Scottish Referendum / Independence - Vol 8
Discussion
PurpleMoonlight said:
Sway said:
It would be undemocratic for a party to claim a parliament has made such a request without having tabled a motion that has been passed by that parliament.
She has no mandate to make the request as First Minister.
That wasn't my point.She has no mandate to make the request as First Minister.
Scotland democratically voted to remain part of the UK.
The UK democratically voted to leave the EU.
Sturgeon wants to ignore both.
drab1 said:
In the build up to the first once in a generation vote, I posted on here (using an older account) about how i was going to vote yes. My reasoning was something along the lines of "yes it will probably not be good for Scotland but at least we'll stand / fall on our own two feet". By the time the day to vote arrived i wasn't quite sure about it, and ended up declining to vote as neither side had put forward a coherent argument.
This time, they could wheel out Einstein and Plato as the yes figureheads and I'd still vote to stay just out of principle. I'm ashamed that there's still people in this country who believe another referendum can possibly be the right thing to do. I sincerely hope the majority of my fellow Scots realise the UK has more pressing issues to deal with just now than this nonsense.
Surely Jason would want Knockhill to remain part of the BTCC This time, they could wheel out Einstein and Plato as the yes figureheads and I'd still vote to stay just out of principle. I'm ashamed that there's still people in this country who believe another referendum can possibly be the right thing to do. I sincerely hope the majority of my fellow Scots realise the UK has more pressing issues to deal with just now than this nonsense.
I can't believe anyone looking at the facts could vote Yes again but so many Bats are blinded by"Feeeeeduuuuurrrrmmmm"
Maybe this was covered in the last 7 volumes ( sorry, haven't checked) but have the snp put forward any analysis as to how Scotland will be stronger as a smallish country outside the EU?
On the basis an independence yes vote tomorrow couldn't enable them stay in the EU?
Their slogan should be "stronger for Scottish national party career prospects, as for Scotland, who knows"
Ian
On the basis an independence yes vote tomorrow couldn't enable them stay in the EU?
Their slogan should be "stronger for Scottish national party career prospects, as for Scotland, who knows"
Ian
Ian Geary said:
Maybe this was covered in the last 7 volumes ( sorry, haven't checked) but have the snp put forward any analysis as to how Scotland will be stronger as a smallish country outside the EU?
On the basis an independence yes vote tomorrow couldn't enable them stay in the EU?
Their slogan should be "stronger for Scottish national party career prospects, as for Scotland, who knows"
Ian
To answer your question, the SNP will point to, in no particular order:On the basis an independence yes vote tomorrow couldn't enable them stay in the EU?
Their slogan should be "stronger for Scottish national party career prospects, as for Scotland, who knows"
Ian
Thatcher
Squirrels
Norway
Thatcher.
It's my personal view that they know independence will never happen, but they must ensure it is a sufficiently viable carrot in the minds of their voters. As you point out - it's good for their career prospects.
danllama said:
If stodgy Sturgeon was to say, have a fatal accident or disappear, do we think this issue would go away for a generation at least? Or is there someone waiting to carry the torch?
There always has to be one lump of s
t on the very top of the large pile of st. Or some other Russian proverb.
As the SNP don't have a majority in the Scottish Parliament and the Scottish Parliament haven't voted on a new referendum it is odd that Sturgeon is calling May's response undemocratic.
If the SNP believe that the delay of another referendum vote is undemocratic they could act by withdrawing their MPs from Westminster on a matter of principle (as Sinn Fein do) and call a vote to dissolve the Scottish Parliament (they would need a 2/3 majority but I would imagine the opposition parties would fancy their chances) and call an election to confirm their mandate by seeking an outright majority.
Chances of that happening? 0 I would guess.
Much better for the SNP (and I don't mean the Scottish people) complain loudly for another few years.
If the SNP believe that the delay of another referendum vote is undemocratic they could act by withdrawing their MPs from Westminster on a matter of principle (as Sinn Fein do) and call a vote to dissolve the Scottish Parliament (they would need a 2/3 majority but I would imagine the opposition parties would fancy their chances) and call an election to confirm their mandate by seeking an outright majority.
Chances of that happening? 0 I would guess.
Much better for the SNP (and I don't mean the Scottish people) complain loudly for another few years.
It appears that Sturgeon only wants to use the EU form of democracy, where people must be forced to hold vote, after vote, until the people come up with the answer that Sturgeon wants to see. For her, no other democratic result is acceptable. On that basis it seems as though she probably would fit in quite nicely with the EU view and mindset of what `they' mean by democracy.
