ITV This Morning "Ban the burka?" poll
Discussion
Derek Smith said:
It is probably one of the most complex of arguments: should the burka be banned.
On the one hand there is the argument that in a free world we should be allowed to dress as we like.
On the other hand, most seem to prefer that genitalia be covered.
On the one hand women should be able to cover their faces if they so wish.
On the other hand, they may well be forced to under restrictive covenants of their culture or religion.
It is oppressive to force people to do something, such as leave their faces in full view.
It is oppressive to force people to do something, such as cover their faces.
I dislike women wearing face coverings as they are women. The problem is not that it is cultural but that it is cultural for women only.
It is oppressive to force people who's culture is founded on facial body language to have to see people going about in public with covered faces.On the one hand there is the argument that in a free world we should be allowed to dress as we like.
On the other hand, most seem to prefer that genitalia be covered.
On the one hand women should be able to cover their faces if they so wish.
On the other hand, they may well be forced to under restrictive covenants of their culture or religion.
It is oppressive to force people to do something, such as leave their faces in full view.
It is oppressive to force people to do something, such as cover their faces.
I dislike women wearing face coverings as they are women. The problem is not that it is cultural but that it is cultural for women only.
It is oppressive to force people to have to interact with people who have their faces covered.
AJL308 said:
Derek Smith said:
It is probably one of the most complex of arguments: should the burka be banned.
On the one hand there is the argument that in a free world we should be allowed to dress as we like.
On the other hand, most seem to prefer that genitalia be covered.
On the one hand women should be able to cover their faces if they so wish.
On the other hand, they may well be forced to under restrictive covenants of their culture or religion.
It is oppressive to force people to do something, such as leave their faces in full view.
It is oppressive to force people to do something, such as cover their faces.
I dislike women wearing face coverings as they are women. The problem is not that it is cultural but that it is cultural for women only.
It is oppressive to force people who's culture is founded on facial body language to have to see people going about in public with covered faces.On the one hand there is the argument that in a free world we should be allowed to dress as we like.
On the other hand, most seem to prefer that genitalia be covered.
On the one hand women should be able to cover their faces if they so wish.
On the other hand, they may well be forced to under restrictive covenants of their culture or religion.
It is oppressive to force people to do something, such as leave their faces in full view.
It is oppressive to force people to do something, such as cover their faces.
I dislike women wearing face coverings as they are women. The problem is not that it is cultural but that it is cultural for women only.
It is oppressive to force people to have to interact with people who have their faces covered.
Alpinestars said:
Einion Yrth said:
Sikhs wearing turbans are not required to wear crash helmets, Sikhs may also carry Kirpans ("ceremonial" knives). I have no problem with Sikhs but really do struggle to see why they should have exemptions from law that I do not have.
You could always wear one and if stopped, say you're Sikh?However, I don't think I have ever seen it in practice. Not once. Does it ever actually happen?
chrispmartha said:
Troubleatmill said:
CCTV will quite easily pick you up when you go venturing in your high heels.
And guess what ,we will know it is you.
CCTV is not quite as adept at identifying an individual dressed top to toe as a black squashy pyramid.
Until you understand that identity is important - you won't grasp anything beyond this.
So have you got any statistics oncrimes commited by people in burkas? Is it a a major problem?And guess what ,we will know it is you.
CCTV is not quite as adept at identifying an individual dressed top to toe as a black squashy pyramid.
Until you understand that identity is important - you won't grasp anything beyond this.
End of.
Troubleatmill said:
chrispmartha said:
Troubleatmill said:
CCTV will quite easily pick you up when you go venturing in your high heels.
And guess what ,we will know it is you.
CCTV is not quite as adept at identifying an individual dressed top to toe as a black squashy pyramid.
Until you understand that identity is important - you won't grasp anything beyond this.
So have you got any statistics oncrimes commited by people in burkas? Is it a a major problem?And guess what ,we will know it is you.
CCTV is not quite as adept at identifying an individual dressed top to toe as a black squashy pyramid.
