45th President of the United States, Donald Trump.

45th President of the United States, Donald Trump.

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p1stonhead

25,489 posts

166 months

Tuesday 17th January 2017
quotequote all
scherzkeks said:
walm said:
scherzkeks said:
Stickyfinger said:
Lets be real....they ALL lied...
Well as most of us know, they always do to varying degrees.
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/lists/people/comparing-hillary-clinton-donald-trump-truth-o-met/
Propaganda outlet that nicely dovetails with the part of my post you edited out. PF is funded by prominent Clinton Foundation megadonor Pierre Omidyar.

As always, follow the money.
And Trump tweeted this article. Lifezette is owned by Laura Ingraham who is Trumps potential Press Secretary.

http://www.lifezette.com/polizette/buzzfeed-runs-e...

Laughable how much you are willing to ignore on Trump's side.

Stickyfinger

8,429 posts

104 months

Tuesday 17th January 2017
quotequote all
minimoog said:
Stickyfinger said:
Half, 1/4 truth ?....wtf is that, is that almost perfect ?
Are you genuinely unable to comprehend what half true or mostly false means?

No wonder he won with fans like you around.
So Joseph Goebbels was better than Adolf Hitler ?

As said...they BOTH LIE but according to a web site one a little less than another, we are truly fked then.

Halb

53,012 posts

182 months

Tuesday 17th January 2017
quotequote all
davepoth said:
There is unfairness inherent in saying that one person's vote is more important than someone else's, which is in effect what the electoral college does. Most countries use one man one vote, and even the UK regularly redistricts to attempt to equalise the power of a single vote in general elections.

In the original framing it was a compromise, as the southern states would not stand for "negroes" voting for the president. Added to that, the three-fifths compromise would give them more votes in the electoral college without having to allow the slaves to vote. Here are the relevant proceedings of the constitutional convention.

http://memory.loc.gov/cgi-bin/ampage?collId=llfr&a...

As it turns out the compromise they made nearly 250 years ago works for other reasons these days.

The other point about the electoral college is that it wasn't originally a rubber stamping exercise. The founding fathers imagined a large field of potential presidential candidates, and the electors were not tied to a particular candidate by their state's vote. They were given the duty of choosing on the electorate's behalf.

One of the big problems of the electoral college is that IMV it has contributed to the polarisation of the country. The Republicans have essentially given up on big urban areas, and the Democrats have done the same in rural areas. A one man one vote system would force the Republican party to attract votes from the cities, which would mean a moderation in their perspective.
Quite.

minimoog

6,857 posts

218 months

Tuesday 17th January 2017
quotequote all
Stickyfinger said:
So Joseph Goebbels was better than Adolf Hitler ?

As said...they BOTH LIE but according to a web site one a little less than another, we are truly fked then.
As I have said before, I'm no fan of Clinton at all.

In my view the subject of ongoing debate should be Trumpy. Clinton and her faults is old irrelevant news. It's illuminating how quickly the Trumpettes reach for her record as a smokescreen to deflect from their risible hero.

Countdown

39,690 posts

195 months

Tuesday 17th January 2017
quotequote all
scherzkeks said:
walm said:
scherzkeks said:
Stickyfinger said:
Lets be real....they ALL lied...
Well as most of us know, they always do to varying degrees.
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/lists/people/comparing-hillary-clinton-donald-trump-truth-o-met/
Propaganda outlet that nicely dovetails with the part of my post you edited out. PF is funded by prominent Clinton Foundation megadonor Pierre Omidyar.

As always, follow the money.
Politifact also shows where Hillary lied / Trump was truthful. Is that propaganda as well?

Blue Cat

976 posts

185 months

Tuesday 17th January 2017
quotequote all
Stickyfinger said:
minimoog said:
Stickyfinger said:
Half, 1/4 truth ?....wtf is that, is that almost perfect ?
Are you genuinely unable to comprehend what half true or mostly false means?

No wonder he won with fans like you around.
So Joseph Goebbels was better than Adolf Hitler ?

As said...they BOTH LIE but according to a web site one a little less than another, we are truly fked then.
So we can forgive Hitler because Goebbels was nearly as bad, interesting point of view to take.

Stickyfinger

8,429 posts

104 months

Tuesday 17th January 2017
quotequote all
and how people use silly "names" to degrade the argument.

Both are revolting IMO and both let down the US public both at home and in the larger world.

