Kid criticised for trying to look like his hero

[ZedLeg]

BJG1 said:

ZedLeg said:

The blacking up in the movie was racist, that joke was about Hollywood always casting white actors in films regardless of the character's race which is also racist. Blacking up is racist, but that's not the same as saying the people in this story are racist. I'd hope they were just a bit misguided as I said.

I'm confused. Do you think it was unacceptable for RDJ to black up in Tropic Thunder?

Yeah, I thought it was a pretty poor and misguided attempt at satire in a not particularly funny film.

[ZedLeg]

wombat172a said:

ZedLeg said:

Nonsense, just pretending that racism isn't a thing anymore isn't going to fix anything. If it were my kid I'd explain why blackface isn't acceptable and move on.

There are good reasons why something aren't socially acceptable, teaching kids what those things are and why is part of a parents job.

How though? What's the non-racist way of saying "You're white kid, your hero is black, so you can't dress up like him as it will upset other people"?

I'm not saying the kid can't dress like the player. How often do you physically change the colour of your skin when you're getting dressed?

[BJG1]

ZedLeg said:

Yeah, I thought it was a pretty poor and misguided attempt at satire in a not particularly funny film.

Ok cool, at least you're consistent!

I think only the intention matters and not doing something because people used to do similar to be racist is a bit silly.

[wombat172a]

ZedLeg said:

wombat172a said:

ZedLeg said:

Nonsense, just pretending that racism isn't a thing anymore isn't going to fix anything. If it were my kid I'd explain why blackface isn't acceptable and move on.

There are good reasons why something aren't socially acceptable, teaching kids what those things are and why is part of a parents job.

How though? What's the non-racist way of saying "You're white kid, your hero is black, so you can't dress up like him as it will upset other people"?

I'm not saying the kid can't dress like the player. How often do you physically change the colour of your skin when you're getting dressed?

Well never, and it's been a long time since I was a kid, but if the kid wanted to change his hair style then that's okay, but it's not okay to change his skin "style". It's got to be a confusing thing to explain.

[TeamD]

ZedLeg said:

I'm not saying the kid can't dress like the player. How often do you physically change the colour of your skin when you're getting dressed?

It seems that most women do it at least once a day?

[InductionRoar]

Was Michael Jackson racist for changing his skin colour?

[TeamD]

wombat172a said:

Well never, and it's been a long time since I was a kid, but if the kid wanted to change his hair style then that's okay, but it's not okay to change his skin "style". It's got to be a confusing thing to explain.

Tell that to Michael Jackson!

Oh! Wait a minute

[ZedLeg]

InductionRoar said:

Was Michael Jackson racist for changing his skin colour?

On the off chance that you're not being facetious. There are lots of non white people who feel like they have to change their features to look more Caucasian due to negative connotations of their own race. It has been suggested that Micheal Jackson suffered with this. See also Asian people that have surgery on their eyes to look more western.

[TeamD]

ZedLeg said:

On the off chance that you're not being facetious. There are lots of non white people who feel like they have to change their features to look more Caucasian due to negative connotations of their own race. It has been suggested that Micheal Jackson suffered with this. See also Asian people that have surgery on their eyes to look more western.

Whoa there hoss! Many Asian people is South-East Asian countries try to avoid having darker skin, not merely because of the point of view that you express...in fact, primarily because as a nation themselves they perceive those with darker skin to be lower class, try telling them that they're being racist when they are the same race.

And are we going to take this as far as saying that white people can't have dreadlocks? Good luck with that one.

[youngsyr]

ZedLeg said:

youngsyr said:

ZedLeg said:

youngsyr said:

ZedLeg said:

Seriously, you guys are defending blacking up?

It's pretty misguided of the mother to think it's acceptable.

What's unacceptable about it?

I'm genuinely at a loss to understand what people are getting upset about, perhaps you could explain?

It's historically been used to ridicule and humiliate people of colour. While in this instance it has been used to try and pay tribute, that doesn't take away the negative connotation.

