997.1 running costs

[T7]

Getting nearer to when I can change cars and would love to take the giant leap of owning a 2005/2006 997. With a budget in place to realise the dream and having carried out some basic research in terms of insurance and tax, my only reservation is around the 'other' running costs. Some real horror stories around ims issues and engine re-builds costing circa £10k which with a wife who loves shoes / boots / bags and two young kids who attend 30 classes/ groups each week I'm afraid I would need to sell my appendix or a left sided limb. Local garage claim to charge £250/£600 for a service so what I really need to know is what it's like to really live with a 997 ie how reliable will an 12 year old Porsche with around 80k mikes be? The alternative is a 2013 640d which I know Will leave me with a tinge of regret (albeit a lovely car) every time I drive out of the driveway.

Really appreciate any advice.

[Andrew911]

Sounds like you have done some research around 997.1 engine reliability. Engine failure is rare but can occur with the Gen 1 997 - main problem is bore scoring (& some IMS problems also reported), resulting in engine failure. A well know indy I have used said they cross their fingers when they sell a 997.1. However, plenty of owners have had no problems at all. For peace of mind after buying a 997.1 I would take the trip to Hartech for them to put in their cylinder liners. Not cheap, but much cheaper than a replacement engine. Hartech have done extensive research on these engines. Another option would be to take out a Porsche warranty - but not sure if the car needs to have had a full main dealer service history.Alternatively, delay the dream until the budget can stretch to a Gen 2 997 - which has a DFI engine & seems to be relatively free of engine issues. I had a Gen 2 997 - lovely car, really enjoyed it. The beemer wouldn't satisfy you I'am guessing.

Edited by Andrew911 on Thursday 23 March 15:02

[anonymous-user]

£1200 a year for maintence sounds reasonable based on my 997.2 experience, a minor service on mine started at £600-700, add in a couple of belts, brake fluid change and 6 year maintence came to approx £1200. Add a couple of rear tyres to make £1800 within 6 months of buying the car.

Can snowball pretty quickly but these are OPC prices with a porsche warranty to maintain.

Worth pointing out that you can put the official porsche warranty on cars upto 15 years old or 125,000 miles.

[colnagoglyn]

I have owned my March 2005 997 for four and a half years. Since I bought it I have put 36000 on the clock so it's now done 80,000. I bought it from a respected independent and it came with a comprehensive service record and was in excellent condition.
Bore scoring and IMS issues to one side you can't get away from the fact that these cars are not cheap to run, particularly when you take into account age and mileage.

I have spent £9000 on my car in the last four and a half years on servicing and essential repairs/maintenance, Insurance and road tax.

That doesn't include "optional" items I have spent money on such as Tracker subs, Winter wheels and tyres, Roadside Assistance etc

Driving around 9000 miles a year I reckon my car costs me c£400 per month to run, all in but not including depreciation.

My point is that even though it's a twelve year old car worth about £20k, it still has the running costs of a new £80k car.
Having said all of that I don't regret it for a second, I have a well sorted iconic sports car that I intend to keep for at least another ten years and I love it.

I would buy one again in a heart beat, just make sure you always have a contingency fund available as you will surely need it.

Edited by colnagoglyn on Thursday 23 March 19:30

[13m]

gottans said:

Worth pointing out that you can put the official porsche warranty on cars upto 15 years old or 125,000 miles.

So in theory you could easily be running a Porsche with over 150k miles under warranty providing it isn't older than 15 years at the expiry of the warranty.

[colnagoglyn]

Thought it might be useful to provide further details,

Battery
Minor Service, Clutch,2xRadiator fans
4x Michelin PS2s
Water pump, coolant, 6x Coil Packs
Wiper Blades
Major Serv., plugs, brake fluid change, O/s heat shield
New steering arm joints and re alignment, Front Pads and Discs, 2x Air Con condensers, Drivers door window micro switch, glove box micro switch and loom, replace offside door membrane

Cost of the above £6900

4xRoad Tax £1100

4xInsurance £1000

[T7]

Thanks to all who have replied, really appreciate you taking the time to share your knowledge and experience. Have to say it was the news that I was dreading, possibly the reality of realising I've potentially been living in denial (oh that hurt!). Might need to go back to the drawing board, need something special for my next car, but would struggle with some of the figures being mentioned and take on board these are without anything major going wrong. Genuinely didn't think the costs would be that much higher than my 535d (ex fuel and tax), I've pretty much been out on average £400 per year over the last 3 year.

Thanks again to all

[YoungMD]

Well to offer another view I bought a 997.1 2005 a couple of years ago and it has cost me £200 per year for an oil service. I have done some work on it myself granted, and bought the parts from gsf but they have only come to another £200. Spark plugs, coil packs, and a couple of other things but all very easy and the parts are reasonable. The issue is that Indies charge £200-300 for doing anything extra and that quickly mounts up for simple stuff. The cars themselves are pretty sound, engine problems aside as discussed.....

