Deutsche Bank - They think its all over.....
Discussion
El stovey said:
I've gone to the pub in exmouth Devon where the American bloke makes millions trading (as it was one of the only places he could get wifi) always makes me smile think of him trading in background. It's very different to the one in the film though.
It must have been strange for everyone involved one way or another. Seems unbelievable what happened.Thanks for the book suggestions everyone
sidicks said:
BigLion said:
I feel sorry for that indian guy who was placing large orders and then cancelling them etc.
You feel sorry for the guy who was illegally manipulating the market? Why?BigLion said:
Definition of Illegal and manipulation are very much treated as areas of grey when it comes to making money from the markets...funny how so many white traders who contributed to the credit crunch through blatant manipulation never even got prosecuted...
Who are you referring to?Sway said:
Whilst it's illegal in the UK, I didn't think it was in the US?
Huh? It's the yanks who are after him not us. He was trading eminis on the CME so it's their gig, nothing to do with the UK. Fwiw whatever exchange rule he is supposed to have broken is neither here nor there. The cftc/sec are under huge pressure to explain the flash crash and IMO he's being stitched up so the regulators don't have to admit they have absolutely no clue how all these hft algos interact... they can't admit to ghosts in the machine.Edited by anonymous-user on Wednesday 22 March 01:04
fblm said:
Sway said:
Whilst it's illegal in the UK, I didn't think it was in the US?
Huh? It's the yanks who are after him not us. He was trading eminis on the CME so it's their gig, nothing to do with the UK. Fwiw whatever exchange rule he is supposed to have broken is neither here nor there. The cftc/sec are under huge pressure to explain the flash crash and IMO he's being stitched up so the regulators don't have to admit they have absolutely no clue how all these hft algos interact... they can't admit to ghosts in the machine.Edited by fblm on Wednesday 22 March 01:04
That of course, as you say, won't stop them stitching him right up to paper over the cracks that a kid living with his mum under the flightpath of Heathrow caused such big issues.
RicharDC5 said:
El stovey said:
I've gone to the pub in exmouth Devon where the American bloke makes millions trading (as it was one of the only places he could get wifi) always makes me smile think of him trading in background. It's very different to the one in the film though.
It must have been strange for everyone involved one way or another. Seems unbelievable what happened.Thanks for the book suggestions everyone
fblm said:
Sway said:
Whilst it's illegal in the UK, I didn't think it was in the US?
Huh? It's the yanks who are after him not us. He was trading eminis on the CME so it's their gig, nothing to do with the UK. Fwiw whatever exchange rule he is supposed to have broken is neither here nor there. The cftc/sec are under huge pressure to explain the flash crash and IMO he's being stitched up so the regulators don't have to admit they have absolutely no clue how all these hft algos interact... they can't admit to ghosts in the machine.Edited by fblm on Wednesday 22 March 01:04
Again, I agree.
However film's opening position was that he's (the Hounslow lad) had been illegally manipulating the markets.
Whilst he'd undoubtedly manipulated the market for personal gain, I'm not aware of any of any US law against it. On that basis, his actions weren't illegal.
Soros is almost reveredbl by some for his manipulation of the GBP market which made him a billion. Just as big or bigger sorry term impact, yet no extradition or trial.
As I think fblm posted, the fact there was no law against it won't stop the US from bending him over and loosening up his sphincter with a baseball bat in order to prep him for Bubba in whatever supermax they end up losing him in...
However film's opening position was that he's (the Hounslow lad) had been illegally manipulating the markets.
Whilst he'd undoubtedly manipulated the market for personal gain, I'm not aware of any of any US law against it. On that basis, his actions weren't illegal.
Soros is almost reveredbl by some for his manipulation of the GBP market which made him a billion. Just as big or bigger sorry term impact, yet no extradition or trial.
As I think fblm posted, the fact there was no law against it won't stop the US from bending him over and loosening up his sphincter with a baseball bat in order to prep him for Bubba in whatever supermax they end up losing him in...
Sway said:
fblm said:
Sway said:
Whilst it's illegal in the UK, I didn't think it was in the US?
Huh? It's the yanks who are after him not us. He was trading eminis on the CME so it's their gig, nothing to do with the UK. Fwiw whatever exchange rule he is supposed to have broken is neither here nor there. The cftc/sec are under huge pressure to explain the flash crash and IMO he's being stitched up so the regulators don't have to admit they have absolutely no clue how all these hft algos interact... they can't admit to ghosts in the machine.Edited by fblm on Wednesday 22 March 01:04
That of course, as you say, won't stop them stitching him right up to paper over the cracks that a kid living with his mum under the flightpath of Heathrow caused such big issues.