The irony is that if the referendum on Scottish independence had been a UK wide referendum like the vote to leave the EU was, it is quite possible that she would have got her wish, as there are many in the rest of the UK who have had enough of what she believes is democracy, and would be glad to see the back of her.
Like our relationship with the Europe, and the EU, it is not the countries of Europe the UK wants to leave, it is the corrupt, unfair, self serving, over regulating, failing, money grasping, creeping monster that the EU has morphed into, and its corrupt ruling elite in Brussels that the UK wants to get away from as soon as possible.
The irony is that if the referendum on Scottish independence had been a UK wide referendum like the vote to leave the EU was, it is quite possible that she would have got her wish, as there are many in the rest of the UK who have had enough of what she believes is democracy, and would be glad to see the back of her.
Like our relationship with the Europe, and the EU, it is not the countries of Europe the UK wants to leave, it is the corrupt, unfair, self serving, over regulating, failing, money grasping, creeping monster that the EU has morphed into, and its corrupt ruling elite in Brussels that the UK wants to get away from as soon as possible.
Pan Pan Pan said:
It appears that Sturgeon only wants to use the EU form of democracy, where people must be forced to hold vote, after vote, until the people come up with the answer that Sturgeon wants to see. For her, no other democratic result is acceptable. On that basis it seems as though she probably would fit in quite nicely with the EU view and mindset of what `they' mean by democracy.
The irony is that if the referendum on Scottish independence had been a UK wide referendum like the vote to leave the EU was, it is quite possible that she would have got her wish, as there are many in the rest of the UK who have had enough of what she believes is democracy, and would be glad to see the back of her.
Like our relationship with the Europe, and the EU, it is not the countries of Europe the UK wants to leave, it is the corrupt, unfair, self serving, over regulating, failing, money grasping, creeping monster that the EU has morphed into, and its corrupt ruling elite in Brussels that the UK wants to get away from as soon as possible.
You read my mind. The irony is that if the referendum on Scottish independence had been a UK wide referendum like the vote to leave the EU was, it is quite possible that she would have got her wish, as there are many in the rest of the UK who have had enough of what she believes is democracy, and would be glad to see the back of her.
Like our relationship with the Europe, and the EU, it is not the countries of Europe the UK wants to leave, it is the corrupt, unfair, self serving, over regulating, failing, money grasping, creeping monster that the EU has morphed into, and its corrupt ruling elite in Brussels that the UK wants to get away from as soon as possible.
shouldn't men and women of high ideals and principles consider their position at Westminster an Establishment they wish to ultimately leave.
The SNP MP's are hypocrits wanting Independence but happy to sit on what they see as a foreign powers Parliament.
The silent majority gave their verdict on the Union and it was an opportunity for a generation I hope May will not give in to the bull and bluster of Strugeon as it will be amusing to see her become more angry and more red-faced as she doesn't get her own way. Meanwhile the only thing Strugeon can summon up to aggravate the Conservatives is to use name Thatcher once again.
The SNP MP's are hypocrits wanting Independence but happy to sit on what they see as a foreign powers Parliament.
The silent majority gave their verdict on the Union and it was an opportunity for a generation I hope May will not give in to the bull and bluster of Strugeon as it will be amusing to see her become more angry and more red-faced as she doesn't get her own way. Meanwhile the only thing Strugeon can summon up to aggravate the Conservatives is to use name Thatcher once again.
Edited by johnxjsc1985 on Friday 17th March 09:12
You know what, the single most vexing aspect of this latest call for a referendum is that it's going to be all over the news media down here for the next god knows how many years as Wee Krankie continues shouting ever more loudly to herself and her little band of disciples.
Even though I do have some 'skin in the game' as the yanks would say, I am already sick to death of the lead item in every news related source being about Scottish independence and Sturgeon. Really, outside of Scotland no one gives much of a flying F.
And for this alone, I'm starting to hate the Scots just a little more every day!
Even though I do have some 'skin in the game' as the yanks would say, I am already sick to death of the lead item in every news related source being about Scottish independence and Sturgeon. Really, outside of Scotland no one gives much of a flying F.
And for this alone, I'm starting to hate the Scots just a little more every day!
amusingduck said:
I'm surprised at the amount of pro-Indy Scots on the internet who believe that Scotland will be "fast tracked" into the EU.
Why do they think the EU is so desperate for a newly formed net recipient that meets none of the entry criteria?!
Don't be surprised. There are also alot of pro-Indy Scots on the internet blaming the Barnett Formula for sucking all the cash out of Scotland.Why do they think the EU is so desperate for a newly formed net recipient that meets none of the entry criteria?!
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