[Discombobulate]

colnagoglyn said:

Thought it might be useful to provide further details,

Battery
Minor Service, Clutch,2xRadiator fans
4x Michelin PS2s
Water pump, coolant, 6x Coil Packs
Wiper Blades
Major Serv., plugs, brake fluid change, O/s heat shield
New steering arm joints and re alignment, Front Pads and Discs, 2x Air Con condensers, Drivers door window micro switch, glove box micro switch and loom, replace offside door membrane

Cost of the above £6900

4xRoad Tax £1100

4xInsurance £1000

And you are about to have to replace cooling pipes, exhaust fixings, tandem oil pump and possibly brake lines. Don't ask me how I know....

[Patrick Bateman]

On the shock absorber front, are there any good online sources that aren't extortionate?

The prices for the shocks on my lowly 2.7 Boxster seem bloody ridiculous- comparable to my M5 which was bloody ridiculous in itself with M tax but somewhat easier to stomach given the car and performance.

[Andrew911]

I have owned Porsche's for many years - a mix of 8-13 year old 911s & a couple of new Boxsters (S Gen 1 & 981 Spyder) - all have been daily drivers (only 5000 miles max a year). In all the years I have owned many Porsche's I have had very little go wrong. I do however buy my Porsche's from well respected indy's (apart from the two new Porsche's I have owned) - which do the similar 111 point check that OPCs do & have therefore been well prep'd & anything needing sorting gets sorted prior to purchase. I then typically change cars every 12-24 months on average. Apart from servicing costs at an indy I have hardly encountered any additional costs (the odd tyre). My 996 turbo had a spoiler problem which would have cost over a £1000 but was just within warranty. I have also lost (sometimes gained) very little in depreciation. So its not all doom & gloom. Key is buy sensibly - definitely from a respected Porsche Indy or if buying privately get the 111 point check down done at an OPC & get the seller to sort out any issues or use it to bargain etc.

[T7]

Thanks again and appreciate all your advice and it's definitely great food for thought particularly assessing what I would assume would be a reduced risk in getting the 111 point check and keeping for 2 years ,as naive as it certainly now feels, I hadn't considered this as an option before. Is the 111 point service from Porsche specialist or is this something that the AA and RAC do pre-purchase?
Thanks again to all

[jbaddeley]

I've just sourced a gen 1 997 S through OPC. They do come up and it was well prepped with quite a bit of work done prior to delivery. I paid a slight premium over most independent dealers but wanted the warranty with the known weak points of this engine. By the time the warranty runs out I'll comfortably be able to afford a good rebuild if necessary. The only downside is that I can't put the gt3 throttle body and plenum kit on and mod it, just yet. Absolutely loving it. Be patient and a good car in warranty or an OPC car will come up.

[skinny]

If you're worried just get a PPI.this will tell you what will need replacing in the next few years outside of your normal servicing costs and then you can make an informed decision.

I've put about £5k into my 996 but a lot of that was voluntary rather than essential. The actual basic servicing stuff would be a lot less. There's a lot of info out there about how much it costs for brakes, clutch, suspension, tyres, rads etc - i.e the consumables but not your basic service items. These are the costs that push your servicing up.

PPI will also pick up bore score which is the big concern on a 997.1 with the scary costs. Everything else is acceptable in my view but I'd struggle with £10k+ on the engine. Others are more OK to get it done as a fully Hartech'd engine is pretty much future proof. Its probably more justifiable on a £20k 997. Less so on a £10k 996

[RicM5]

Owned this 997.1 c2s for the last year 5000 miles, so far the total costs are £200 for a new battery from porsche Colchester last week who at the same time inspected the car which came back with a clean bill of health
On purchase I had the dealer send the car to porsche for a engine inspection which came back 100%
My advice would be hold off until you can afford the best serviced lowish mile/owner example you can find. You'll have less on going maintenance costs with a lower mile well looked after car although the initial outlay will be higher

[RicM5]

Previously owned by Spider-Man

[KPE]

RicM5 said:

Previously owned by Spider-Man

Or spider pig (aka pork, aka Porsche)

[T7]

Nice car and well chosen. Thanks for everyone's replies 👍

[Andrew911]

T7 said:

Thanks again and appreciate all your advice and it's definitely great food for thought particularly assessing what I would assume would be a reduced risk in getting the 111 point check and keeping for 2 years ,as naive as it certainly now feels, I hadn't considered this as an option before. Is the 111 point service from Porsche specialist or is this something that the AA and RAC do pre-purchase?
Thanks again to all

The 111 point check is a Porsche OPC thingy - but most respected indys do the same. The AA/RAC can do car inspections but won't be to the same level. A good indy will also do a PPI if you are buying privately etc.

[ELROR]

These are very reasonable cars to run if u buy a good one. I had a PPI on my 2006 C2S which revealed £3k of work @45k miles back in 2014. Purchase price factored into works needed. Now at 65k miles and have spent on average £1k per annum on rolling maintenance (brakes tyres suspension gen repairs) and servicing. Factor in £300 per year insurance and almost zero depreciation and I can't think of a car that is better value for smiles per mile. Do it!