Until you understand that identity is important - you won't grasp anything beyond this.
End of.
That means no then, if crimes commited by people wearing burkas are a huge problem you would have the statistics surely?
Troubleatmill said:
We live in a society where your identity in all walks of life is important.
End of.
All walks of life? The Internet? What's your identity?End of.
You're not very coherent as to why it should be banned.
You haven't answered someone else's question about crime stats either.
chrispmartha said:
Troubleatmill said:
chrispmartha said:
Troubleatmill said:
CCTV will quite easily pick you up when you go venturing in your high heels.
And guess what ,we will know it is you.
CCTV is not quite as adept at identifying an individual dressed top to toe as a black squashy pyramid.
Until you understand that identity is important - you won't grasp anything beyond this.
So have you got any statistics oncrimes commited by people in burkas? Is it a a major problem?And guess what ,we will know it is you.
CCTV is not quite as adept at identifying an individual dressed top to toe as a black squashy pyramid.
Until you understand that identity is important - you won't grasp anything beyond this.
End of.
That means no then, if crimes commited by people wearing burkas are a huge problem you would have the statistics surely?
Why do we need to indentify people all the time?
Edited by Challo on Wednesday 7th December 23:17
AJL308 said:
People covering their faces during everyday interaction does harm other people. This is not the way in which our culture operates or has ever operated. It places people who do not cover their face at an immediate disadvantage when interacting as they have no facial body language to react to.
It's fine when you live in a culture that requires women to interact almost exclusively with other women when their faces are uncovered but not in our society.
What a load of codswallop.It's fine when you live in a culture that requires women to interact almost exclusively with other women when their faces are uncovered but not in our society.
Faces being covered harms people no more than tattoos, or a mohican does. The people feeling "harmed" by such trivia need to have a look in the mirror.
I can see that some don't like it. Just as I can with tattoos etc. I can see some may find them offensive. But you can't legislate against that otherwise who decides what is and isn't offensive? I'm not keen on shell suits. Ban them! I despise beige polyester. Ban it! That sees most of Liverpool and everyone over the age of 70 screwed in terms of wardrobe
I do tend to agree with Derek about nudity etc. So I accept that potentially undermines my stance a touch. But to be perfectly honest I'm prepared to accept that. People being harmed by a burka is more to do with their...mindset...than it is the burka wearer. Nudity where not expected is different IMO.
If you want to abolish all religious garb, then I would have a lot more sympathy with the view. I'd still think we are better off allowing people to wear what they like, but I could at least accept the view as something other than deeply prejudiced.
Personally, I'd ban religion full stop. Starting with schools and ending with garments. Just get rid of it. I'd probably have to build quite a few prisons though.
I don't like burkas, or any sort of islamic clothing. They make me extremely uncomfortable. I will actively move along a carriage if they sit or stand next to me on the tube or train, and no I do not give a s
t if they notice. They want to act like I don't exist, so I will act as if they don't. I don't know what I'd do if I had to get on an aeroplane with someone dressed in a burka, luckily the situation hasn't arisen yet. So is it ok that I am made to feel uncomfortable by these people, while I go about my business without negatively affecting anybody around me? No its not ok IMO, but for some reason we have pandered to Islam in this country for so long, that they can basically get away with anything. They're almost as untouchable as pie-keys.
In my eyes the situation is being completely over complicated, when really it's very simple. It's medieval. It's backwards and regressive. It's divisive. It has no place in 2016 Britain.
I don't like burkas, or any sort of islamic clothing. They make me extremely uncomfortable. I will actively move along a carriage if they sit or stand next to me on the tube or train, and no I do not give a s
t if they notice. They want to act like I don't exist, so I will act as if they don't. I don't know what I'd do if I had to get on an aeroplane with someone dressed in a burka, luckily the situation hasn't arisen yet. So is it ok that I am made to feel uncomfortable by these people, while I go about my business without negatively affecting anybody around me? No its not ok IMO, but for some reason we have pandered to Islam in this country for so long, that they can basically get away with anything. They're almost as untouchable as pie-keys.In my eyes the situation is being completely over complicated, when really it's very simple. It's medieval. It's backwards and regressive. It's divisive. It has no place in 2016 Britain.
danllama said:
...
