Article 50 ruling due now
Discussion
turbobloke said:
Mrs TB is the only person who's never wrong,
Except for that time when she told you about something she'd heard on R4 or local radio, and you came on here trotting it out as gospel. Which, regrettably, it wasn't. And did you get horse whipped for it!
Poor Mrs TB. The lecture she must have had to endure after that must have been hideous. Not least for the number of adjectives.
Funkycoldribena said:
Greg66 said:
Funkycoldribena said:
I thought
I doubt that. Have a break,you'll feel much better.
FN2TypeR said:
Vipers said:
Unless I have it wrong, didnt Corbyn rant on in Parliament about the petition to ban Trump, and the PM should listen to the public, yet when the public voted to leave the EU, he voted against it?
Yes, you're wrong.Edited by Vipers on Thursday 2nd February 13:48
FN2TypeR said:
White Paper states that the UK Parliament was sovereign throughout the UK's EU membership, but didn't *feel* like that sometimes.Well.
How does that make you feel if you voted Leave in order to take back sovereignty? Like you're either monumentally thick, ignorant or utterly stitched up seem to be the options. Take your pick.
SilverSixer said:
FN2TypeR said:
White Paper states that the UK Parliament was sovereign throughout the UK's EU membership, but didn't *feel* like that sometimes.Well.
How does that make you feel if you voted Leave in order to take back sovereignty?
Various contributory factors were in play including having more not total control over more not all decisions in more not all policy areas.
Interesting comment though in that on certain gov't dept websites it speaks of policy deferring to the current policy on EU sites. Is that the feelbad factor?
turbobloke said:
SilverSixer said:
FN2TypeR said:
White Paper states that the UK Parliament was sovereign throughout the UK's EU membership, but didn't *feel* like that sometimes.Well.
How does that make you feel if you voted Leave in order to take back sovereignty?
SilverSixer said:
turbobloke said:
SilverSixer said:
FN2TypeR said:
White Paper states that the UK Parliament was sovereign throughout the UK's EU membership, but didn't *feel* like that sometimes.Well.
How does that make you feel if you voted Leave in order to take back sovereignty?
Funkycoldribena said:
SilverSixer said:
turbobloke said:
SilverSixer said:
FN2TypeR said:
White Paper states that the UK Parliament was sovereign throughout the UK's EU membership, but didn't *feel* like that sometimes.Well.
How does that make you feel if you voted Leave in order to take back sovereignty?
I wonder why?
SilverSixer said:
turbobloke said:
SilverSixer said:
FN2TypeR said:
White Paper states that the UK Parliament was sovereign throughout the UK's EU membership, but didn't *feel* like that sometimes.Well.
How does that make you feel if you voted Leave in order to take back sovereignty?
Good job we had a chance to vote on things before that sovereignty was further eroded to beyond the point where we had no choice.
ETA: I must read the white paper soon if that's the best point of contention you could glean from it.
Edited by Piersman2 on Thursday 2nd February 14:10
Article 50 will happen, the question is what happens next.
The government want to go into the negotiations with a free hand then come back with a take it or leave it vote in Parliament. They know there will be massive pressure not to vote against because the alternative would be seen as worse for the country...so they expect whatever deal is struck to be waved through.
The others, mostly labour but some Tories, want to be able to have a vote earlier in the process and send the government back to the negotiating table if they don't like what they see, or even call the whole thing off. The problem with this is that it puts the government in a terrible negotiating position before they go in. The EU will have no motivation to propose a reasonable deal as they know a terrible deal will be voted down in Parliament and the exit could be scuppered.
What should happen, and I know it won't, would be for the government to assemble a cross-party negotiating team from representatives across the parties who negotiate behind closed doors. This would give the country the strongest position to get the best deal, and have the best chance of it being accepted across Parliament and the country.
I'm a realist though. There is no chance our Politicians can put party politics to one side for the good of the country at this important point in our history. Shame.
The government want to go into the negotiations with a free hand then come back with a take it or leave it vote in Parliament. They know there will be massive pressure not to vote against because the alternative would be seen as worse for the country...so they expect whatever deal is struck to be waved through.
The others, mostly labour but some Tories, want to be able to have a vote earlier in the process and send the government back to the negotiating table if they don't like what they see, or even call the whole thing off. The problem with this is that it puts the government in a terrible negotiating position before they go in. The EU will have no motivation to propose a reasonable deal as they know a terrible deal will be voted down in Parliament and the exit could be scuppered.
What should happen, and I know it won't, would be for the government to assemble a cross-party negotiating team from representatives across the parties who negotiate behind closed doors. This would give the country the strongest position to get the best deal, and have the best chance of it being accepted across Parliament and the country.
I'm a realist though. There is no chance our Politicians can put party politics to one side for the good of the country at this important point in our history. Shame.
I was pretty impressed by the turnout and the majority result.
I had thought there would have been a lot more dissent from all sides, but seems to be pretty well supported (though clearly under duress from the chief whips).
It will be difficult to argue when the due process, dictated and clarified by the Supreme Court, after a public referendum then endorsed and cemented by a vote in parliament. I wonder what if any groundse for appeal there can be now?
You can't fail to be impressed by the speed this has been turned around. I was thinking that a Supreme court ruling, then debate and vote in Parliament would take months and months. This was wrapped up in a few weeks. And in the process, a little bonus, Scotland and NI get locked out of the decision.
Some great manoevering. Now it's on to Brussels which is a whole different ball game....
I had thought there would have been a lot more dissent from all sides, but seems to be pretty well supported (though clearly under duress from the chief whips).
It will be difficult to argue when the due process, dictated and clarified by the Supreme Court, after a public referendum then endorsed and cemented by a vote in parliament. I wonder what if any groundse for appeal there can be now?
You can't fail to be impressed by the speed this has been turned around. I was thinking that a Supreme court ruling, then debate and vote in Parliament would take months and months. This was wrapped up in a few weeks. And in the process, a little bonus, Scotland and NI get locked out of the decision.
Some great manoevering. Now it's on to Brussels which is a whole different ball game....
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