How Big Is The Fake News Problem?

[andy_s]

Simian brain with Darwinian software in an alien environment.

[mko9]

For reference, here is the actual quiz: http://www.pewresearch.org/quiz/news-statements-qu...

On the one level, it is ridiculously easy to get all ten right. But it is also very easy to stop and think for a minute, and then go down the rabbit hole. For example, the statement: "Immigrants who are in the U.S. illegally are a very big problem for the country today", is clearly meant to be an opinion for the purposes of this quiz. But because some are of the opinion that illegal immigrants are a big problem, and some are of the of the opinion that illegal immigrants are not a problem, it creates the huge debates that go on about every aspect of illegal immigration. Essentially, the difference of opinions has resulted in illegal immigrants being a big problem, hence the statement is factual. And that is my opinion! ;-)

I laughed out loud at the "President Obama was born in the United States" one, just imagining the percentages on that one.

On the flip side, in the world of "fake news" even the factual statements like "ISIS has lost territory in 2017", even though I know it is true, makes me stop and think for a minute about it. Depending upon what the source was, and who was the President at the time, I might need to do a little fact checking to see if that is really a fact, or just media bias and political spin.

All of this pretty much illustrating why most people can't figure out what is truth or fiction.

[rscott]

Interesting example of Fake News here -

https://twitter.com/LeaveEUOfficial/status/1010505...

Specifically, the 3rd picture. Leave.EU claim that was taken on Saturday's pro-Brexit march. Strange how there don't appear to be any leaves on the trees and those attending are wearing winter coats and hats...

[Murph7355]

rscott said:

Interesting example of Fake News here -

https://twitter.com/LeaveEUOfficial/status/1010505...

...

Shouldn't anything on Twitter be treated as utter bks by default?

[9.3]

rscott said:

Interesting example of Fake News here -

https://twitter.com/LeaveEUOfficial/status/1010505...

Specifically, the 3rd picture. Leave.EU claim that was taken on Saturday's pro-Brexit march. Strange how there don't appear to be any leaves on the trees and those attending are wearing winter coats and hats...

I think if you study the photo, the 3rd picture is the Speakers Corner one.

[rscott]

9.3 said:

rscott said:

Interesting example of Fake News here -

https://twitter.com/LeaveEUOfficial/status/1010505...

Specifically, the 3rd picture. Leave.EU claim that was taken on Saturday's pro-Brexit march. Strange how there don't appear to be any leaves on the trees and those attending are wearing winter coats and hats...

I think if you study the photo, the 3rd picture is the Speakers Corner one.

And certainly wasn't taken in June this year.

[grombot]

rscott said:

9.3 said:

rscott said:

Interesting example of Fake News here -

https://twitter.com/LeaveEUOfficial/status/1010505...

Specifically, the 3rd picture. Leave.EU claim that was taken on Saturday's pro-Brexit march. Strange how there don't appear to be any leaves on the trees and those attending are wearing winter coats and hats...

I think if you study the photo, the 3rd picture is the Speakers Corner one.

And certainly wasn't taken in June this year.

I'm not supporting the tweet, but it is quite clear that the pictures just don't match up to the order they listed the events, hence the confusion. Basically they are saying that the events they list did not get as much media coverage as the pro EU march did. Not that all three events happened yesterday in London at the same time. What they should have said was the speakers corner event in March, the free Tommy march on the 8th June and today's Brexit march in London.

This just shows that people need to read things more thoroughly and think for themselves a bit more before jumping on the bandwagon if the comments on that tweet are anything to go by....

[rscott]

grombot said:

rscott said:

9.3 said:

rscott said:

Interesting example of Fake News here -

https://twitter.com/LeaveEUOfficial/status/1010505...

Specifically, the 3rd picture. Leave.EU claim that was taken on Saturday's pro-Brexit march. Strange how there don't appear to be any leaves on the trees and those attending are wearing winter coats and hats...

I think if you study the photo, the 3rd picture is the Speakers Corner one.

And certainly wasn't taken in June this year.

I'm not supporting the tweet, but it is quite clear that the pictures just don't match up to the order they listed the events, hence the confusion. Basically they are saying that the events they list did not get as much media coverage as the pro EU march did. Not that all three events happened yesterday in London at the same time. What they should have said was the speakers corner event in March, the free Tommy march on the 8th June and today's Brexit march in London.

This just shows that people need to read things more thoroughly and think for themselves a bit more before jumping on the bandwagon if the comments on that tweet are anything to go by....

Or that leave.eu's social media team can't even upload photos in the right order?

[grombot]

rscott said:

grombot said:

rscott said:

9.3 said:

rscott said:

Interesting example of Fake News here -

https://twitter.com/LeaveEUOfficial/status/1010505...

Specifically, the 3rd picture. Leave.EU claim that was taken on Saturday's pro-Brexit march. Strange how there don't appear to be any leaves on the trees and those attending are wearing winter coats and hats...

I think if you study the photo, the 3rd picture is the Speakers Corner one.

And certainly wasn't taken in June this year.

I'm not supporting the tweet, but it is quite clear that the pictures just don't match up to the order they listed the events, hence the confusion. Basically they are saying that the events they list did not get as much media coverage as the pro EU march did. Not that all three events happened yesterday in London at the same time. What they should have said was the speakers corner event in March, the free Tommy march on the 8th June and today's Brexit march in London.

This just shows that people need to read things more thoroughly and think for themselves a bit more before jumping on the bandwagon if the comments on that tweet are anything to go by....

Or that leave.eu's social media team can't even upload photos in the right order?

