so glad im not american or in the united states.
Discussion
The illusory superiority that Brits have towards Americans is laughable, in fact, that Brits have to most if not all other nationalities!
I have been fortunate enough to be able to live and work in mainland Europe and in the USA in my line of work. We lived in the West (wild) for the last five years returning late last year.
America is a fine place full of fine people. Of course it has it's fair share of utter f
ktards, as does this fine island but the image the vast majority of Brits have of the USA is so far from reality.
The comment about people going there and being confused that things are different is spot on. When we had visitors over I regularly commented how if the road signs were in a different language people would be more accepting of American culture.
The base language is English but it has developed alongside many other languages over a very short period of time relatively and changed differently to our own version. Is that really that difficult to grasp? Some US dialects and words are apparently much more 'authentic' English anyway due to there being less change, not more.
As for knocking their politics, ffs, have a look around! Farage, Le Penn, Merkel, Corbyn, Hollande? Not to mention Brown, Balls, Cooper et al!!
It is immensely difficult to gain permanent residency to the States legally. Despite the good lady being sponsored for a H1B the chances of that becoming a green card within a decade were slim to none.
I chuckle inside when I get colleagues suggesting I was mad to have 'put up' with living in the USA for all that time. All those gun toting thicko fat racist insular bds must have ground me down apparently! Oh the irony.................
I have been fortunate enough to be able to live and work in mainland Europe and in the USA in my line of work. We lived in the West (wild) for the last five years returning late last year.
America is a fine place full of fine people. Of course it has it's fair share of utter f
ktards, as does this fine island but the image the vast majority of Brits have of the USA is so far from reality. The comment about people going there and being confused that things are different is spot on. When we had visitors over I regularly commented how if the road signs were in a different language people would be more accepting of American culture.
The base language is English but it has developed alongside many other languages over a very short period of time relatively and changed differently to our own version. Is that really that difficult to grasp? Some US dialects and words are apparently much more 'authentic' English anyway due to there being less change, not more.
As for knocking their politics, ffs, have a look around! Farage, Le Penn, Merkel, Corbyn, Hollande? Not to mention Brown, Balls, Cooper et al!!
It is immensely difficult to gain permanent residency to the States legally. Despite the good lady being sponsored for a H1B the chances of that becoming a green card within a decade were slim to none.
I chuckle inside when I get colleagues suggesting I was mad to have 'put up' with living in the USA for all that time. All those gun toting thicko fat racist insular b
ds must have ground me down apparently! Oh the irony.................gadgetmac said:
skyrover said:
For the large part, the US has many advantages over the UK.
I'm willing to be many many Brits would be moving there if it was easier to get a residents permit
3 times as many UK emigrants prefer Australia to the US. It's close between Spain and the USA for 2nd place.I'm willing to be many many Brits would be moving there if it was easier to get a residents permit
Australia still accepts tradesmen with zero academic qualifications - US has never done that.
Unless you marry a USC or have very close family ties to a USC, or have the pre-requisite $500k to essentially 'buy' permanent residence, getting in via employment (as I did) is very difficult and fraught with red tape, costly petitions and lots of potential bear-traps.
If you qualify, it is worth it though.
MrNoisy said:
The illusory superiority that Brits have towards Americans is laughable, in fact, that Brits have to most if not all other nationalities!
Are you suggesting that the yanks don't suffer the same problem? My experience is that they suffer at least as much. That they think we do some things well - all my American friends praise the BBC to the rafters - but in general they react the same way as we do to foreigners. It is, I'm afraid, just as laughable.Derek Smith said:
Are you suggesting that the yanks don't suffer the same problem? My experience is that they suffer at least as much. That they think we do some things well - all my American friends praise the BBC to the rafters - but in general they react the same way as we do to foreigners. It is, I'm afraid, just as laughable.
If I had advert breaks every seven minutes and pharmaceutical advertising on TV I'd also praise the BBC to the rafters, to be fair.Derek Smith said:
MrNoisy said:
The illusory superiority that Brits have towards Americans is laughable, in fact, that Brits have to most if not all other nationalities!
Are you suggesting that the yanks don't suffer the same problem? My experience is that they suffer at least as much. That they think we do some things well - all my American friends praise the BBC to the rafters...In the published paper I referred to previously from Groseclose and Milyo, from a total of 20 USA media sources only 2 are conservative, with the remainder liberal left. Their scale runs from 0 (most conservative) to 100 (most liberal).
ABC Good Morning America 56.1
ABC World News Tonight 61.0
CBS Early Show 66.6
CBS Evening News 73.7
CNN NewsNight with Aaron Brown 56.0
Drudge Report 60.4
Fox News 39.7
Los Angeles Times 70.0
NBC Nightly News 61.6
NBC Today Show 64.0
New York Times 73.7
Newshour with Jim Lehrer 55.8
Newsweek 66.3
NPR Morning Edition 66.3
Time Magazine 65.4
U.S. News and World Report 65.8
USA Today 63.4
Wall Street Journal 85.1
Washington Post 66.6
Washington Times 35.4
Derek Smith said:
MrNoisy said:
The illusory superiority that Brits have towards Americans is laughable, in fact, that Brits have to most if not all other nationalities!