I don't like burkas, or any sort of islamic clothing. They make me extremely uncomfortable. I will actively move along a carriage if they sit or stand next to me on the tube or train, ...
A genuine question from someone genuinely interested - what is it you think they will do to you?I don't like burkas, or any sort of islamic clothing. They make me extremely uncomfortable. I will actively move along a carriage if they sit or stand next to me on the tube or train, ...
Cards on the table - I find burkas a bit odd. I actually find quite a lot of religious garb odd. But I'm more "offended" by dirty dred's on the tube though (smell). Or scruffy feckers with not enough/any deo' though
Murph7355 said:
danllama said:
...
I don't like burkas, or any sort of islamic clothing. They make me extremely uncomfortable. I will actively move along a carriage if they sit or stand next to me on the tube or train, ...
A genuine question from someone genuinely interested - what is it you think they will do to you?I don't like burkas, or any sort of islamic clothing. They make me extremely uncomfortable. I will actively move along a carriage if they sit or stand next to me on the tube or train, ...
Cards on the table - I find burkas a bit odd. I actually find quite a lot of religious garb odd. But I'm more "offended" by dirty dred's on the tube though (smell). Or scruffy feckers with not enough/any deo' though
). That they look down on me. What can I, an ordinary man, do to combat that feeling? I get up and move away from them.Tbf, I do also find most, if not all, religious clothing odd. Well, as I alluded to in my previous post, I find religion odd, unbearably odd, in general.
And yes I hate smelly people on the tube too, but I'd feel less confident in just getting up and moving away from them, probably because I can actually see their face
danllama said:
I don't think they'll do anything to me. I'm just uncomfortable with it. I'm uncomfortable with the fact that they think its acceptable (which successive governments have done nothing to combat, and have probably validated). I also get the impression that they think they are superior. That they are too good to have to talk to or look at the likes of me (and no I do not have an inferiority complex ). That they look down on me. What can I, an ordinary man, do to combat that feeling? I get up and move away from them.
Tbf, I do also find most, if not all, religious clothing odd. Well, as I alluded to in my previous post, I find religion odd, unbearably odd, in general.
And yes I hate smelly people on the tube too, but I'd feel less confident in just getting up and moving away from them, probably because I can actually see their face
You do realise people in burkas can see out of them? ). That they look down on me. What can I, an ordinary man, do to combat that feeling? I get up and move away from them.Tbf, I do also find most, if not all, religious clothing odd. Well, as I alluded to in my previous post, I find religion odd, unbearably odd, in general.
And yes I hate smelly people on the tube too, but I'd feel less confident in just getting up and moving away from them, probably because I can actually see their face
Is a burka the only thing that makes you feel that way? Do you not think your reaction is in any way....irrational? You know that they aren't going to hurt you, but you'd rather stand next to someone stinking to high heaven than someone with a veil on....
caelite said:
ITV viewership between 1030am and 1230pm, on a weekday too. Definitely reflects the views of hardworking Brits across a wide band of ages doesn't it?
Right about the time they've been woken up in a bad mood by the Postman clattering through the letterbox with six kilos of pay-day loan letters and Brighthouse catalogs, they're frothing at the mouth, raring to go... "Bloody burkas cumin ova ea"Meridius said:
caelite said:
ITV viewership between 1030am and 1230pm, on a weekday too. Definitely reflects the views of hardworking Brits across a wide band of ages doesn't it?
Right about the time they've been woken up in a bad mood by the Postman clattering through the letterbox with six kilos of pay-day loan letters and Brighthouse catalogs, they're frothing at the mouth, raring to go... "Bloody burkas cumin ova ea"Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff