Protesting - useful/gets things done or a waste of time?
Discussion
Derek Smith said:
egor110 said:
Surely as the old majors and blue rinse brigade die off then a new generation replaces them who might see things differently and vote accordingly?
Or as in the brexit vote maybe they'll be so wrapped up tweeting/facebooking why brexit is bad they couldn't quite manage to actually get out and vote.
You seem to be of the opinion that it is only pensioners who read the DM. That is, I'm afraid, not so. The middle-aged strip the racks of them in the main. It's scary.Or as in the brexit vote maybe they'll be so wrapped up tweeting/facebooking why brexit is bad they couldn't quite manage to actually get out and vote.
Also, I'm of the 'blue rinse brigade' so I'll be off at the same time.
My representative is an oaf. Even the tory voters I know agree.
D-Angle said:
eccles said:
Yeah, only lefties go out and protest! 
I can't think of any large scale right/centrist protests in recent years, certainly not the waving placards in a town square type. Do you have an example that I'm forgetting? 
cookie118 said:
PH does not get women's rights issues-especially when it comes to sexual harassment/assault/rape.
The majority default responses to NP+E threads on sexual harassment/assault/rape are that the three only happen if the guy is deemed 'ugly' or if drink was involved that the woman just regretted it and should take more responsibility around drink. They never see them as societal issues that need to be addressed they just think that women cry rape/harassment unless they were jumped by a stranger and they were sober and were wearing baggy clothes. (Unless the perpetrators are Muslim in which case it's a very serious matter for PHand we have a monster NP+E thread!)
These protests are partly around the fact that Trump appears to not have to face any consequences for admitting that he sexually assaulted women (There's also the Mike Pence stuff on women's healthcare/abortion) If you take a look at Jezebel or other places with a feminist slant the issue of consequences for sexual crimes is big in the US at the moment with other cases such as the Stanford swimmer case. This lack of consequence is scary to a lot of women because it seems that men (especially rich ones) do not have to face consequences or severe enough consequences to deter them from committing sexual assault.
So they're protesting about sexual assault as a societal issue, something NP+E as a majority does not get.
Cheers, not sure where these posts are. The majority default responses to NP+E threads on sexual harassment/assault/rape are that the three only happen if the guy is deemed 'ugly' or if drink was involved that the woman just regretted it and should take more responsibility around drink. They never see them as societal issues that need to be addressed they just think that women cry rape/harassment unless they were jumped by a stranger and they were sober and were wearing baggy clothes. (Unless the perpetrators are Muslim in which case it's a very serious matter for PHand we have a monster NP+E thread!)
These protests are partly around the fact that Trump appears to not have to face any consequences for admitting that he sexually assaulted women (There's also the Mike Pence stuff on women's healthcare/abortion) If you take a look at Jezebel or other places with a feminist slant the issue of consequences for sexual crimes is big in the US at the moment with other cases such as the Stanford swimmer case. This lack of consequence is scary to a lot of women because it seems that men (especially rich ones) do not have to face consequences or severe enough consequences to deter them from committing sexual assault.
So they're protesting about sexual assault as a societal issue, something NP+E as a majority does not get.
A Guardian reporter on the Andrew Marr show stated that the protests following Trumps inauguration were ` What democracy is all about!'
NO! democracy is where each eligible person is given an equal vote, the votes are counted and the party which achieved the most votes has their position put in place. What is NOT democratic is for the losing side to carry out these pointless protests, or try to overturn the results of the majority vote, using any means they can find.
If as it seems, the snowflakes don't want to accept the results of both Trumps election, and the UK vote to leave the EU, they should not then be surprised in the event of them winning whatever the next election / EU vote happens to be, if the majority of the people in the UK rise up against them, and their twisted version of democracy.
The snowflakes seem to support the EU`s tactic of making people vote again, and again, until the people come up with the result that the EU want. and if people think that that is democracy, it is clear they don't have a clue about what democracy actually means.
NO! democracy is where each eligible person is given an equal vote, the votes are counted and the party which achieved the most votes has their position put in place. What is NOT democratic is for the losing side to carry out these pointless protests, or try to overturn the results of the majority vote, using any means they can find.
If as it seems, the snowflakes don't want to accept the results of both Trumps election, and the UK vote to leave the EU, they should not then be surprised in the event of them winning whatever the next election / EU vote happens to be, if the majority of the people in the UK rise up against them, and their twisted version of democracy.
The snowflakes seem to support the EU`s tactic of making people vote again, and again, until the people come up with the result that the EU want. and if people think that that is democracy, it is clear they don't have a clue about what democracy actually means.
Pan Pan Pan said:
A Guardian reporter on the Andrew Marr show stated that the protests following Trumps inauguration were ` What democracy is all about!'
NO! democracy is where each eligible person is given an equal vote, the votes are counted and the party which achieved the most votes has their position put in place. What is NOT democratic is for the losing side to carry out these pointless protests, or try to overturn the results of the majority vote, using any means they can find.
If as it seems, the snowflakes don't want to accept the results of both Trumps election, and the UK vote to leave the EU, they should not then be surprised in the event of them winning whatever the next election / EU vote happens to be, if the majority of the people in the UK rise up against them, and their twisted version of democracy.
The snowflakes seem to support the EU`s tactic of making people vote again, and again, until the people come up with the result that the EU want. and if people think that that is democracy, it is clear they don't have a clue about what democracy actually means.
Not sure what snowflakes, surely one of nature's most beautiful creations, has to do with democracy, but these people are exercising their democratic right to protest. That's what it is all about. Whilst I have no more idea of the protesters' politics or reasons for attending, the main message they seem to be putting over is that they do not support Trump's attitude towards women. NO! democracy is where each eligible person is given an equal vote, the votes are counted and the party which achieved the most votes has their position put in place. What is NOT democratic is for the losing side to carry out these pointless protests, or try to overturn the results of the majority vote, using any means they can find.
If as it seems, the snowflakes don't want to accept the results of both Trumps election, and the UK vote to leave the EU, they should not then be surprised in the event of them winning whatever the next election / EU vote happens to be, if the majority of the people in the UK rise up against them, and their twisted version of democracy.
The snowflakes seem to support the EU`s tactic of making people vote again, and again, until the people come up with the result that the EU want. and if people think that that is democracy, it is clear they don't have a clue about what democracy actually means.
They are entitled to do so. They are trying to do something rather than sitting back, doing nothing apart from moan. Good on them. Perhaps Trump will think (OK, so unlikely, perhaps his advisers will keep him on a tighter lead) before endorsing such a negative view of women.
Voting someone in as president does not mean you endorse all his beliefs. Obviously not. Democracy allows people to object to some of those beliefs.
You don't want them to demonstrate. Luckily, they don't need your permission. Democracy is not only about voting.
I think there should be proportionate coverage of protests- as the media are often guilty of making these non events, events.
So in America, with its population of 318,000,000 Million people. If 'only' half a million turn up to protest in Washington (as did yesterday) then the press should cover it accordingly.
Instead we have headlines everywhere giving the impression that 50% of America and the world is in protest against Trump, when in reality most people are waiting to see how he does.
So in America, with its population of 318,000,000 Million people. If 'only' half a million turn up to protest in Washington (as did yesterday) then the press should cover it accordingly.
Instead we have headlines everywhere giving the impression that 50% of America and the world is in protest against Trump, when in reality most people are waiting to see how he does.
Derek Smith said:
Pan Pan Pan said:
A Guardian reporter on the Andrew Marr show stated that the protests following Trumps inauguration were ` What democracy is all about!'
NO! democracy is where each eligible person is given an equal vote, the votes are counted and the party which achieved the most votes has their position put in place. What is NOT democratic is for the losing side to carry out these pointless protests, or try to overturn the results of the majority vote, using any means they can find.
If as it seems, the snowflakes don't want to accept the results of both Trumps election, and the UK vote to leave the EU, they should not then be surprised in the event of them winning whatever the next election / EU vote happens to be, if the majority of the people in the UK rise up against them, and their twisted version of democracy.
The snowflakes seem to support the EU`s tactic of making people vote again, and again, until the people come up with the result that the EU want. and if people think that that is democracy, it is clear they don't have a clue about what democracy actually means.
Not sure what snowflakes, surely one of nature's most beautiful creations, has to do with democracy, but these people are exercising their democratic right to protest. That's what it is all about. Whilst I have no more idea of the protesters' politics or reasons for attending, the main message they seem to be putting over is that they do not support Trump's attitude towards women. NO! democracy is where each eligible person is given an equal vote, the votes are counted and the party which achieved the most votes has their position put in place. What is NOT democratic is for the losing side to carry out these pointless protests, or try to overturn the results of the majority vote, using any means they can find.