Are you suggesting that the yanks don't suffer the same problem? My experience is that they suffer at least as much. That they think we do some things well - all my American friends praise the BBC to the rafters - but in general they react the same way as we do to foreigners. It is, I'm afraid, just as laughable.I left long ago, and could provide a laundry list of reasons why life quality in most parts of Europe is much higher.
I really want to see a picture of 5ohmustang.
I have a mental picture in my mind of a slightly portly bloke with a st ponytail, absoloutely dripping from head to toe in "surplus" army hear that probably never went to the army in the first place. I'm especially interested to see how many weapons are in holsters dotted about the place - including his "daily carry" 6 inch knife in tactical us army rangerl camp sheath.
Either way, if 5oh in any way represents America, then the world is fked.
I have a mental picture in my mind of a slightly portly bloke with a s
t ponytail, absoloutely dripping from head to toe in "surplus" army hear that probably never went to the army in the first place. I'm especially interested to see how many weapons are in holsters dotted about the place - including his "daily carry" 6 inch knife in tactical us army rangerl camp sheath. Either way, if 5oh in any way represents America, then the world is f
ked. 
turbobloke said:
While that's an insignificantly small sample size, it must be a home from home with no ads as a bonus.
In the published paper I referred to previously from Groseclose and Milyo, from a total of 20 USA media sources only 2 are conservative, with the remainder liberal left. Their scale runs from 0 (most conservative) to 100 (most liberal).
ABC Good Morning America 56.1
ABC World News Tonight 61.0
CBS Early Show 66.6
CBS Evening News 73.7
CNN NewsNight with Aaron Brown 56.0
Drudge Report 60.4
Fox News 39.7
Los Angeles Times 70.0
NBC Nightly News 61.6
NBC Today Show 64.0
New York Times 73.7
Newshour with Jim Lehrer 55.8
Newsweek 66.3
NPR Morning Edition 66.3
Time Magazine 65.4
U.S. News and World Report 65.8
USA Today 63.4
Wall Street Journal 85.1
Washington Post 66.6
Washington Times 35.4
Though Groseclose and Milyo's paper has itself been criticised as has almost every other study on this subject. Indeed there are many publications which would paint an entirely different story of Media bias in the USA. There was even a study by JM Ladd which found that the main cause of belief in media bias is the media telling their audience that other particular media are biased.In the published paper I referred to previously from Groseclose and Milyo, from a total of 20 USA media sources only 2 are conservative, with the remainder liberal left. Their scale runs from 0 (most conservative) to 100 (most liberal).
ABC Good Morning America 56.1
ABC World News Tonight 61.0
CBS Early Show 66.6
CBS Evening News 73.7
CNN NewsNight with Aaron Brown 56.0
Drudge Report 60.4
Fox News 39.7
Los Angeles Times 70.0
NBC Nightly News 61.6
NBC Today Show 64.0
New York Times 73.7
Newshour with Jim Lehrer 55.8
Newsweek 66.3
NPR Morning Edition 66.3
Time Magazine 65.4
U.S. News and World Report 65.8
USA Today 63.4
Wall Street Journal 85.1
Washington Post 66.6
Washington Times 35.4
It's similar to how the right over bleat out BBC bias - the more they bleat the more (some) people believe it. Can't think where I might have got that idea from.
lionelf said:
Though Groseclose and Milyo's paper has itself been criticised as has almost every other study on this subject.
Academic criticism or (to quote your own phrase) media liberals 'bleating'?If you have an alternative published paper with a different rank order please feel free to post with details, given that vaguely alluding to criticism is an easy option particularly when there's no supporting evidence. TIA as it would be an interesting read.
lionelf said:
BBC bias
. . .
bleat
. . .
Can't think where I might have got that idea from.
Free thinking (as opposed to beeb-like groupthinking) folks get it from the BBC senior staff acknowledging the BBC's left-liberal bias, and in particular from the left-liberal biased output.. . .
bleat
. . .
Can't think where I might have got that idea from.
Both my aunt and grandmother (and Great Aunt who was a US War Bride) married Americans and have lived in America for many years and life there boils down to one simple fact, it's a great place to live if you have money and are healthy.
Get sick, lose your money, it is an horrid existence.
I can remember on my first trip over there in the 80's seeing my Great Aunt choosing between buying food or getting her prescription and being shocked (and young). I thought everyone had access to health care like we do.
It is a wonderful place to visit but I would never wish to live there.
Get sick, lose your money, it is an horrid existence.
I can remember on my first trip over there in the 80's seeing my Great Aunt choosing between buying food or getting her prescription and being shocked (and young). I thought everyone had access to health care like we do.
It is a wonderful place to visit but I would never wish to live there.
Blue Cat said:
Get sick, lose your money, it is an horrid existence.
Being able to empathise, that's not good, to say the least.On the other hand, taking any personal or emotional angle out of the equation, what we have is get sick and it's less of a personal finance crisis because a lot of other people have already lost their money.
The dilution effect also dilutes the rest.
unrepentant said:
I live in the 12th most populous city in the USA and I never feel concerned or intimidated walking around the downtown at night. Brighton, not so much.
This city?http://lawstreetmedia.com/blogs/crime/crime-americ...
http://fox59.com/2015/12/21/homicides-on-the-rise-...
compared to
http://www.citizensreportuk.org/reports/murders-fa...
I have family who live in Georgia. Visited most parts of Atlanta. Travelled across all the Southern States. I've never once felt threatened, intimidated or anxious.
Go out at night and there's no gangs of drunken kids throwing up in the road or looking for a fight because you looked at them wrong.
The only downside is healthcare costs. But then my relatives don't wait eight months for a minor op either.
Go out at night and there's no gangs of drunken kids throwing up in the road or looking for a fight because you looked at them wrong.
The only downside is healthcare costs. But then my relatives don't wait eight months for a minor op either.
turbobloke said:
lionelf said:
Though Groseclose and Milyo's paper has itself been criticised as has almost every other study on this subject.
Academic criticism or (to quote your own phrase) media liberals 'bleating'?If you have an alternative published paper with a different rank order please feel free to post with details, given that vaguely alluding to criticism is an easy option particularly when there's no supporting evidence. TIA as it would be an interesting read.
(Oh and here's some criticism too.)
"The report (Tim Groseclose & Jeff Milyo's) also stated that the news media showed a fair degree of centrism, since all but one of the outlets studied were, from an ideological point of view, between the average Democrat and average Republican in Congress. In a blog post, Mark Liberman, professor of Computer Science and the Director of Linguistic Data Consortium at the University of Pennsylvania, critiqued the statistical model used in this study. The model used by Groseclose and Milyo assumed that conservative politicians do not care about the ideological position of think tanks they cite, while liberal politicians do. Liberman characterized the unsupported assumption as preposterous, and argued that it led to implausible conclusions."
As I said, G & M's paper has itself been criticised.
How the scale used was arrived at would be interesting. The wiki article quoted above only goes far as to hint that the centre position of the scale was taken to be where you might find the average member of Congress. I might argue that in the USA that centre point is somewhat more to the right than where we in the UK might deem it to be. They after all have nothing resembling a Labour party over there (bar the Blair years). There are also a myriad of books which likewise argue against a liberal leaning media in the US but I don't have the time or to be honest the enthusiasm to either list them or quote them. A few are mentioned in the wiki article though.
lionelf said:
turbobloke said:
lionelf said:
Though Groseclose and Milyo's paper has itself been criticised as has almost every other study on this subject.
Academic criticism or (to quote your own phrase) media liberals 'bleating'?If you have an alternative published paper with a different rank order please feel free to post with details, given that vaguely alluding to criticism is an easy option particularly when there's no supporting evidence. TIA as it would be an interesting read.
The member of the general public who wrote/edited that snip has either not read the paper or has a bad memory/biased motive.
scherzkeks said:
Heh. Yank here. I can assure you, we are indoctrinated from birth to believe America is the greatest nation on earth. If you live in the US, nothing exists externally beyond the point that it can be consumed.
I left long ago, and could provide a laundry list of reasons why life quality in most parts of Europe is much higher.
I'd be interested how you become 'indoctrinated'. Is this like singing the national enthem to the flag before school starts every day, one hand on the heart?I left long ago, and could provide a laundry list of reasons why life quality in most parts of Europe is much higher.
Also, please elaborate on your reasons why Europe is better and it's comparisons. Genuinely interested to know, thanks.
turbobloke said:
lionelf said:
turbobloke said:
lionelf said:
Though Groseclose and Milyo's paper has itself been criticised as has almost every other study on this subject.
Academic criticism or (to quote your own phrase) media liberals 'bleating'?If you have an alternative published paper with a different rank order please feel free to post with details, given that vaguely alluding to criticism is an easy option particularly when there's no supporting evidence. TIA as it would be an interesting read.
The member of the general public who wrote/edited that snip has either not read the paper or has a bad memory/biased motive.
lionelf said:
I'm sure there is evidence, wiki merely listed the sources, are you saying that the 'snip' is wrong? How so?
The bit about politicians caring. It's not recognisable in a re-read of the literature.The 'care' / caring isn't about politicians from one side or the other it's about media outlets caring or not whether the think tanks cited are have academic credibility rather than (say) a reputation for activism.
As the source of the authors' paper(s) isn't free-to-view, it's pay-to-view, I'm not in a position to quote from G & M - but I can summarise what the authors have said.
-the criticism received most frequently involved
journalists caring (or not) about the ‘quality’ of a think tank more than legislators do
-the issue being one of quality i.e. a reputation for serious scholarship rather than activism in think tanks
-also around a related claim that the liberal think tanks in the sample tended to be of higher quality
- when those factors were included as controls in the likelihood function, the estimated ratings did not change significantly
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