Could UK U-turn on Referendum Result (Vol 2)
Discussion
B'stard Child said:
bmw535i said:
Murph7355 said:
You should have listened to yourself 
Beginning of the end - I tell ya!!!!
'You know who' will be along before long. Quite surprised he hasn't been involved in this recent few pages regarding immigration- it's his favourite subject. He'll be very upset to see the conclusion was that leaving the EU will enable us to control immigration.
bmw535i said:
B'stard Child said:
bmw535i said:
Murph7355 said:
You should have listened to yourself
Beginning of the end - I tell ya!!!!
'You know who' will be along before long. Quite surprised he hasn't been involved in this recent few pages regarding immigration- it's his favourite subject. He'll be very upset to see the conclusion was that leaving the EU will enable us to control immigration.
bmw535i said:
SilverSixer said:
Your conclusion, maybe.
Well yes unless your definition of control is increasing numbers 
Don't tell me. We haven't left yet, right? Well, yes. Apply that one to the rest of the brexit economic argument while you're at it, you know that one saying that everything's economically fine still after the vote. I'm sure that's one of your favourites.
SilverSixer said:
B'stard Child said:
bmw535i said:
don'tbesilly said:
Yes I saw that it was great wasn't it.
Is that the best one in your opinion?
It's a similar joke to the one I read recently, does this ring any bells?
A Guy who in order to pay the private school fees and the mortgage, had taken to making jam in the kitchen at home,the home business started to fail so he diversified into making chutney.
The same Guy complained about his tracksuited chav infested neighbourhood, complained the vote to leave would result in his job being lost, it then transpired the same Guy owned 2 properties in Europe.
You hear and see some crazy stuff written on here,some is true, some you couldn't make up, some is made up to make a point, it's always so easy to spot the Billy B*llsh*tters too.
By the way, can you afford Netflix?
Or do you just chill?
ks until his nurse takes his laptop away? Perhaps it's just envy. The politics of envy. Yes, that must be it.The kids are at the local comprehensive with the chavs?
You don't have a mortgage, and really live in a council block with the chavy parents of the chavy kids who share the classroom with your kids?
The jam business didn't fail, but you changed to chutney anyway?
You never lost your job and it wasn't ever under threat?
The two properties in Europe are a fairy tale?
The hackneyed b*llocks you mention.
It was you that mentioned the b*llocks in the first place, if you talk b*llocks don't start wingeing when you get called out on the b*llocks and lies you spout.
By the way, it's not a nurse it's a matron, you know the one, you must have seen the meme dozens of times!
SilverSixer said:
bmw535i said:
SilverSixer said:
Your conclusion, maybe.
Well yes unless your definition of control is increasing numbers Don't tell me. We haven't left yet, right? Well, yes. Apply that one to the rest of the brexit economic argument while you're at it, you know that one saying that everything's economically fine still after the vote. I'm sure that's one of your favourites.
SilverSixer said:
Numbers which are increasing still despite brexit.
Don't tell me. We haven't left yet, right? Well, yes. Apply that one to the rest of the brexit economic argument while you're at it, you know that one saying that everything's economically fine still after the vote. I'm sure that's one of your favourites.
In attempting to be the one who types this for the millionth time, the eco-doom prophesied by some of the most erudite and good looking on the Remain side (which obviously sets them above all mortals) was predicted to kick in immediately after a vote to leave. Don't tell me. We haven't left yet, right? Well, yes. Apply that one to the rest of the brexit economic argument while you're at it, you know that one saying that everything's economically fine still after the vote. I'm sure that's one of your favourites.
It didn't. The protagonists were no doubt too busy changing bedclothes to implement an emergency budget or dump their housing stocks...