If as it seems, the snowflakes don't want to accept the results of both Trumps election, and the UK vote to leave the EU, they should not then be surprised in the event of them winning whatever the next election / EU vote happens to be, if the majority of the people in the UK rise up against them, and their twisted version of democracy.
The snowflakes seem to support the EU`s tactic of making people vote again, and again, until the people come up with the result that the EU want. and if people think that that is democracy, it is clear they don't have a clue about what democracy actually means.
They are entitled to do so. They are trying to do something rather than sitting back, doing nothing apart from moan. Good on them. Perhaps Trump will think (OK, so unlikely, perhaps his advisers will keep him on a tighter lead) before endorsing such a negative view of women.
Voting someone in as president does not mean you endorse all his beliefs. Obviously not. Democracy allows people to object to some of those beliefs.
You don't want them to demonstrate. Luckily, they don't need your permission. Democracy is not only about voting.
No. democracy is where each eligible person, man or women, is given the right to vote, and does so based on their beliefs and view point. Trumps position on Women was known before the vote were taken. If their view point had been in the majority Trump would not have won. The problem with women's rights is that they don't want balance. If the overall balance between men's and woman's rights had been way out of balance it would have been dealt with centuries ago. Like in so many facets of life it is a swings and roundabouts situation, but women don't want balance, and seem to want the swing or roundabout to favour their side only.
There are many things that both men and women can, and cannot do, which are necessarily done by the gender best suited to that activity.
Why is it, in divorce cases for example that even where it was the woman who broke up the marriage, it is the man who has to leave the family home, and live in a bedsit, whilst still paying for that home and all in it? Is that fair? yet we don't see men parading down the streets in rally's protesting that their rights are not being upheld. There is something decidedly un balanced about women's rights protest marches.
Pan Pan Pan said:
No. democracy is where each eligible person, man or women, is given the right to vote, and does so based on their beliefs and view point. Trumps position on Women was known before the vote were taken. If their view point had been in the majority Trump would not have won. The problem with women's rights is that they don't want balance. If the overall balance between men's and woman's rights had been way out of balance it would have been dealt with centuries ago. Like in so many facets of life it is a swings and roundabouts situation, but women don't want balance, and seem to want the swing or roundabout to favour their side only.
There are many things that both men and women can, and cannot do, which are necessarily done by the gender best suited to that activity.
Why is it, in divorce cases for example that even where it was the woman who broke up the marriage, it is the man who has to leave the family home, and live in a bedsit, whilst still paying for that home and all in it? Is that fair? yet we don't see men parading down the streets in rally's protesting that their rights are not being upheld. There is something decidedly un balanced about women's rights protest marches.
In the same way, women can demonstrate against the sexist attitude of the president. I fully support their right to do so.
Your post is rather sexist. You have a right to post such opinions and I fully support your right to do so, although I would also support Haymarket's right to delete such posts.
You appear to be making the assumption that as Trump is president he can do what he wants, a sort of divine, or at least state enabled, right. This is not correct. The procedures in the way the USA is governed means that he is limited. In two years time the voting system might mean he could be limited even more. I fully support the USA's electorate right to vote in a way that will limit his authority.
All the demonstrators appear to be doing is to exercise their rights in a democratic country. I fully support their right to do so. You seem to want to limit their rights. It is your right to believe this, but it is undemocratic.
Pan Pan Pan said:
No. democracy is where each eligible person, man or women, is given the right to vote, and does so based on their beliefs and view point. Trumps position on Women was known before the vote were taken. If their view point had been in the majority Trump would not have won. The problem with women's rights is that they don't want balance. If the overall balance between men's and woman's rights had been way out of balance it would have been dealt with centuries ago. Like in so many facets of life it is a swings and roundabouts situation, but women don't want balance, and seem to want the swing or roundabout to favour their side only.
There are many things that both men and women can, and cannot do, which are necessarily done by the gender best suited to that activity.
Why is it, in divorce cases for example that even where it was the woman who broke up the marriage, it is the man who has to leave the family home, and live in a bedsit, whilst still paying for that home and all in it? Is that fair? yet we don't see men parading down the streets in rally's protesting that their rights are not being upheld. There is something decidedly un balanced about women's rights protest marches.
Randy Winkman said:
hyphen said:
So in America, with its population of 318,000,000 Million people. If 'only' half a million turn up to protest in Washington (as did yesterday) then the press should cover it accordingly.
Half a million is a massive protest isn't it?
jjlynn27 said:
It's not 'the fact'. It's something that you made up.
Why make something up and try to pass it on as a fact? Bizzare.
Seems very similar to our first past the post system to me. What was the SNP vote in the last election compared to UKIP? I can't recall the figures, but the SNP won 50 odd seats & UKIP, with more actual votes.....Why make something up and try to pass it on as a fact? Bizzare.
Edited by jjlynn27 on Sunday 22 January 09:29
There are umpteen democratic election systems in the world, none seem perfect, but what do we want? Dictators? Banana republics?
Hoofy said:
Ha. Well, indeed, if you had an issue with something in the UK, you can set up a poll and just need 100k signatures to get parliament to at least debate it (or something like that). Far more effective than walking about London.
Don't think it's any more effective. I've not followed many but all the responses to petitions that I've seen have been a patronising 'Mother knows best' reply.Still, it's far easier than walking about London...
Biker 1 said:
Seems very similar to our first past the post system to me...
I saw the Jon Snow,Michael Moore interview yesterday where Moore was bleating on about majority not having voted for Trump, and was surprised Jon Snow didn't say this.
At the end of the day, the rules are set out before an election and so accepted by all parties who enter it. Change the rules rather than crying over it.
eccles said:
Randy Winkman said:
hyphen said:
So in America, with its population of 318,000,000 Million people. If 'only' half a million turn up to protest in Washington (as did yesterday) then the press should cover it accordingly.
Half a million is a massive protest isn't it?Most of the rest just turned up to hear them sing for free, and the free photo op.
A bit 'Woodstockian'; get a photo of the event, hang it on your wall, and tell people "I woz here".
US protesters may convince the Republican members of the Senate and House of Representatives to consider carefully when they vote on anything Trumpian in nature, but I imagine most of them were already quite aware that a certain care must be taken if they value their future.
As for protests around the world against Trump; just hot air into the vacuum of space.
Pointless to focus all that anger and hatred on one person who's powers are after all limited.
Pan Pan Pan said:
A Guardian reporter on the Andrew Marr show stated that the protests following Trumps inauguration were ` What democracy is all about!'
NO! democracy is where each eligible person is given an equal vote, the votes are counted and the party which achieved the most votes has their position put in place. What is NOT democratic is for the losing side to carry out these pointless protests, or try to overturn the results of the majority vote, using any means they can find.
You have an odd concept of democracy. NO! democracy is where each eligible person is given an equal vote, the votes are counted and the party which achieved the most votes has their position put in place. What is NOT democratic is for the losing side to carry out these pointless protests, or try to overturn the results of the majority vote, using any means they can find.
There are countries in which there is a vote and after the vote all opposition to the vote is crushed.
Fortunately we do not live in a country like that. We have a democracy that respects both a person's right to vote and their right to protest.
Pan Pan Pan said:
If as it seems, the snowflakes
Pan Pan Pan said:
The problem with women's rights is that they don't want balance. If the overall balance between men's and woman's rights had been way out of balance it would have been dealt with centuries ago. Like in so many facets of life it is a swings and roundabouts situation, but women don't want balance, and seem to want the swing or roundabout to favour their side only.
There are many things that both men and women can, and cannot do, which are necessarily done by the gender best suited to that activity.
Why is it, in divorce cases for example that even where it was the woman who broke up the marriage, it is the man who has to leave the family home, and live in a bedsit, whilst still paying for that home and all in it? Is that fair? yet we don't see men parading down the streets in rally's protesting that their rights are not being upheld. There is something decidedly un balanced about women's rights protest marches.
For someone with such an obvious chip on their shoulder it's amazing that you've never seen a fathers4justice protest. There are many things that both men and women can, and cannot do, which are necessarily done by the gender best suited to that activity.
Why is it, in divorce cases for example that even where it was the woman who broke up the marriage, it is the man who has to leave the family home, and live in a bedsit, whilst still paying for that home and all in it? Is that fair? yet we don't see men parading down the streets in rally's protesting that their rights are not being upheld. There is something decidedly un balanced about women's rights protest marches.
Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff