Families need more help with tackling childhood obesity?!

[KTF]

Speaking of porridge, does anyone have a tried and tested recipe to share as, on its own, (oats and milk) it just doesn't seem to taste of much even if it is good for you.

[Jockman]

WinstonWolf said:

I used to *think* my breakfast was healthy. Granola, yoghurt and juice. I weighed it all out and popped it in MPF. Bang, that's 1000 calories gone before you leave the house

Swapped to porridge and coffee and saved 600 calories a day and I'm never hungry before lunch. It's easy to get it wrong even when you're trying to be good

Crazy, isn't it. For Granola read Alpen !!!

Weigh night tonight at Fat Fighters....I need it to begin with a 12 for the first time in over 2 years

[WinstonWolf]

Jockman said:

WinstonWolf said:

I used to *think* my breakfast was healthy. Granola, yoghurt and juice. I weighed it all out and popped it in MPF. Bang, that's 1000 calories gone before you leave the house

Swapped to porridge and coffee and saved 600 calories a day and I'm never hungry before lunch. It's easy to get it wrong even when you're trying to be good

Crazy, isn't it. For Granola read Alpen !!!

Weigh night tonight at Fat Fighters....I need it to begin with a 12 for the first time in over 2 years

Yeah, same story with Alpen and I bloody love it It's a thimble of Alpen or 100g of porridge, unfortunately it's a no-brainer...

[Halb]

KTF said:

Speaking of porridge, does anyone have a tried and tested recipe to share as, on its own, (oats and milk) it just doesn't seem to taste of much even if it is good for you.

I love it on it's own.

For me a dash of honey is all that is required to make it sweet, but you could try whey powders? Not only do they add flavour, but they make is a balanced meal. I also like cinnamon and nutmeg in there. Or orange rind. Or raisins.

[WinstonWolf]

Halb said:

KTF said:

Speaking of porridge, does anyone have a tried and tested recipe to share as, on its own, (oats and milk) it just doesn't seem to taste of much even if it is good for you.

I love it on it's own.

For me a dash of honey is all that is required to make it sweet, but you could try whey powders? Not only do they add flavour, but they make is a balanced meal. I also like cinnamon and nutmeg in there. Or orange rind. Or raisins.

Yup, that's how I take mine too. It's a good vessel for other flavours.

[KTF]

WinstonWolf said:

Halb said:

KTF said:

Speaking of porridge, does anyone have a tried and tested recipe to share as, on its own, (oats and milk) it just doesn't seem to taste of much even if it is good for you.

I love it on it's own.

For me a dash of honey is all that is required to make it sweet, but you could try whey powders? Not only do they add flavour, but they make is a balanced meal. I also like cinnamon and nutmeg in there. Or orange rind. Or raisins.

Yup, that's how I take mine too. It's a good vessel for other flavours.

I have some honey kicking about in the cupboard so will stir some of that through it when I give it another shot tomorrow. There is probably some dried fruit way past its sell by date in the baking cupboard that needs using up as well

Whilst SiS Rego isnt really whey powder I think I will avoid adding some of that to the mix for the time being.

[yellowjack]

walm said:

yellowjack said:

So despite being coated in sugar, it's not really an unmitigated dietry disaster, until you multiply those figures by four (and a bit!)

It's only three (and a bit!).

You could probably squeeze in another bowl...

You are, of course, correct! Shame on me. Is there a mathematical equivalent of the 'Spelling Police' thread...?

[Mr Whippy]

yellowjack said:

walm said:

Mr Whippy said:

walm said:

otolith said:

Mr Whippy said:

If the tiny portion is 140 calories, and you need ~ 2500 calories a day, then I'm sure you can have a huge bowl for breakfast and be fine.

Yes, on the same basis you can have nine Mars bars for breakfast and be OK.

The point is that very many people systematically overeat. And we have an obesity problem. And we have cereal manufacturers quoting portion sizes that nobody understands to be a portion, not least because the adverts show a fking great bowl of it. That's the problem with trying to pin the problem on one factor - it's many factors. It's not the fizzy drink, or the oversized cereal portion, or the 190 calorie cups of coffee, or the bits of crisps or biscuits or chocolate between meals, or the take-out or lack of portion control or the pint or glass of wine - it's all of them, cumulatively.

