£375000 overtime pay for doctor, who syas NHS isnt broken
Discussion
when it suits them doctors say being a doctor is vocational, this is out of control
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-36898881
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-36898881
We need more qualified doctors as is evidenced by the overtime the ones we have do.
You won't attract the brightest and best to study medicine by paying the badly.
Successive governments of all political persuasions have continued to accept market forces within the NHS staffing arrangements and short term thinking because the public won't accept that our NHS isn't particularly well funded.
Hence... We are where we are.
You won't attract the brightest and best to study medicine by paying the badly.
Successive governments of all political persuasions have continued to accept market forces within the NHS staffing arrangements and short term thinking because the public won't accept that our NHS isn't particularly well funded.
Hence... We are where we are.
I'm sure certain individuals are taking the piss - like in most big organisations.
However, if the 4 hours overtime is required because there aren't enough qualified in that role to cover it in normal working hours, and in that 4 hours your life (or your loved ones life) is saved, then would you rather the overtime wasn't happening?
However, if the 4 hours overtime is required because there aren't enough qualified in that role to cover it in normal working hours, and in that 4 hours your life (or your loved ones life) is saved, then would you rather the overtime wasn't happening?
PurpleMoonlight said:
"Payments of about £600 in overtime for a four-hour shift are common"
£150 per hour for a fully qualified consultant doesn't seem that bad to me.
You can't get a half decent solicitor for that and they aren't potentially playing with your life.
But that would be a gross payment for services including VAT. The analogy works if the law firm paid the salaried solicitor overtime of £150 for your preliminary interview in addition to a generous salary and pension.£150 per hour for a fully qualified consultant doesn't seem that bad to me.
You can't get a half decent solicitor for that and they aren't potentially playing with your life.
I would be interested to see the levels locuming that goes on on their days off that are supposed to be taken off to rest for health and safety reasons.
The problem is, quite obviously, the lack of trained staff. We need more doctors. However, we are losing them.
We used to draw them in from the old empire, taking them from countries that were chronically short of them to boost our numbers without having to pay the costs of training. Now there are as many going to India as there are coming from it. And that's old figures. It is probably more now.
Nothing has been done to increase the flow of home-trained doctors. Yet staffing levels need to increase just to keep pace with the lack of them. At my surgery most doctors are part-time. They don't do much private work but look after their kids. Once they are off their hands they tend to keep the low hours. So all that training and costs for half the work.
That's not to criticise those who have an effective work/life balance. They should do what suits them best.
The main block is training. Numbers have increased slightly but the attraction of god's own countries is greater now. We are suffering in the same way that India suffered when we went poaching.
We used to draw them in from the old empire, taking them from countries that were chronically short of them to boost our numbers without having to pay the costs of training. Now there are as many going to India as there are coming from it. And that's old figures. It is probably more now.
Nothing has been done to increase the flow of home-trained doctors. Yet staffing levels need to increase just to keep pace with the lack of them. At my surgery most doctors are part-time. They don't do much private work but look after their kids. Once they are off their hands they tend to keep the low hours. So all that training and costs for half the work.
That's not to criticise those who have an effective work/life balance. They should do what suits them best.
The main block is training. Numbers have increased slightly but the attraction of god's own countries is greater now. We are suffering in the same way that India suffered when we went poaching.
Adrian W said:
when it suits them doctors say being a doctor is vocational, this is out of control
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-36898881
A very good premiership footballer earns about a million pounds a month PLUS lucrative endorsements from manufacturers for kicking a ball around.http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-36898881
Puts it in perspective.
Jockman said:
"The average amount paid in high-cost overtime was £13,356 per consultant"
And yet we focus in on the exceptions??
Get people jealous and envious of doctors, it already sounds like the op is. Anytime the media wants to attack a profession they just throwing salary numbers around.And yet we focus in on the exceptions??
This highlights not enough staff for one reason or another.
PurpleMoonlight said:
"Payments of about £600 in overtime for a four-hour shift are common"
£150 per hour for a fully qualified consultant doesn't seem that bad to me.
You can't get a half decent solicitor for that and they aren't potentially playing with your life.
You aren't comparing like with like.£150 per hour for a fully qualified consultant doesn't seem that bad to me.
You can't get a half decent solicitor for that and they aren't potentially playing with your life.
You are comparing the charge out rate of a professional, with an actual salary received.
Professional service firms used to operate on the 1/3s rule. 1/3 to salary costs of individual, 1/3 for admin Overheads, 1/3 to partners. In the modern age this is somewhat different but you can be assured that a junior solicitor is not being paid £150 per hour!
V8 Fettler said:
Do not NHS consultants receive a good salary? If so, why is there paid overtime available?
Because there aren't enough Consultants to cover all the vacancies.I imagine we could end up in a similar situation if all the Junior Doctors decide to upsticks and leave the NHS for sunnier climes. Fortunately they're all well paid with excellent working conditions so it's unlikely to happen.....
Derek Smith said:
The problem is, quite obviously, the lack of trained staff. We need more doctors. However, we are losing them.
We used to draw them in from the old empire, taking them from countries that were chronically short of them to boost our numbers without having to pay the costs of training. Now there are as many going to India as there are coming from it. And that's old figures. It is probably more now.
Nothing has been done to increase the flow of home-trained doctors. Yet staffing levels need to increase just to keep pace with the lack of them. At my surgery most doctors are part-time. They don't do much private work but look after their kids. Once they are off their hands they tend to keep the low hours. So all that training and costs for half the work.
That's not to criticise those who have an effective work/life balance. They should do what suits them best.
The main block is training. Numbers have increased slightly but the attraction of god's own countries is greater now. We are suffering in the same way that India suffered when we went poaching.
Very true, we need some more medical schools to produce more doctors, even then it would be seven years till they graduated. We used to draw them in from the old empire, taking them from countries that were chronically short of them to boost our numbers without having to pay the costs of training. Now there are as many going to India as there are coming from it. And that's old figures. It is probably more now.
Nothing has been done to increase the flow of home-trained doctors. Yet staffing levels need to increase just to keep pace with the lack of them. At my surgery most doctors are part-time. They don't do much private work but look after their kids. Once they are off their hands they tend to keep the low hours. So all that training and costs for half the work.
That's not to criticise those who have an effective work/life balance. They should do what suits them best.
The main block is training. Numbers have increased slightly but the attraction of god's own countries is greater now. We are suffering in the same way that India suffered when we went poaching.
JagLover said:
You aren't comparing like with like.
You are comparing the charge out rate of a professional, with an actual salary received.
Professional service firms used to operate on the 1/3s rule. 1/3 to salary costs of individual, 1/3 for admin Overheads, 1/3 to partners. In the modern age this is somewhat different but you can be assured that a junior solicitor is not being paid £150 per hour!
You think you are comparing like for like? This is single consultant that got paid this much. Junior solicitor? Take, not even best paid, solicitor, but say top 5%. How much do you think that they get paid? Complete non-story, as it took very much exception rather than a rule. As mentioned before, if we had more consultants, there would be no need for overtime and using so many locums. You are comparing the charge out rate of a professional, with an actual salary received.
Professional service firms used to operate on the 1/3s rule. 1/3 to salary costs of individual, 1/3 for admin Overheads, 1/3 to partners. In the modern age this is somewhat different but you can be assured that a junior solicitor is not being paid £150 per hour!
greygoose said:
Very true, we need some more medical schools to produce more doctors, even then it would be seven years till they graduated.
+ 8 years more till they become consultants. During those years, they'll pay professional insurance themselves + cost of all courses and exams that they need to pass. Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff