Article 50 ruling due now

[FN2TypeR]

The UK signed the Maastricht Treaty 25 years ago today.

[FiF]

hornetrider said:

danny0001uk1 said:

The latest vote suggests it will be a take it or leave it deal on offer when we leave.

Either accept the deal with the EU May negotiates or leave on wto rules.

That's what I understand it to be. Which basically means it's meaningless. Which is all good from my perspective.

It's a high stakes game. If as an MP who basically wanted Remain, but was offered two Leave options, one of which you'd argued long and hard would be a complete disaster for the nation's future, why would you then vote for that option? Just to spite the Government? Just to screw your own electorate over for the privilege of being able to say "see told you it would be a disaster, and that's why I voted for it... Oh!"

[confused_buyer]

The Government will be pleased with this so far in that it is going the way anyone could have broadly expected on the back of an envelope, namely that the number of Tory rebels is easily outbalanced by 7-10 DUP/UUP, 1xUKIP and 6-7 "hard core" Labour Leavers.

There is question over the granting rights to EU Nationals amendment which might be tighter but on the whole there have been no great surprises and they're going to get the Bill through with no or few amendments.

(BTW you have to admire the LibDems who on the substantive vote last week couldn't even whip 9 MPs to all vote the same way!).

[alfie2244]

Just had a quick look..............Scots are whingeing lots

[Einion Yrth]

alfie2244 said:

Just had a quick look..............Scots are whingeing lots

This really isn't news.

[Jonesy23]

The SNP busy trying to filibuster is more than a little pathetic to watch.

[turbobloke]

hornetrider said:

turbobloke said:

markcoznottz said:

Some comedy gold today, Alex salmond nearly getting offered outside, Anna Soubery almost crying or is that drunk.

Is this on Beeb iPlayer or similar?! I'd consider watching some non-live BBC output for that. It sounds very entertaining.

Yer tis.

https://youtu.be/refr7VDQe1E

Thanks - priceless!

Salmond was in danger of concussing himself with those jowls and chins flobbing around. Blood pressure must have been impressive, in a bad way.

[turbobloke]

Amendment lost.

[johnxjsc1985]

Jonesy23 said:

The SNP busy trying to filibuster is more than a little pathetic to watch.

thought this was a sexual reference to the widow crankie

[Deptford Draylons]

Great news. We've had a year of failed remainer doom and gloom predictions at every single stage, let's just get on with it and hope that by the time article 50 is triggered, there is only Tim Farron and ///ajd left to be the Hiroo Onoda of the remain campaign.

[turbobloke]

Government passes moment of maximum danger:

https://www.channel4.com/news/by/gary-gibbon/blogs...

[Andy Zarse]

Remainers being played like fiddles; quite funny but sad to see such fine, noble and principled democrats looking so foolish.

[Deptford Draylons]

25 years ago today the Maastricht treaty was signed.

[Andy Zarse]

Deptford Draylons said:

25 years ago today the Maastricht treaty was signed.

Complete with John Major's famous opt-outs... they weren't enough, or were overturned by Blair, so the UK will be shortly exercising the ultimate opt-out.

I always consider it a shame Major didn't go to the country in an In/Out referendum in 1992/3. We've had twenty five years of squabbling, both internally and with our European neighbours, ever since.

[Mark Benson]

turbobloke said:

hornetrider said:

turbobloke said:

markcoznottz said:

Some comedy gold today, Alex salmond nearly getting offered outside, Anna Soubery almost crying or is that drunk.

Is this on Beeb iPlayer or similar?! I'd consider watching some non-live BBC output for that. It sounds very entertaining.

Yer tis.

https://youtu.be/refr7VDQe1E

Thanks - priceless!

Salmond was in danger of concussing himself with those jowls and chins flobbing around. Blood pressure must have been impressive, in a bad way.

SNP painting themselves as downtrodden and treated unfairly by Westminster when if anything they get more time than they deserve. Lindsay Hoyle has the patience of a saint dealing with them (and makes Bercow look even more of a clown).

[Murph7355]

Mark Benson said:

...and makes Bercow look even more of a clown...

Is that even possible? He does an exemplary job himself!!

[alfie2244]

Andy Zarse said:

Deptford Draylons said:

25 years ago today the Maastricht treaty was signed.

Complete with John Major's famous opt-outs... they weren't enough, or were overturned by Blair, so the UK will be shortly exercising the ultimate opt-out.

I always consider it a shame Major didn't go to the country in an In/Out referendum in 1992/3. We've had twenty five years of squabbling, both internally and with our European neighbours, ever since.

He would have if not for those Eurosceptic bds.

[CrutyRammers]

IroningMan said:

Amateurish said:

Gargamel said:

Or being overuled by the ECHR, IE British Courts having decisions overturned at ECHR - Abu Qatada sprinds to mind

The Crown wanted him deported to Jordan, he went to ECHR won and was awarded costs !

Our Parliamentary and Judicial sovereignty were thereby diminished.

The ECHR is not the EU. We are not currently leaving the ECHR.

The ECHR never impinged on the Sovereignty of the UK.

Another small issue misgrasped by some Leave voters, I suspect. They're expecting an end to all that ECHR nonsense.

Or too complex for some Remainers.
Membership of the ECHR is a requirement of membership of the EU.
Leaving the EU therefore makes it possible to leave the ECHR, when it was not before.

[anonymous-user]

CrutyRammers said:

Or too complex for some Remainers.
Membership of the ECHR is a requirement of membership of the EU.
Leaving the EU therefore makes it possible to leave the ECHR, when it was not before.

The ECHR is part of the Council of Europe, which we helped set up in 1949.

Our membership of the EU is nothing to do with our membership of the ECHR or our adherence to decisions of the ECHR.

So why post Brexit would we leave it?

[D-Angle]

Greg66 said:

The ECHR is part of the Council of Europe, which we helped set up in 1949.

Our membership of the EU is nothing to do with our membership of the ECHR or our adherence to decisions of the ECHR.

So why post Brexit would we leave it?

May has proffered the idea of withdrawal from the ECHR more than once when she was Home Secretary, it's reasonable to speculate that she may raise it again. Probably after the next general election if I were to guess.

I understand the idea is to replace it with a UK Human Rights Act, which to me seems more restrictive on the Government than the current set-up, unless I'm missing something.