Its called spoofing the market when you are bidding or offering with intent to cancel before execution, this is an illegal act now.
So if done more than 7 years ago, maybe it is inadmissable, but back then a lot of the crap people got up to was demeeded ok, but now is completely illegal under regulations.
Du1point8 said:
The actual act he has broken is the 2010 Dodd-Frank Act.
Its called spoofing the market when you are bidding or offering with intent to cancel before execution, this is an illegal act now.
So if done more than 7 years ago, maybe it is inadmissable, but back then a lot of the crap people got up to was demeeded ok, but now is completely illegal under regulations.
So the "flash crash" was April 2010, Dodd-Frank signed in July 2010...Its called spoofing the market when you are bidding or offering with intent to cancel before execution, this is an illegal act now.
So if done more than 7 years ago, maybe it is inadmissable, but back then a lot of the crap people got up to was demeeded ok, but now is completely illegal under regulations.
Completely agree that it shouldn't have been legal, however f
king the person with a retrospective law is not fixing the issue, merely permitting lax legislators to cover thier failures.Anyways, all off topic so apologies for derail.
Sway said:
Du1point8 said:
The actual act he has broken is the 2010 Dodd-Frank Act.
Its called spoofing the market when you are bidding or offering with intent to cancel before execution, this is an illegal act now.
So if done more than 7 years ago, maybe it is inadmissable, but back then a lot of the crap people got up to was demeeded ok, but now is completely illegal under regulations.
So the "flash crash" was April 2010, Dodd-Frank signed in July 2010...Its called spoofing the market when you are bidding or offering with intent to cancel before execution, this is an illegal act now.
So if done more than 7 years ago, maybe it is inadmissable, but back then a lot of the crap people got up to was demeeded ok, but now is completely illegal under regulations.
Completely agree that it shouldn't have been legal, however f
king the person with a retrospective law is not fixing the issue, merely permitting lax legislators to cover thier failures.Anyways, all off topic so apologies for derail.
All change at Deutsche Bank.
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/07/07/business/deutsc...
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2019/07/07/de...
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/07/07/business/deutsc...
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2019/07/07/de...
And to cut 18k jobs, globally.
Its likely that NYC and London will bare the brunt of these reductions as Investment Banking hubs for the firm.
Not great news for London, which is facing an existential threat to its status as a world financial centre - given indecision over Brexit and marxist threat. But also regional hubs such as Birmmingham which will also likely be hit, hard.
Deutsche bank woes, are not unique. Globally we are massively over banked, and costs are spiralling. Regulatory change is starting to really bite hard, we have a low growth global economy, expectations of more central bank easing AND a debt crisis in the Eurozone no one knows how to resolve.... banking job prospects look pretty bleak in the short run (unless you are in AI / robotics)...
Its likely that NYC and London will bare the brunt of these reductions as Investment Banking hubs for the firm.
Not great news for London, which is facing an existential threat to its status as a world financial centre - given indecision over Brexit and marxist threat. But also regional hubs such as Birmmingham which will also likely be hit, hard.
Deutsche bank woes, are not unique. Globally we are massively over banked, and costs are spiralling. Regulatory change is starting to really bite hard, we have a low growth global economy, expectations of more central bank easing AND a debt crisis in the Eurozone no one knows how to resolve.... banking job prospects look pretty bleak in the short run (unless you are in AI / robotics)...
stongle said:
Deutsche bank woes, are not unique. Globally we are massively over banked, and costs are spiralling. Regulatory change is starting to really bite hard, we have a low growth global economy, expectations of more central bank easing AND a debt crisis in the Eurozone no one knows how to resolve.... banking job prospects look pretty bleak in the short run (unless you are in AI / robotics)...
It's a strange dissonance with many private and business customer's experience with using retail banks.In general, for the most part, the service is so poor any decently organised outfit could run a coach and horses through the competition, but they all seem hell bent on chasing each other down the low-quality offshore interface route.
I can see that costs mean consumers would have to 'pay' for better levels of service, but what is going on right now looks distinctly like a lemming race to the bottom.
What makes the Deutsche problem so much more worrying is that the collateral requirements for EU banks are view with such scepticism. One wonders who will crumble next and what the repurcusions might be.
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