SilverSixer said:
Deptford Draylons said:
SilverSixer said:
Deptford Draylons said:
You've just acknowledged that everything the government said and put out as official Remain campaigning was utterly false in what the referendum meant and was about.........I'd love to believe you were ahead of the game and saw this was a meaningless advisory referendum and said as such on PH, but given you can't post anything to support that, excuse me if I call b
ks on that one .....I've acknowledged no such thing, I've merely acknowledged there were some misleading arguments put forward by Remain, in so far as the crystal ball was a bit cloudy. Most of the economic woe stuff was handled by Mark Carney after the vote, so it didn't transpire. Yet. it's waiting for us if we stay on the hard brexit road though, even David Davis knows this.
I'm sorry you feel the need to call b
ks, and I haven't the time or inclination to search PH for a supporting comment, but that was my position before the referendum whether I wrote it on this wholly irrelevant discussion forum or not. It's no the only universe I inhabit and I'm not compelled to share everything at all times via this medium. I think I did post on here on this topic, maybe not. It's an infinite universe, anything's possible. Ho hum, I can't be arsed to investigate either way. If you want to read every single post I've ever made on here to find proof to call me wrong, good luck to you and I'll own up if you strike gold. You can take that or leave it, if you choose to leave it it's water off a duck's back to me.I don't not only recall no one on PH saying, but no one in the media either. Who seriously suggested the referendum was basically an opinion poll to parliament ?
You can't find anything to back up your own retrospective view, so maybe its easier to find examples of where anyone was saying this ?
Take for example the Tim Farron bulls
t claim about not voting on the single market and people had no idea that was included. Many people took seconds to post links to videos showing people on both sides say we'd be out. The official £9m government referendum position leaflet to us too. This is simple evidence that backs up this claim that Farron and you talk from your bottom.Given how simple the above is, you must be able to find something, even from someone else to back this up. I think I would have remembered anyone in the media at all saying this was non binding and basically just one big giant polling event to give an advisory opinion to the pro House of Commons.
I guess pushing you on several answers at once is taxing you, so I'll help you out and drop the questions on why the big red bus lie was worse than what the PM, government and official leaflets stated what would happen on Brexit day.
bmw535i said:
SilverSixer said:
bmw535i said:
SilverSixer said:
Your conclusion, maybe.
Well yes unless your definition of control is increasing numbers Don't tell me. We haven't left yet, right? Well, yes. Apply that one to the rest of the brexit economic argument while you're at it, you know that one saying that everything's economically fine still after the vote. I'm sure that's one of your favourites.
jsf said:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JRowLjb0x48
full video and text https://www.gov.uk/government/speeches/prime-minis...
Yeah, that sounds quite clear and start a choice, but SilverSixer had told everyone on PH this was to be discounted and that this was none of the above, but just an advisory referendum so we could simply indicate our preference to parliament and let them decide what was best. Apparently he and other he said this as well as the media, it was widely know. full video and text https://www.gov.uk/government/speeches/prime-minis...
Cameron said:
Whether we could be successful outside the European Union – that’s not the question.
The question is whether we would be more successful in than out?
Whether being in the European Union adds to our economic security or detracts from it?
Whether being in the European Union makes us safer or less safe?
That is a matter of judgment.
And ultimately it will be the judgment of the British people in the referendum that I promised and that I will deliver.
You will have to judge what is best for you and your family, for your children and grandchildren, for our country, for our future.
It will be your decision whether to remain in the EU on the basis of the reforms we secure, or whether we leave.
Your decision.
Nobody else’s.
Not politicians’.
Not Parliament’s.
Not lobby groups’.
Not mine.
Just you.
You, the British people, will decide.
At that moment, you will hold this country’s destiny in your hands.
This is a huge decision for our country, perhaps the biggest we will make in our lifetimes.
And it will be the final decision.
So to those who suggest that a decision in the referendum to leave…
…would merely produce another stronger renegotiation and then a second referendum in which Britain would stay…
…I say think again.
The renegotiation is happening right now. And the referendum that follows will be a once in a generation choice.
An in or out referendum.
When the British people speak, their voice will be respected – not ignored.
If we vote to leave, then we will leave.
There will not be another renegotiation and another referendum.
So I say to my European counterparts with whom I am negotiating.
This is our only chance to get this right – for Britain and for the whole European Union.
I say to those who are thinking about voting to leave.
Think very carefully, because this choice cannot be undone.
And to those who are campaigning to leave but actually hoping for a second referendum – I say decide what you believe in.
If you think we should leave – and leave means leave – then campaign for that and vote for it.
But if you are actually arguing for a better relationship between Britain and the European Union, then don’t campaign to get out.
Work with me to get that better deal for Britain.
The question is whether we would be more successful in than out?
Whether being in the European Union adds to our economic security or detracts from it?
Whether being in the European Union makes us safer or less safe?
That is a matter of judgment.
And ultimately it will be the judgment of the British people in the referendum that I promised and that I will deliver.
You will have to judge what is best for you and your family, for your children and grandchildren, for our country, for our future.
It will be your decision whether to remain in the EU on the basis of the reforms we secure, or whether we leave.
Your decision.
Nobody else’s.
Not politicians’.
Not Parliament’s.
Not lobby groups’.
Not mine.
Just you.
You, the British people, will decide.
At that moment, you will hold this country’s destiny in your hands.
This is a huge decision for our country, perhaps the biggest we will make in our lifetimes.
And it will be the final decision.
So to those who suggest that a decision in the referendum to leave…
…would merely produce another stronger renegotiation and then a second referendum in which Britain would stay…
…I say think again.
The renegotiation is happening right now. And the referendum that follows will be a once in a generation choice.
An in or out referendum.
When the British people speak, their voice will be respected – not ignored.
If we vote to leave, then we will leave.
There will not be another renegotiation and another referendum.
So I say to my European counterparts with whom I am negotiating.
This is our only chance to get this right – for Britain and for the whole European Union.
I say to those who are thinking about voting to leave.
Think very carefully, because this choice cannot be undone.
And to those who are campaigning to leave but actually hoping for a second referendum – I say decide what you believe in.
If you think we should leave – and leave means leave – then campaign for that and vote for it.
But if you are actually arguing for a better relationship between Britain and the European Union, then don’t campaign to get out.
Work with me to get that better deal for Britain.
Edited by jsf on Friday 2nd December 12:12
The SilverSixer comedy roadshow rolls on to another page of PH comedy history.
jonnyb said:
Unfortunately they didn't, so where's the end game? Put up with mass immigration, watch the country go bust or face huge, and I mean HUGE cuts to our standard of living.
Take your pick.
People have already had cuts to their standard of living due to mass immigration into the U.K. Take your pick.
Allowing large amounts of low-skilled people into the country, all competing for the same resources is not a sound, long-term strategy.
The end-game is that due to the coming effects of mass automation and A.I, we are heading for a shift in the way the whole system works, employment types, taxation and government spending. We will see mass long term un-employment, the likes of which have not been seen since the late 70's and capitalism will re-invent itself. Forget minimum wage, we are heading for a basic wage, for millions of people, to be paid for by changes in the corporate taxation system.
I feel the majority of the people who are about to be affected by this (next 10-15 years) can't see it coming and are not planning for it.
Deptford Draylons said:
Yeah, that sounds quite clear and start a choice, but SilverSixer had told everyone on PH this was to be discounted and that this was none of the above, but just an advisory referendum so we could simply indicate our preference to parliament and let them decide what was best. Apparently he and other he said this as well as the media, it was widely know.
The SilverSixer comedy roadshow rolls on to another page of PH comedy history.
(a) It was - legally - an advisory and only an advisory referendum. If you didn't know that, well, that's a shame, but as the saying goes, ignorance is no defence.The SilverSixer comedy roadshow rolls on to another page of PH comedy history.
(b) Cameron is not the PM. May is. She calls the shots now, not Cameron.
(c) We're going to leave the EU. We may or may not leave the Single Market when we do; or we may end up part in it and part out of it. As for what Cameron said before the vote, see point (b) above. He also said he'd serve A50 notice and wouldn't resign - remember?
We are where we are. Shaking your fist at the rain because yesterday's newspaper said it would be dry and fine won't keep you dry. But if you don't like where we are now, there are plenty of Remainers who can console you.
Edited by anonymous-user on Friday 2nd December 22:54
Deptford Draylons said:
I think I would have remembered anyone in the media at all saying this was non binding and basically just one big giant polling event to give an advisory opinion to the pro House of Commons.
I find it hard to believe that any self-respecting Leaver would not read the Daily Mail nor the Daily Telegraph. 7 June: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3629775/Br...
7 June: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/06/07/eu-refe...
Both reporting an article from the Spectator. Neither challenging the assertion that the referendum was advisory. Which obviously they couldn't do, because it was.
Anything else you mis-remember?
So its an advisory referendum that the PM say would be enacted within hours with the triggering of article 50.
Which MP's said that would not happen, and on a leave vote this would be blocked immediately or that he had no right to make that false claim and they would override the result ignoring the public's advisory opinion ?
As another bus rage person on PH, do you to still think the big lie was not the official position and Cameron and the Government by saying the above,plus all the bullst claims of the immediate effects which we now know to have been all but totally wrong, but the £350m claim from a cross party group of people in what you took to be a giant opinion poll of the country ?
Which MP's said that would not happen, and on a leave vote this would be blocked immediately or that he had no right to make that false claim and they would override the result ignoring the public's advisory opinion ?
As another bus rage person on PH, do you to still think the big lie was not the official position and Cameron and the Government by saying the above,plus all the bulls
t claims of the immediate effects which we now know to have been all but totally wrong, but the £350m claim from a cross party group of people in what you took to be a giant opinion poll of the country ?Deptford Draylons said:
Its not my finest effort, but good enough to understand. I can't be arsed to argue with you if you are looking for reasons not to address what I wrote.
i understood it perfectly well. it must be a thick leave voter thing always had greg down as very intelligent but ignorant , i will be devastated if i am wrong on the intelligent bit.'The judges and the people: Next week, 11 unaccountable individuals will consider a case that could thwart the will of the majority on Brexit. The Mail makes no apology for revealing their views - and many have links to Europe'
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3995754/Th...
EXCLUSIVE: Why the judges got it so wrong: Government referendum appeal will say they turned the Brexit vote into a 'FOOTNOTE' as law chief issues blistering warning
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3995666/Wh...
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3995754/Th...
EXCLUSIVE: Why the judges got it so wrong: Government referendum appeal will say they turned the Brexit vote into a 'FOOTNOTE' as law chief issues blistering warning
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3995666/Wh...
don'tbesilly said:
'The judges and the people: Next week, 11 unaccountable individuals will consider a case that could thwart the will of the majority on Brexit. The Mail makes no apology for revealing their views - and many have links to Europe'
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3995754/Th...
EXCLUSIVE: Why the judges got it so wrong: Government referendum appeal will say they turned the Brexit vote into a 'FOOTNOTE' as law chief issues blistering warning
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3995666/Wh...
Badly phrased argument. The kernel is correct: to refer as the high court did, to Dicey, while recognising the fundamental realities of modern treaty making, is correct, but it's a terribly weak phrasing. The fundamental point is that we're in unknown territory and the courts risk overstepping into the provenance of parliament especially around prerogative. The attorney general would be better stomping that out in much clearer statements. I.E the Supreme Court would be *establishing* constitutional precedent not interpreting.http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3995754/Th...
EXCLUSIVE: Why the judges got it so wrong: Government referendum appeal will say they turned the Brexit vote into a 'FOOTNOTE' as law chief issues blistering warning
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3995666/Wh...
More low grade smearing from the Mail. Some of these "unelected Judges" have the temerity to know people, or worse, be related to people with are pro Remain.
Does the Mail not know (or want to say) that the Attorney General himself was a Remain campaigner? Why aren't they claiming that he threw the last hearing, and is going to throw this one?
Does the Mail not know (or want to say) that the Attorney General himself was a Remain campaigner? Why aren't they claiming that he threw the last hearing, and is going to throw this one?
Edited by anonymous-user on Saturday 3rd December 07:29
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