Do you think that if he'd worn the strip and the wig with out blacking up, people would've mistaken the kid for all the white dreadlocked players on the team?

I'm not saying the mum is a racist but it shows pretty poor judgement.

That's stretching the comparison way too far, IMO. I'd see your point if he'd been made up as a minstrel, but he hadn't - he'd just darkened his skin and put a wig on to look more like his idol.

Do you think that Robert Downey Jr was being racist in Tropic Thunder?



Might be worth pointing out that he was nominated for an Oscar for his performance.

Yes he was, that was the joke.

Nope. Try again, his character was being racist, the actor himself was not - hence the Oscar nomination.

This is the problem with the professionally offended, they interpret every situation through a distorted lens - they only ever see superficial links between innocent situations and the worst possible historic comparison. Hence the existence of Godwin's law, I guess.

[InductionRoar]

ZedLeg said:

InductionRoar said:

Was Michael Jackson racist for changing his skin colour?

On the off chance that you're not being facetious. There are lots of non white people who feel like they have to change their features to look more Caucasian due to negative connotations of their own race. It has been suggested that Micheal Jackson suffered with this. See also Asian people that have surgery on their eyes to look more western.

Double standards are the mark of any form of supposed prejudices.

Black to white - justifiable due to negative connotations
White to black - Racist

[daddy cool]

Nothing much to add, except some Peep Show to ease the tension a bit.
NSFW, natch.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yAOpjHCaLA4

[ZedLeg]

I never said it was the only reason people would change their appearance.

Some would say that white people wearing dreadlocks is cultural appropriation. We're getting into murkier waters when we start talking about that. We all know how the Internet can't stand a non binary argument .

[dandarez]

How large is the 'offended peoples' movement' now?

It seems to grow day by day, if not the hour, then by the minute!

I see a cop posted a innocent message with a selfie today showing the tailback on the M5 and yeah, you guessed it, one of the 'offended' peoples' movement immediately took to twitter to respond.

Cop simply tweeted and I quote:
'Sorry guys and girls, someone threatening to jump off bridge, but now off and traffic moving. Take time to clear.'
Ok, the cop got himself in the pic with the tailback to illustrate his point. He didn't have a big grin on his face, he was serious.

What got my goat is where he went wrong was he apologised to this complaining dick for any 'offence' caused!

http://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/police-office...

What a f. sad world we are now living in.

[ZedLeg]

youngsyr said:

ZedLeg said:

youngsyr said:

ZedLeg said:

youngsyr said:

ZedLeg said:

Seriously, you guys are defending blacking up?

It's pretty misguided of the mother to think it's acceptable.

What's unacceptable about it?

I'm genuinely at a loss to understand what people are getting upset about, perhaps you could explain?

It's historically been used to ridicule and humiliate people of colour. While in this instance it has been used to try and pay tribute, that doesn't take away the negative connotation.

Do you think that if he'd worn the strip and the wig with out blacking up, people would've mistaken the kid for all the white dreadlocked players on the team?

I'm not saying the mum is a racist but it shows pretty poor judgement.

That's stretching the comparison way too far, IMO. I'd see your point if he'd been made up as a minstrel, but he hadn't - he'd just darkened his skin and put a wig on to look more like his idol.

Do you think that Robert Downey Jr was being racist in Tropic Thunder?



Might be worth pointing out that he was nominated for an Oscar for his performance.

Yes he was, that was the joke.

Nope. Try again, his character was being racist, the actor himself was not - hence the Oscar nomination.

This is the problem with the professionally offended, they interpret every situation through a distorted lens - they only ever see superficial links between innocent situations and the worst possible historic comparison. Hence the existence of Godwin's law, I guess.

Your question was poorly phrased.

at professionally offended. As I said I'm not offended or even surprised by the reaction in this thread. People can do what they like. I was just commenting on my bemusement and then answering the increasingly preposterous questions that have been asked. Carry on.

[youngsyr]

ZedLeg said:

InductionRoar said:

Was Michael Jackson racist for changing his skin colour?

On the off chance that you're not being facetious. There are lots of non white people who feel like they have to change their features to look more Caucasian due to negative connotations of their own race. It has been suggested that Micheal Jackson suffered with this. See also Asian people that have surgery on their eyes to look more western.

Well, this is absolute BS as well - you do realise that the tanning industry is worth tens of millions of pounds a year in the UK alone? Do white people also feel the need to darken their skin due to negative connotations of their race, or are you saying that white people are different to black people (which is a racist claim in itself!)?

Simple fact is that "normal" is not considered beautiful in most cultures, hence Chinese women avoiding the sun to remain as pale as possible and droves of Brits heading to the Med every summer to get a tan.

[TeamD]

Look, I don't think any of us disagree that "blackface" as it is traditionally known is offensive to certain people. To the point in fact that "minstrels" (not the chocolate sort before anyone gets clever) type use of that form of makeup reinforced a negative stereotypical image of that group as a whole, Yes? With me so far?

My argument was that said kid wasn't in "blackface" because he was specifically imitating a single person whom he holds in high esteem. There was no stereotype. There was no negativity. There was no racism.

I rest my case m'lud

[youngsyr]

ZedLeg said:

youngsyr said:

ZedLeg said:

youngsyr said:

ZedLeg said:

youngsyr said:

ZedLeg said:

Seriously, you guys are defending blacking up?

It's pretty misguided of the mother to think it's acceptable.

What's unacceptable about it?

I'm genuinely at a loss to understand what people are getting upset about, perhaps you could explain?

It's historically been used to ridicule and humiliate people of colour. While in this instance it has been used to try and pay tribute, that doesn't take away the negative connotation.

Do you think that if he'd worn the strip and the wig with out blacking up, people would've mistaken the kid for all the white dreadlocked players on the team?

I'm not saying the mum is a racist but it shows pretty poor judgement.

That's stretching the comparison way too far, IMO. I'd see your point if he'd been made up as a minstrel, but he hadn't - he'd just darkened his skin and put a wig on to look more like his idol.

Do you think that Robert Downey Jr was being racist in Tropic Thunder?



Might be worth pointing out that he was nominated for an Oscar for his performance.

Yes he was, that was the joke.

Nope. Try again, his character was being racist, the actor himself was not - hence the Oscar nomination.

This is the problem with the professionally offended, they interpret every situation through a distorted lens - they only ever see superficial links between innocent situations and the worst possible historic comparison. Hence the existence of Godwin's law, I guess.

Your question was poorly phrased.

at professionally offended. As I said I'm not offended or even surprised by the reaction in this thread. People can do what they like. I was just commenting on my bemusement and then answering the increasingly preposterous questions that have been asked. Carry on.

Or, you are blind to the intent behind an act and immediately cry "racist!".

I even gave you the hint that he was Oscar nominated for it, so had been given approval by a community that is exceptional sensitive to the issue.

[dandarez]

In response to the white kid wanting to look like his hero.

I bet you if his mum had dressed him head to toe like his hero, with the dreadlocks etc, exactly as he went, but had not used any face paint, ie: so he went as his hero but 'white', the 'offended' would still have rushed to twitter to be 'offended' because his hero is not 'white'.

[bstb3]

TeamD said:

Look, I don't think any of us disagree that "blackface" as it is traditionally known is offensive to certain people. To the point in fact that "minstrels" (not the chocolate sort before anyone gets clever) type use of that form of makeup reinforced a negative stereotypical image of that group as a whole, Yes? With me so far?

My argument was that said kid wasn't in "blackface" because he was specifically imitating a single person whom he holds in high esteem. There was no stereotype. There was no negativity. There was no racism.

I rest my case m'lud

But it's back to the context again - anyone in full view of the facts wouldn't regard the intention as racist at all, from either the child or parent.

Problem came once it went on social media where people can see it without bothering to get the context first, then the 'outrage' starts. I think it was stated above the big problem here isn't really the colour, it's more the lack of smarts about posting it onto social media in the current climate we live in where there is always someone just itching to take offense. That's where the damage was caused imo.