Blue Cat said:
So we can forgive Hitler because Goebbels was nearly as bad, interesting point of view to take.
oh please....I really do not know how to respond to that other than walk into a wall with my head leading

Edited by Stickyfinger on Tuesday 17th January 14:10

Blue Cat

976 posts

185 months

Tuesday 17th January 2017
quotequote all
Stickyfinger said:
and how people use silly "names" to degrade the argument.

Both are revolting IMO and both let down the US public both at home and in the larger world.
But you were the one who brought up Hitler?

p1stonhead

25,489 posts

166 months

Tuesday 17th January 2017
quotequote all
Blue Cat said:
Stickyfinger said:
minimoog said:
Stickyfinger said:
Half, 1/4 truth ?....wtf is that, is that almost perfect ?
Are you genuinely unable to comprehend what half true or mostly false means?

No wonder he won with fans like you around.
So Joseph Goebbels was better than Adolf Hitler ?

As said...they BOTH LIE but according to a web site one a little less than another, we are truly fked then.
So we can forgive Hitler because Goebbels was nearly as bad, interesting point of view to take.
And if Hitler or Goebbels (Trump can be whomever anyone chooses in this example) was doing a speech (**twitter rant) EVERY SINGLE DAY about how unfair and mean frown it all is, he would still be the one we would be talking about as being a petulant child.

Edited by p1stonhead on Tuesday 17th January 14:12

scherzkeks

4,460 posts

133 months

Tuesday 17th January 2017
quotequote all
p1stonhead said:
scherzkeks said:
walm said:
scherzkeks said:
Stickyfinger said:
Lets be real....they ALL lied...
Well as most of us know, they always do to varying degrees.
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/lists/people/comparing-hillary-clinton-donald-trump-truth-o-met/
Propaganda outlet that nicely dovetails with the part of my post you edited out. PF is funded by prominent Clinton Foundation megadonor Pierre Omidyar.

As always, follow the money.
And Trump tweeted this article. Lifezette is owned by Laura Ingraham who is Trumps potential Press Secretary.

http://www.lifezette.com/polizette/buzzfeed-runs-e...

Laughable how much you are willing to ignore on Trump's side.
Ignoring for a moment that the article appears entirely factual (and [ironically in context] isabout yet another episode of fake MSM reporting), please help me understand how the fact that:

Trump tweeted an article from a site owned by a Republican.

Has any connection to the fact that:

Politifact masquerades as an objective, fact-checking organization.




p1stonhead

25,489 posts

166 months

Tuesday 17th January 2017
quotequote all
scherzkeks said:
p1stonhead said:
scherzkeks said:
walm said:
scherzkeks said:
Stickyfinger said:
Lets be real....they ALL lied...
Well as most of us know, they always do to varying degrees.
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/lists/people/comparing-hillary-clinton-donald-trump-truth-o-met/
Propaganda outlet that nicely dovetails with the part of my post you edited out. PF is funded by prominent Clinton Foundation megadonor Pierre Omidyar.

As always, follow the money.
And Trump tweeted this article. Lifezette is owned by Laura Ingraham who is Trumps potential Press Secretary.

http://www.lifezette.com/polizette/buzzfeed-runs-e...

Laughable how much you are willing to ignore on Trump's side.
Ignoring for a moment that the article appears entirely factual (and [ironically in context] isabout yet another episode of fake MSM reporting), please help me understand how the fact that:

Trump tweeted an article from a site owned by a Republican.

Has any connection to the fact that:

Politifact masquerades as an objective, fact-checking organization.
rofl

So both are owned by big contributors (one is not just a Republican but actually potentially part of Trumps team) for the people they are defending and one is masquerading and the other isnt?!

Got any facts to back that up? Which bits are lying/absolutely the truth on either article? Sources would be helpful.

Edited by p1stonhead on Tuesday 17th January 14:20

minimoog

6,857 posts

218 months

Tuesday 17th January 2017
quotequote all
scherzkeks said:
Politifact masquerades as an objective, fact-checking organization.
I imagine one could research the political leanings of all its funding sources and conclude that there weren't many Trump-leaning among them.

Given that the aim of the organisation is to expose lies in politics, and Trump is a 'politician' who lies his arse off all the live long day, this isn't entirely surprising.

You'd have more of a chance of impressing people with your 'not objective' point if Politifact didn't also track and investigate the lies and half-lies told by the Clinton side, but obviously it does. Presumably you've noticed this, so you must have concluded that they are massively underplaying Clinton's lies, and massively overplaying Trumpy's lies, all because 'funding!'.

I suppose you're right. Far better we cut out all these vested interests, ignore them and the MSM, and all the other people and lobbyists with money in the Dem's game, and just believe everything Trumpy says. I'm sure everything will be just peachy if we clear our minds, bow in supplication and take his word as Gospel.


Edited by minimoog on Tuesday 17th January 14:32

roachcoach

3,975 posts

154 months

Tuesday 17th January 2017
quotequote all
I think most people would raise an eyebrow to any head of state posting stuff like this: https://twitter.com/realdonaldtrump/status/8195419...

I'd honestly expect him to have more important things to do with his time.

scherzkeks

4,460 posts

133 months

Tuesday 17th January 2017
quotequote all
p1stonhead said:
rofl

So both are owned by big contributors (one is owned by basically someone who manages what goes out into the press about Trump!)
Trump's press secretary is Sean Spicer. clap

p1stonhead said:
for the people they are defending and one is masquerading and the other isnt?!
The story you linked to is a factual report on fake news put out by Buzzfeed.


p1stonhead said:
Got any facts to back that up? Which bits are lying/absolutely the truth on either article? Sources would be helpful.
Sure, a 5-second scan of google produces:

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-09-25/politifac...


p1stonhead

25,489 posts

166 months

Tuesday 17th January 2017
quotequote all
scherzkeks said:
p1stonhead said:
rofl

So both are owned by big contributors (one is owned by basically someone who manages what goes out into the press about Trump!)
Trump's press secretary is Sean Spicer.

p1stonhead said:
for the people they are defending and one is masquerading and the other isnt?!
The story you linked to as a factual report on fake news put out by Buzzfeed.


p1stonhead said:
Got any facts to back that up? Which bits are lying/absolutely the truth on either article? Sources would be helpful.
Sure, a 5-second scan of google produces:

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-09-25/politifac...
I believe the report put out by Buzzfeed remains unverified rather than being proven fake? Have you been told different?

scherzkeks

4,460 posts

133 months

Tuesday 17th January 2017
quotequote all
minimoog said:
scherzkeks said:
Politifact masquerades as an objective, fact-checking organization.
You'd have more of a chance of impressing people with your 'not objective' point if Politifact didn't also track and investigate the lies and half-lies told by the Clinton side


Edited by minimoog on Tuesday 17th January 14:32
Well, I would do just that if I were running a propaganda outlet.

I quoted Kissenger a few posts back in reference to Countdown's logic. I think that quote is appropriate again.

walm

10,609 posts

201 months

Tuesday 17th January 2017
quotequote all
Feel free to post a link to any outlet, biased or otherwise, that shows that Trump DOESN'T tell significantly more lies than Hillary and/or Walter Mitty.

I did a highly academic 2-3 minutes on google and every source showed Trump to be an OUTRAGEOUS liar, vs. everyone else being a merely common-or-garden variety BS merchant.

turbobloke

103,742 posts

259 months

Tuesday 17th January 2017
quotequote all
roachcoach said:
I think most people would raise an eyebrow to any head of state posting stuff like this: https://twitter.com/realdonaldtrump/status/8195419...

I'd honestly expect him to have more important things to do with his time.
He isn't a head of state yet, not that you said he was, and by all accounts recognises that the same type of social media comms policy won't be appropriate as potus. Which is a shame; here's hoping he doesn't morph into something spinny.

p1stonhead

25,489 posts

166 months

Tuesday 17th January 2017
quotequote all
turbobloke said:
roachcoach said:
I think most people would raise an eyebrow to any head of state posting stuff like this: https://twitter.com/realdonaldtrump/status/8195419...

I'd honestly expect him to have more important things to do with his time.
He isn't a head of state yet, not that you said he was, and by all accounts recognises that the same type of social media comms policy won't be appropriate as potus. Which is a shame; here's hoping he doesn't morph into something spinny.
Which accounts are these?

And isnt PEOTUS the same thing? How is it different in terms of influence across the country?

scherzkeks

4,460 posts

133 months

Tuesday 17th January 2017
quotequote all
walm said:
Feel free to post a link to any outlet, biased or otherwise, that shows that Trump DOESN'T tell significantly more lies than Hillary and/or Walter Mitty.

I did a highly academic 2-3 minutes on google and every source showed Trump to be an OUTRAGEOUS liar, vs. everyone else being a merely common-or-garden variety BS merchant.
The burden of proof falls on the individual making a claim.

Will a year be enough time for your scientific analysis?


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