Don't admit it when your wrong... :-)

[anonymous-user]

I missed this thread the first time around.

Interesting read.

Look at the utter bilge pumped out by places like Infowars, Brietbart and Russia Today.

You have to be a special kind of special to read that kind of tripe.

[rscott]

Lord Marylebone said:

I missed this thread the first time around.

Interesting read.

Look at the utter bilge pumped out by places like Infowars, Brietbart and Russia Today.

You have to be a special kind of special to read that kind of tripe.

Or President of the USA...

[Timmy45]

BlackLabel said:

Mr GrimNasty said:

BBC goes full fake-nutjob.

"Was Britain’s EU referendum hijacked by the American alt-right using a technique known as psychographics?"

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-40423629/what-was-...

Loved the way newsnight used stupid spooky music and whacky graphics to warn us all about these people.

Also I can't remember the media making a big deal about it when Obama used behavioural scientists as part of his campaign.

quite. IIRC it was actually applauded at the time.

[anonymous-user]

rscott said:

Lord Marylebone said:

I missed this thread the first time around.

Interesting read.

Look at the utter bilge pumped out by places like Infowars, Brietbart and Russia Today.

You have to be a special kind of special to read that kind of tripe.

Or President of the USA...

Indeed!

[Gandahar]

In the US the problem seems to be ignoring or going overboard with news depending on the sources background.

Fake News is not that common, there are some mistakes, especially in this 24/7 news world where you have to get the story out first. This will get worse.

But CNN going overboard on a story and FoxNews neglecting it, or the other way around, shows a problem at source. They are giving information to what their readers want, which is confirmation bias. This is even worse at less mainstream sites of course on both sides which just spoon feed what the readers want. I don't see a solution to this to be honest given how polar their country has become over recent years.

In the UK the BBC is pissing me off with too many "news stories" that are not. It is re-reporting social media. Dumbing down BBC ...

And these are sources with EDITORIAL CONTROL.

Lack of editorial control is the big problem now for what you read online.

[mko9]

Lord Marylebone said:

I missed this thread the first time around.

Interesting read.

Look at the utter bilge pumped out by places like Infowars, Brietbart and Russia Today.

You have to be a special kind of special to read that kind of tripe.

I don't know that RT is much of a source for anything in the US, but I could be mistaken. Regardless, you could also throw the likes of thinkprogress, Huffington Post, MSNBC, and Newsweek in there. I am really not trying to throw out a "yeah, but...". Not trying to justify the sources you list, just pointing out that it is not a problem constrained to the conservative end of the spectrum.

It is fairly easy to spot bias in opinions you disagree with, but that doesn't mean everything they say is wrong. On the flip side, it can be very difficult to see the bias in the opinions you agree with - echo chamber and all that. Generally speaking, I would avoid pretty much all the sources you and I listed, but everyone should still read across the spectrum to get a better understanding of issues. Washington Post and NYT against Wall Street Journal, FoxNews vs CNN vs BBC, etc, etc.

[glazbagun]

durbster said:

glazbagun said:

Only one survey, but this has worrying implications and would also explain some of the total nonsense some people believe.

Only one in four correctly distinguish facts from opinion.

On this theme, this is well worth a listen:
https://youarenotsosmart.com/2018/02/26/yanss-122-...

It explains how we will put our tribal connections over and above even the most obvious facts. Our natural instinct to be accepted by others overrides our critical thinking skills.

This is why the idea that you can convince people of something by simply presenting them with the facts just doesn't work. We are just not programmed that way.

This is why so much of our discourse is framed in tribal ways now. Information is presented as us vs them all the time, and it's created this distorted reality on a number of issues.

We need to understand this stuff to realise none of us are immune to it, and then we need to figure out how to get around it.

Combine the above with this neat little game on the wisdom/foolishness of crowds:

https://ncase.me/crowds/

The TL:DR version is that all things being equal (such as the value you place on your peers, so obviously a big variable right there), easily understood ideas spread quickly and more mentally taxing or culturally unpopular ones slowly and most likely not at all.

Which is why religion will never die, and why simply giving people access to unlimited facts won't have us all agreeing on truth. I think social media has already destroyed representative democracy.

[grumbledoak]

glazbagun said:

I think social media has already destroyed representative democracy.

Hysterical, much?

Political parties beat social media to it by a couple hundred years.

[glazbagun]

grumbledoak said:

glazbagun said:

I think social media has already destroyed representative democracy.

Hysterical, much?

Political parties beat social media to it by a couple hundred years.

Maybe.

[BlackLabel]

“The German news magazine Der Spiegel has been plunged into chaos after revealing that one of its top reporters had falsified stories over several years.

The media world was stunned by the revelations that the award-winning journalist Claas Relotius had, according to the weekly, “made up stories and invented protagonists” in at least 14 out of 60 articles that appeared in its print and online editions, warning that other outlets could also be affected.

Relotius, 33, resigned after admitting to the scam. He had written for the magazine for seven years and won numerous awards for his investigative journalism, including CNN Journalist of the Year in 2014.”

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/dec/19/top-...

[BlackLabel]

The Der Spiegel story continues to run and run. The writers irrational hatred of American led to his downfall.

The German reporter Claas Relotius, accused by top news magazine Der Spiegel of faking stories, could now face embezzlement charges. Der Spiegel says it is filing a criminal complaint alleging he solicited donations for Syrian orphans from readers with any proceeds going to his personal account.


Germany’s Leading Magazine Published Falsehoods About American Life. A reporter with Der Spiegel fabricated information in more than a dozen articles—most of which were meant to reveal America’s brutality.