Exactly.
If it is a bowl of cereal (with milk of course), a latte and a banana then you can get well over 500 calories very easily.

But if your RDA is around 2000 calories sat on your arse, then you've still got 3/4 of your RDA to go after a decent breakfast.

I don't get the issue?!

You were suggesting a "huge" bowl would be fine.
So let's bump it to what 7-800 calories for breakfast?

My breakfast this morning...


125 grams of Nestlé's finest Frosted Shreddies. (Some days I'll put even more into the bowl! )

Sugar coated so we're already on a sticky wicket health-wise. But go with me on this one...

Nestlé nutritional information
Per 40g serving with 125ml semi-skimmed milk:

Energy	207kcal
Fat	2.6g
of which saturates	1.3g
Carbohydrate	36g
of which sugars	17g
Fibre	4g
Protein	7.9g
Salt	0.39g

So despite being coated in sugar, it's not really an unmitigated dietry disaster, until you multiply those figures by four (and a bit!)

853kcal right there in that bowl! Near 11 grams of fat, and 70 grams of sugars too. (Un)helpfully, the box gives no percentages of RDA to compare with and I can't be bothered for the sake of this post.

This...



...though, is a measured 40 gram 'serving' of Frosted Shreddies. Definitely NOT what I'd describe as an 'adequate breakfast', although I'll admit I've perhaps gone too far t'other way.

As I've said already, I'm under no illusion that I'm overdoing it based on 'portion size' alone, but I do burn it off. That said, a 64 mile bike ride yesterday burned off only 1700 to 2200 extra calories (Strava v Garmin estimates). You have to exercise harder, and for longer than you think, to really shift extra calories,which is why I shun 'energy' drinks, gels and bars on the bike, in favour of regular cereal bars and 'no added sugar' squash.

Way too many myths about the need to "fuel" your exercise, and too many (even sensible, intelligent) folk are deluding themselves into believing that their portion size and calorie intake are under proper control. Too much access to too much nutritionally poor food, too little willpower, and too little exercise all combine in a perfect blend to encourage weight gain, and then modern life denies us the time and motivation to go out and do something about it...

Sad, but ultimately it's down to the individual to control what goes into the big hole under their nose. Although there does come a point,with real fatties where some mental health intervention would probably help with the willpower and self delusion. The medical solution though, is pretty simple, and it's that old 'energy in v energy out' equation, in the vast majority of cases, I'm afraid.

No added sugar = artificial sweetners = bad for your health in other ways. I'm amazed anyone with even the slightest of health considerations puts any of that crap near their mouths!

Why not just have fresh water if you don't want natural fruit sugars? Or just take a bit of fruit juice for a treat, and use water for pure rehydration?



Cereal? Sugar coated? Honestly?

Why not do the compare with rice crispies, cornflakes, or all-brand? Something not adulterated with all the crap that just pushes the results off into sillyness?



I'm baffled by people calorie counting but eating those kinds of foods to begin with. If you're serious about being healthy and losing weight, things like alcohol and sugar coated cereals have to become rare treats, not every day things... and I can guarantee that after a year of acting in that way, you'll enjoy the treats more when you do have them, and enjoy the healthier foods subtle flavours more too!

Dave

[walm]

Mr Whippy said:

I'm baffled by people calorie counting but eating those kinds of foods to begin with.

I am pretty sure yellowjack isn't calorie counting - other than possibly trying to make sure he has enough for long bike rides!!

[otolith]

Mr Whippy said:

No added sugar = artificial sweetners = bad for your health in other ways. I'm amazed anyone with even the slightest of health considerations puts any of that crap near their mouths!

What evidence is that belief based upon?

[Thankyou4calling]

Again, people are losing sight of the issue.

The Mr and Mrs Blobby types are not getting that way eating too much Alpen.

They have 3 sausage and egg Mcmuffins for breakfast, won't waste time with rabbit food.

Talking about grammes of sugar and portion sizes is daft, the fatties are lazy and ill disciplined, can you really see them picking up a box in Tesco and reading the label?

Not gonna happen. leave em to it.

[Mr Whippy]

otolith said:

Mr Whippy said:

No added sugar = artificial sweetners = bad for your health in other ways. I'm amazed anyone with even the slightest of health considerations puts any of that crap near their mouths!

What evidence is that belief based upon?

The mere suggestion that something that tastes like crap compared to natural sugars, and provides no nutritional benefit, might act like a depressant, and also act to upset the natural balance of gut bacteria, means it's off the list entirely for me.

Even if it were entirely safe, I question the logic of using it.



If you can't enjoy natural foods in moderation, just using artificial stuff so you can have an unhealthy appetite and approach to food isn't ideal.

You *should* be able to have full-fat, full-sugar, full-salt, everything. If you can't, you're having TOO MUCH!

[Halb]

Certain man-made sweeteners give my mum headaches, and I am not fond of the strange aftertaste of some, plus, they may cause the brain to think the body is consuming sugar, even if the cal content isn't there, so the insulin thing still happens.
I am not religiously intolerant of artificial sweeteners, but I do keep any eye that I don't consume too much...thinking about what I eat, they aren't a large part of my diet, but I do recall when I made an effort to remove them, it was most difficult, since even full sugar products will have them in.

[otolith]

The only real concern with them is that they can make people hungrier. But you have to look at what people will do if they avoid them. If you tell them to avoid artificially sweetened drinks because it will cause them to want to consume more calories afterwards, will they drink water? Or will they drink sugary drinks with more calories than they would otherwise have subsequently over-eaten by? The perfect is the enemy of the good.

[chris watton]

Halb said:

Certain man-made sweeteners give my mum headaches, and I am not fond of the strange aftertaste of some, plus, they may cause the brain to think the body is consuming sugar, even if the cal content isn't there, so the insulin thing still happens.

Yes, I have read this from several sources, too.

[yellowjack]

Mr Whippy said:

1. No added sugar = artificial sweetners = bad for your health in other ways. I'm amazed anyone with even the slightest of health considerations puts any of that crap near their mouths!

2. Why not just have fresh water if you don't want natural fruit sugars? Or just take a bit of fruit juice for a treat, and use water for pure rehydration?



3. Cereal? Sugar coated? Honestly?

4. Why not do the compare with rice crispies, cornflakes, or all-brand? Something not adulterated with all the crap that just pushes the results off into sillyness?



5. I'm baffled by people calorie counting but eating those kinds of foods to begin with. If you're serious about being healthy and losing weight, things like alcohol and sugar coated cereals have to become rare treats, not every day things... and I can guarantee that after a year of acting in that way, you'll enjoy the treats more when you do have them, and enjoy the healthier foods subtle flavours more too!

Dave

1. Everything is bad for your health. Ultimately, exposure to oxygen is doing you harm. No-one lives forever. After 25 years of random strangers trying to kill me, I'm lucky to have made it this far. Some friends and colleagues didn't. My stock response to "that stuff'll kill ya" types...

yellowjacks mantra said:

"A man's got to die of something. It might as well be something he enjoys"

...which applies to vegans, veggies, health Nazis, and anyone who questions my addiction to road cycling and mountain biking. I eat crap sometimes. I know I eat crap, and I know it won't do me much good. So I work hard to make sure I keep on top of exercising, which allows me to eat crap.

2. Plain fresh water? No thanks. The stuff that comes out of the tap at home doesn't really taste that good. And certainly not when it's been thoroughly warmed through in a bike bottle for four hours on a hot day. No, I'll be sticking to my squash, because it's what I like. (refer also to the "I know I eat crap sometimes" comment above). As for the thought, even, of warmed fruit juice? Bleugh!


3. Yes. Why not? I like it. I like the way that the Shreddies don't go soggy within seconds of the milk going on. But yes, I have to go past the granola, the porridge, and often Weetabix or Shredded Wheat to get to the sugary stuff. But sometimes (at the risk of repitition here) I just fancy eating crap.

4. Rice Krispies? Corn Flakes? Not particularly healthy cereals either, IMHO. All Bran? I eat it occasionally, but that tends to be at breakfast in hotels and such. Usually followed by a "two of everything" fry-up...
The comparison was done with Frosted Shreddies because it was what I had in my bowl when I got the scale out. It's an honest comparison too, because I poured a 'normal' bowl-full before I thought about weighing it.

5. As walm has correctly deduced, I'm not big on calorie counting. I'm not great at portion control neither. Yet my BMI is 26.0 (slightly inside 'overweight') and my body fat is around 20% - closer to 'excellent' than 'good' on accepted scales. I neither train nor eat like an Olympic athlete (although I'm partial to an Olympic Breakfast ) but I'm more than happy with my body shape and my general health. As I've said elsewhere, without getting massively neurotic about calories and portion sizes I'm generally losing weight. I'll never again see my 'fighting weight' from my boxing and judo days, but nor do I want to as I was all ribs back then. I'll happily carry on as I am, thanks, and if some day I weigh in at less than 70kg I'll have a massive blow-out on ribs and wings. The thing that really helps in not gaining weight is not being at all bothered about alcohol. I'm the only driver in the household, and have long fallen out of the habit of drinking beer and suchlike. This weekend at Reading Festival I'll let what's left of my hair down, and that'll account for probably a third of my annual alcohol intake, but at no point will I be 'drunk'. At my health check in the GP surgery last year my answer to "how many units do you drink per week?" honestly was "I had a pint of cider about three weeks ago". I'm no temperance evangelist, and when I do drink I enjoy it. I'm just "not that bothered" is all.


I understand where you are coming from, I really do. But you're not so much preaching to the converted as preaching to the inconvertible. I eat and drink pretty much whatever I want to, whenever I want to. I'm aware of what I'm eating, but not obsessed about it. Plenty of veg and fruit goes in as snacks, but if I so desire I can demolish a packet of biscuits pretty swiftly. But my wife's birthday was in July and there are biscuits still in the cupboard that were intended for her 'birthday tea'. This Easter I was described by my youngest son as "the only man on planet earth who is eating last year's Lindt Gold Bunny after this Easter has finished". Something will do for me in the end, whether it be the number nine bus or a nasty cancer, but I'm determined not to exit this life as a miserable food fascist.

*yesterday I rode 30 miles, at 16.2mph average. Garmin estimates 1,066 calories used, Strava suggests 1,003. Either way, I stand by my assertion that a lot of even active people overestimate their energy output and underestimate their calorie intake, and the sooner society generally accepts that, the sooner people might stop gaining weight (despite running, and gym memberships) and actually start shifting it. An average of 11 hours of exercise per week over the last four weeks for me.

[walm]

Mr Whippy said:

...and also act to upset the natural balance of gut bacteria, means it's off the list entirely for me.

Well if curry is off the menu, then count me out.

Also - Coke Zero tastes nice.

[otolith]

Thankyou4calling said:

Again, people are losing sight of the issue.

The Mr and Mrs Blobby types are not getting that way eating too much Alpen.

They have 3 sausage and egg Mcmuffins for breakfast, won't waste time with rabbit food.

Talking about grammes of sugar and portion sizes is daft, the fatties are lazy and ill disciplined, can you really see them picking up a box in Tesco and reading the label?

Not gonna happen. leave em to it.

While there are people conforming to that stereotype (who probably can't be helped), the problem of obesity is wider than that. In the UK we're talking about 65% of men and 58% of women. Most adults in the UK are overweight. It's not a problem confined to the underclass.

[yellowjack]

walm said:

Well if curry is off the menu, then count me out.

Also - Coke Zero tastes nice.

Bleugh!

Pepsi Max is where it's at!

[yellowjack]

otolith said:

While there are people conforming to that stereotype (who probably can't be helped), the problem of obesity is wider than that. In the UK we're talking about 65% of men and 58% of women. Most adults in the UK are overweight. It's not a problem confined to the underclass.

Sadly, going on BMI alone, I'm one of that 65% of men classed as 'overweight'. Only one 'BMI point' over, but numbers is numbers, and they do not lie...