectively voted for a section of the British establishment (Boris & Gove) for whom they'd never vote in a million months of Sundays in a national election.
3. An increasing number of them have also realised that this means that they have absolutely no way of holding Boris and Gove accountable for anything they do now, because it's a one time decision, and Boris and Gove knew they'd never have to count on their support anyway.
The people I've spoken to who regret voting leave have said they regret it not because they want to stay in the EU, but because they're coming to realise that the establishment's view of what the post EU UK will look like is very different to what they imagined, and there's little or nothing that they can do about it.
we will all have a clearer picture of our futures within the next few years. Meanwhile some recovery in the markets before they drop again, we can expect a bumpy ride, not be surprised by it.1. Quite a lot of people have belatedly realised that this was a one time vote, and they're not going to get to do it again in five years.
2. Many of those same people have effectively voted for a section of the British establishment (Boris & Gove) for whom they'd never vote in a million months of Sundays in a national election.
3. An increasing number of them have also realised that this means that they have absolutely no way of holding Boris and Gove accountable for anything they do now, because it's a one time decision, and Boris and Gove knew they'd never have to count on their support anyway.
The people I've spoken to who regret voting leave have said they regret it not because they want to stay in the EU, but because they're coming to realise that the establishment's view of what the post EU UK will look like is very different to what they imagined, and there's little or nothing that they can do about it.
sidicks said:
Dakkon said:
You mean the people it will affect the most could not be arsed to get out of bed and actually vote, so it's their own god damned fault, 30% of 18 - 24 actually voted, if the rest could have been bothered remain would have won.
I have no time for this argument that the older generations have ruined the future of the younger, they could have controlled their own destiny, they CHOSE not to.
Further, the inevitable short-term impacts of 'Brexit' were always going to include:I have no time for this argument that the older generations have ruined the future of the younger, they could have controlled their own destiny, they CHOSE not to.
- market volatility (equity falls)
- expected reduction in interest rates
Neither of the above benefit the older generations particularly, so it is quite reasonable to assess that the older generation voting 'leave' did so less out of personal gain and more out of personal belief that the long-term outcome for the country would be improved.
I sincerely believe that our grandson will enjoy a richer, fuller life on the back of our historic vote.
sidicks said:
crankedup said:
Another agreement from me!!!
I sincerely believe that our grandson will enjoy a richer, fuller life on the back of our historic vote.
Another occasion when we agree!I sincerely believe that our grandson will enjoy a richer, fuller life on the back of our historic vote.
Europa1 said:
Both sides told whoppers during the campaign.
Can we please move on and look ahead to making Brexit work as well as possible instead of bhing about the last few weeks?
Unfortunately we can't. Brexit isn't going to work. The people campaigning for it have already accepted that and are working out how best to polish the half baked compromise they are presently cobbling together so that leave voters are tricked into believing that the entire debacle was anything other than a monumental waste of time and money. Can we please move on and look ahead to making Brexit work as well as possible instead of b
hing about the last few weeks?Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff